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[INFJ] I'm hijacking some amazing musician/songwriters and putting them in the INFJ basket

Reverie

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It's another who's what MBTI wise thread.
I'm making cases to INFJ (verb) some awesome artists that I think are blatantly INFJ. :D
As criteria:
-Very complex structured albums with intricate well thought out framework.
-Mythical, archetypal, mystical themes and other telltale signs of Ni
-Goal orientedness
- Fe signs (pause in speech, animate face)
- Higher likelihood and a great love of concept albums. not just an album but very large scale projects with costume, multimedia, film, even movie (Kate Bush's Red Shoes)
- history of actual political activism or woven into the themes of records


Tori Amos
How could anyone think otherwise! Here's a snippet of her discussing in a very Fe like manner about her concept album based on 5 female archetypes and the political statement she's making
Tori Amos Interview 04.19.2007 - YouTube
P.J. Harvey
Very goal orientated and planned. Here she is discussing her anti war concept album.
PJ Harvey Video Interview Part One - YouTube
Florence Welch
Getting advice from a dead grandmother (Ni)
Florence and the Machine - Ceremonials - Track by track interview - YouTube
Kate Bush
YouTube
She's a one woman powerhouse who maintains creative control producing as well as songwriting.
Björk
Bjork Is Back - YouTube
Discussing her concept album biophilia.
 

CuriousFeeling

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I think Kate Bush is an INFP, actually. The way she writes, especially the sampling techniques in her albums 'Hounds of Love' and 'Never for Never', incorporates various seemingly unrelated sound samples, and she draws these external references to create another whole piece of work with a specific topic that links them. This is more of an Ne based process. Ni based songwriting is more conceptual/abstract train of thought, inner mental associations.

Even as an INFJ, I also identify with Kate's work. But I get more of a whimsical approach with her songwriting. INFJ feels a bit more internal and focused. Even with an object focus with samples of sounds, Ni paired with Fe tends to take on a very organized flow to the piece with Ni-Ti cataloging of such sounds, rhythms, harmony, production. Kate's music, while focused on concepts, it can also be traced to Ne, because Ne is also greatly conceptual as well. Taking in influences from film, costume, multimedia, it's in the external world, the direction of extroversion. Ni's basis of concepts would be something a bit more abstract, like a mood, feeling, journey, overarching idea/ plotline to represent something else besides what is being discussed. Ne is conceptual, but putting external influences together. :)

Could chalk up Andrew Bird as an INFJ songwriter/musician too. He comes across as focused and knowing what he wants in his music.
 

Reverie

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I can see your point . I still think she's INFJ though. ;)
Se actually collects information from the outside world of the senses: pictures, images, tangibles, fashion.
I think Kate Bush is the epitomy of focused. The amount of discipline and organization you need to work like she does is staggering.
I also think she's definitely an extroverted feeler. She's got animated facial expressions and is very responsive which I think points more to INFJ.
She also makes references to many religious and mystical concepts in her songs. Here's a blatant example:
http://youtu.be/MWaqPOnR5wU
 

CuriousFeeling

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If she really is an INFJ, I'd be quite happy to welcome her into the troupe... and it would explain why I connect with her work. ;)
 

iwakar

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I'd place Bjork as a Type 4w3 ISFP with strong tertiary Ni.
 

Reverie

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The reason I stuck her in the INFJs (though I did waffle between ENFJ and INFJ ) is really that the ISFPs (musicians) I know aren't so airy fairy or cryptic ;D and (this is observing the ones I know) look more like INFPs, i.e. are more like observers and not so out there in the mix. Björk's pretty rambunctious and super eccentric. The Ni love of metaphor, myth and symbology is definitely there with astrological reference. I haven't really met anyone with a strong tert Ni, but as is even aux Ni is less "falling down the rabbit hole" and more business suit in comparison.
 

INTP

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vouch and :wubbie: for pj harvey.

björk seems INFJ also from what i have seen, but i cant be sure since i havent listened to her music much and havent seen many interviews etc. also because its hard to tell whether her Ni comes from tert position, as art quite often does flow from more unconscious parts of psyche(but as im not so familiar with her music, i cant say if its her tert Ti and inferior Se painted with dom Ni).
 

Reverie

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I just kind of doubt the tertiary being so powerful... I'd love to think of myself as analytical and I do use my Ti in my process as I'm constantly trying to see to the essences of phenomena, but I think I'd get my butt kicked on many levels and contexts if I was to go challenge some Ti doms, like INTPs in their area of specialty :charge:
I think it propably wouldn't end well for me ;D :moodeath:
 

INTP

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I just kind of doubt the tertiary being so powerful... I'd love to think of myself as analytical and I do use my Ti in my process as I'm constantly trying to see to the essences of phenomena, but I think I'd get my butt kicked on many levels and contexts if I was to go challenge some Ti doms, like INTPs in their area of specialty :charge:
I think it propably wouldn't end well for me ;D :moodeath:


;)
From the living fountain of instinct flows everything that is creative; hence the unconscious is not merely conditioned by history, but is the very source of the creative impulse. -Carl Jung
 

INTP

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:D Unconscious all the time...

I dont quite get what you are trying to say(so i assume that you didnt fully get what i was trying to say, so ill explain), but the instincts and creative impulses come to consciousness from unconscious. Unconscious mind is guiding conscious mind via instincts and impulses, not just according to jung, but also according to freud and others(including many today).

This bringing stuff from the unconscious through art is what the healing power of art is based on. Also the reason why some art resonates with some people so heavily is that it creates sort of link between the artists unconscious mind and the audiences unconscious. William Rivers said this in his book instinct and the unconscious:

Each of the emotions can be regarded as an affective aspect of an instinctive reaction. Thus, fear is especially connected with the instinctive reaction to danger by flight; anger with the reaction to danger or injury by aggression; love with the parental and sexual instincts, etc., while the primary states of pleasure and pain are the psychical accompaniments of the fundamental reactions of attraction towards the useful and repulsion from the harmful. The primary feelings of pleasure and pain and all emotions, whether simple or complex, can be regarded as aspects of consciousness especially associated with instinct.

and this idea of emotions being tied to instinctive reactions arising from the unconsciousness, fits pretty nicely with the idea of what i said earlier and what jung said.

when you are creating art, you rely on your emotions in deciding what to do, what feels to be the correct shape for something or correct note next to another, or the melody of music you are making just flows to your conscious mind from somewhere.

the idea of art therapy(and sand play) is to bring things in the unconscious to conscious mind through the act of creating art.

it should be noted that inferior and tert functions can work as a gateways to unconscious mind. people often make the mistake of thinking that tert and inferior = unconscious mind, when in fact its just about those functions not being in control of the conscious mind, but react to unconscious impulses more(or work as a gateway for unconscious mind when something happens in external world that triggers something in the shadow).
 

Reverie

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[MENTION=7595]INTP[/MENTION] I got it. I was making a verbal pun. ;) The quote had subconscious--->unconscious--->Made me laugh because I thought of being knocked unconscious. Unconscious all the time= Paying attention to what's churning in my subconscious all the time. .... :D
I'm sorry. My mind actually works like a crazed squirrel all the time.
But yes... I think INFJs are very aware of that subconscious underground terrain or the ocean deep where all those monsters and strange creatures that don't see the light of day inhabit...our atavistic impulses, emotions etc. We look at where we are for the signs that signify their presence so to speak. Sometimes I feel I can see the signs of their stirrings well from specific cues.
And that is where I feel art is precisely the right tool to speaking directly with our collective "monsters" (like you said) in the language of metaphor and symbol and deal with them subconscious to subconscious. All of what I'm saying is strictly metaphorical.
That's why when I see some artists using the right tools and in large quantities I think "INFJ". :)
 

The Outsider

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Well aren't you guys just special.
 

INTP

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[MENTION=7595]INTP[/MENTION] I got it. I was making a verbal pun. ;) The quote had subconscious--->unconscious--->Made me laugh because I thought of being knocked unconscious. Unconscious all the time= Paying attention to what's churning in my subconscious all the time. .... :D
I'm sorry. My mind actually works like a crazed squirrel all the time.
But yes... I think INFJs are very aware of that subconscious underground terrain or the ocean deep where all those monsters and strange creatures that don't see the light of day inhabit...our atavistic impulses, emotions etc. We look at where we are for the signs that signify their presence so to speak. Sometimes I feel I can see the signs of their stirrings well from specific cues.
And that is where I feel art is precisely the right tool to speaking directly with our collective "monsters" (like you said) in the language of metaphor and symbol and deal with them subconscious to subconscious. All of what I'm saying is strictly metaphorical.
That's why when I see some artists using the right tools and in large quantities I think "INFJ". :)

okay, i didnt get the verbal pun, because:

subconscious wiki said:
The term subconscious is used in many different contexts and has no single or precise definition. This greatly limits its significance as a definition-bearing concept, and in consequence the word tends to be avoided in academic and scientific settings.

In everyday speech and popular writing, however, the term is very commonly encountered as a layperson's replacement for the unconscious mind.

Though laypersons commonly assume "subconscious" to be a psychoanalytic term, this is not in fact the case. Sigmund Freud had explicitly condemned the word as long ago as 1915: "We shall also be right in rejecting the term 'subconsciousness' as incorrect and misleading".[4] In later publications his objections were made clear:

"If someone talks of subconsciousness, I cannot tell whether he means the term topographically – to indicate something lying in the mind beneath consciousness – or qualitatively – to indicate another consciousness, a subterranean one, as it were. He is probably not clear about any of it. The only trustworthy antithesis is between conscious and unconscious."[5]

;)
 
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