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  1. #1
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    Default Is my lack of certainty about other people an indication that I'm not iNtuitive?

    I have to admit this is something I wonder about. There are so many INFJs, in particular, who seem quite certain about their insights into others. I mean, I've heard other types say stuff like this too, but the "I have never been wrong about anyone, ever" thing seems to be very INFJ.

    I tend to think that "I have never been wrong about anyone" is a necessarily unbalanced viewpoint and is more indicative of an inflated ego or over-confidence, than it's indicative of N vs S. However, even people I would consider more mature and balanced Ns often seem to say "when I feel a certain way, I'm never wrong about people's motives - even if it only happens sometimes", etc.

    I just don't relate to this a great deal. My personal opinion is that I am indeed an Ni user, but that I am also a 6 enneagram and that this makes me question myself and my insights all the time. I don't have enormous self-confidence about my insights into people. One of the things I am working on, actually, is trusting my gut instincts more readily. Also, hanging onto my first impressions of people, and paying more attention to those, instead of letting them get swept away on a tide of warm feelings when I get to know someone better. I am finding more and more that those very first impressions are usually accurate. But I doubt they are 100% accurate. And I think that both N and S types can have very accurate gut feelings. I also have the problem sometimes that I get very strong feelings about someone or something but I can't quite put my finger on WHAT those feelings are, or to what conclusion I should follow them.

    The area where I use Ni very freely (more consciously than I do in everyday life, perhaps) and am highly confident about it is in the aesthetic/cultural areas where I have some expertise. I've had a lot of confirmation in those areas, both from within myself and from others, that my insights, patterning and connection-drawing are unusually insightful and accurate (for what's that worth, as far as you can say "accurate" in the area of the arts.) But that's something different, to me. Other human beings are such wild cards. You can discern patterns of behaviour and trends and develop more understanding of how others act, or will act, based on those. But there seems to be an N tendency to think that Ns understand others better than others understand themselves. Sometimes true, perhaps...but nebulous at best.

    So does all this make me more of an S? Or am I just an SJ-like INFJ who doesn't take her own instincts too seriously, perhaps not seriously enough, sometimes...which is what I suspect.
    Last edited by SilkRoad; 04-13-2012 at 07:27 AM.
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  2. #2
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    I'd think it'd be weak "F" (be it Fi or Fe... just in different ways). It's why I stopped typing as one.

  3. #3
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    I'd think it'd be weak "F" (be it Fi or Fe... just in different ways). It's why I stopped typing as one.
    That is a very interesting perspective. Do you mean that strong F types are more likely to think that they "know it all" in regards to others?

    Thing is, I'm a very strong F, so it wouldn't apply in my case, I don't think. I have occasionally tested as E, or S, or P (not all together!!)...but never a T, not even once to my recollection, at least since I exited my teens or thereabouts.

    I'm very heavy on the F and I have actually tested more than once as an Fe-dom. I think my Fe is very strong in part due to being IxFJ but partly due to societal/community demands.


    EDIT: I should perhaps clarify that this isn't something to do with feeling I simply don't "get" people, or feeling I have lousy social skills, or anything like that. I really think that I relate to a lot of different kinds of people well, and I've certainly had independent feedback to that effect. I'm quite fascinated by people and I like to figure out what makes them tick and how I can get the best out of them, so to speak. I like facilitating human relationships so that everyone feels happier and so that there is a healthy environment for people to be individuals and to express themselves and so on, also without constantly treading on each other's toes.

    It's really just that I hardly ever feel I have some sort of magic radar for people. I seldom feel I have infallible instincts and that sort of thing. And it seems to be a common thread with N-aux and dom to feel that way.
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    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    this isnt about N, this is about a stereotype
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  5. #5
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    this isnt about N, this is about a stereotype
    Well, yeah. I can tell when people are either very unbalanced INFJs (not so sure about other intuitive types) or not INFJs at all, because they're doing the streotypical "I AM AN INFALLIBLE PSYCHIC" thing.

    It's just that I seem to have EVEN LESS of that tendency that N types who I genuinely find to be very balanced and realistic about themselves. And I didn't exactly want to say "well, this plainly just makes me a super-balanced and realistic INFJ."

    I really think the e6 makes me question and second-guess everything and that has a lot to do with it too. It's kind of good and bad in that regard.
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  6. #6
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilkRoad View Post
    That is a very interesting perspective. Do you mean that strong F types are more likely to think that they "know it all" in regards to others?
    Fair enough. I was just tossing it out there, from my pov. I don't think strong F types know it all, but I think F is kind of a "people oriented" attitude. Even Fi, which sometimes gets defined as just a personal "values" function, is also a function with an eye on "humanity" too.. On what it should be, what ideas or expressions crystalize it, etc.. Fe is more environmental, but often amounts to the same thing.

  7. #7
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Fair enough. I was just tossing it out there, from my pov. I don't think strong F types know it all, but I can think F is kind of a "people oriented" function. Even Fi, which sometimes gets defined as a personal "values" function, is also a function with an eye on "humanity" too.. On what it should be, what ideas or expressions crystalize it, etc.. Fe is more environmental, but often amounts to the same thing.
    Yeah, definitely F is people oriented (depending on how selfish/unselfish the person is, it tends to either mean they're enraptured with themselves, or interested in others). I kind of thought that was what you were getting at. I guess T types might be more likely to throw up their hands and say "well, people/human issues aren't my strong point anyway, so..."
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  8. #8
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilkRoad View Post
    I guess T types might be more likely to throw up their hands and say "well, people/human issues aren't my strong point anyway, so..."
    Pretty much. I don't know how to address most of those things. Even if I say something, I'll change my mind anyways. I would say some TJs might do it better though. They have all kinds of ideals on how the world should work, but it's not the same as Fi dom/aux exactly.

    As for Fe type of relations, every once in awhile I get the bad idea of thinking I understand, trying to create some kind of "closeness", but then failing. Enough fails and you realize it's not your strong point. I also know it's not strong because it literally creates an out of body sensation.. I'm all screwed up trying to figure things out, if by chance someone holds my interest. I also know I can read things really badly and see offenses when there might not be any. And look like an ass because of it. So that all said, I'm not afraid of saying I don't know people anymore. lol

  9. #9
    Senior Member Santosha's Avatar
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    I have rarely heard my good INFJ friend air insights of what will occur. And this is how i distinguish Ni vs Ne.. What will it be vs what could it be. I think you are right to believe that e6 cp would continually doubt their own insights. It seems like I've noticed this doubting ones Ni in a few different threads for both ni doms and aux, but regardless of the doubting how often do you find yourself trying to see what something will be instead of what it is or has been?


    Si dom would pay more attention to the object, evaluating it and storing its impressions.
    Ni would pay less attention to the object itself, look for some kind of symbolic meaning and pattern through archetypes, I think.

    Consider how sensory focused you are...
    Man suffers only because he takes seriously what the gods made for fun - Watts

  10. #10
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huxley3112 View Post
    I have rarely heard my good INFJ friend air insights of what will occur. And this is how i distinguish Ni vs Ne.. What will it be vs what could it be. I think you are right to believe that e6 cp would continually doubt their own insights. It seems like I've noticed this doubting ones Ni in a few different threads for both ni doms and aux, but regardless of the doubting how often do you find yourself trying to see what something will be instead of what it is or has been?


    Si dom would pay more attention to the object, evaluating it and storing its impressions.
    Ni would pay less attention to the object itself, look for some kind of symbolic meaning and pattern through archetypes, I think.

    Consider how sensory focused you are...
    Yeah... I'm pretty future-oriented, especially in terms of worrying about things and possibilities. And symbols/patterns/archetypes mean a great deal to me.

    I am probably less afraid to make what I'd think of as leaps/assumptions (even if based on a lot of instinctive weight) when it comes to patterns based on my personal interests and fascinations, rather than thinking I know all about what other people are about or what other people will do. I'm a huge fan of meaningful coincidences...at the moment I keep seeing people reading George Orwell on the subway and it is freaking me out...it reminds me of a poem I was supposed to write...

    I really think that the e6 has done a lot to give me a somewhat different flavour of INFJ in this regard. I basically do think I'm INFJ and don't have much significant doubt about it. And I feel like I haven't expressed myself that well in this thread. It's obviously not that ALL Ni/Ne users are certain about other people and their motives. But I feel like I miss out on a lot of the "magical"/"click"/"just knowing" stuff which is supposed to come with Ni. At least, in terms of human relationships. I feel it a lot in terms of my personal fascinations/worldview etc. Like the meaningful coincidences everywhere - I can never decide if they're objectively meaningful or just because I want them to be.
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