[INFJ] Type 1 INFJ vs. Type 4 INFJ

[Cloud of Thunder]

It seems that Enneagram Types 1 and 4 are the most strongly correlated with the INFJ personality. Does anybody want to guess how these two "flavors" of the INFJ differ and how they are similar?

 

[Cloud of Thunder]

I think that the Type 1 INFJ would fall in line with the humanitarian portrait of the type, whereas the Type 4 INFJ would be more in tune with the rare and mysterious image. Obviously, the INFJ is multifaceted.

 

[Elfboy]

4
Prince: INFJ 4w3 Sx/Sp
Maria Callas: INFJ 4w3 Sx/Sp
Edgar Alan Poe: INFJ 4w5 ???

1
Ghandi: INFJ 1w2 So/Sx
Professor Xavier (X Men) : INFJ 1w9 So/Sx

 

[Elfboy]

It seems that Enneagram Types 1 and 4 are the most strongly correlated with the INFJ personality. Does anybody want to guess how these two "flavors" of the INFJ differ and how they are similar?

INFJs are likely to be 1, 4, 6 and 9 with a fair amount of 2s and occasional 8s

 

[luismas]

Elfboy,

Why do reckon Prince and Poe are INFJs? Many say the first is an ISFP and the second an INFP.

 

[Cloud of Thunder]

4
Prince: INFJ 4w3 Sx/Sp
Maria Callas: INFJ 4w3 Sx/Sp
Edgar Alan Poe: INFJ 4w5 ???

I can't see Poe being anything but Social-last.

 

[redacted]

1s seem to be wracked with guilt and shame a lot of the time. 4s seem more willing to accept aspects of themselves that would potentially be the source of those feelings.

 

[Elfboy]

I can't see Poe being anything but Social-last.

I actually thought he was self preservation last.

 

[EJCC]

I'm not sure if I know any INFJ 4s, but my mom is an INFJ 1w2 and she is the archetypal INFJ crusader. You know -- the person who yells at the TV whenever a particularly obnoxious pundit is on, calls people who disagree with her (on politics or morals) "idiots" behind their backs, goes to protest marches and peace rallies... and also nags nags nags to make sure everyone is doing things the way they should be done. Of course, to be fair, I see a lot of this behavior when she'd probably only show it to her close friends, since, being an INFJ, she doesn't want to cause any bad feelings by being polarizing. But then again -- she's a college professor, and she spent ten full minutes of a class one time raging about Twilight, how it sends really horrible messages to girls, and how Harry Potter succeeds in every way that Twilight fails. (I heard about this rant from one of my friends who takes her class!)

This isn't to say that all INFJ 1s are like that, since not all INFJ 1s care about politics. But I think they do seem a little more uptight than other INFJs. I had an INFJ roommate who may have been either a 4 or a 9w1 and she walked around with a dreamy smile on her face everywhere she went -- whereas INFJ 1s always look pretty focused, I've noticed. How can you not be, if you walk around noticing everything that's out of place, wherever you go? (And before you say I'm biased, I'm a 1w2 also and I know from experience!)

I would imagine that on the other hand, 4s would act like my mom did when she was a teenager: belligerently unique. Wearing a big metaphorical sign that says "I march to a different drummer". A lot more self-focused than an INFJ 1 would be, since INFJ 1s are so obsessed with everything that needs fixing in the world.

 

[iwakar]

^Your description sounds VERY much like me and I'm damn sure I'm a 4w5. Are you sure about your mother's enneatype?

 

[EJCC]

^Your description sounds VERY much like me and I'm damn sure I'm a 4w5. Are you sure about your mother's enneatype?

Well I made a typing thread about her a while ago and I think most people came to a consensus that she's a 1w2 (or 2w1)... but you can judge for yourself if you want.

That really all sounded like you? I didn't know 4s acted like that. Are you just really integrated into 1?

 

[iwakar]

I definitely identify as the crusader. I view my abusive childhood and violent family history as the catalyst for my homegrown courage and ferocity. I roll in and out of political activism as the causes may move me. I also plan on teaching at the college level if I can't hack it as a writer. I did not think this was exceptional among Type 4s.

I can relate to the 1, but I identify more with the 4.

 

[sulfit]

from here: Archetypes of Enneagram Types

Type 1: Pioneer, Settler, Wilderness Tamer, Dignified Civilizer, Tense Worker, Civic-minded Voter, Sober Citizen, Disciplined Perfectionist, Meticulous Worker, Fine Craftsman, Picayune Grammarian, Duty-bound Family Member, Responsible Person, Honorable Survivor, Detail-oriented Editor, Parsimonious Spender, Skinflint, Fiery Advocate, Angry Demonstrator, “Thorn in the Side”, Picketer, Protester, Ranting Reformer, Interrogator, Missionary, Pilgrim, Puritan, Rulemaker, Lawmaker, Judge, Fair Jurist, Priest, Pope, Spiritual Hierophant, Chief Justice, Religious Educator, Mother Superior, Chief Examiner, Exacting Auditor, Impartial Inquisitor


Type 4: Bohemian, Artisan, Craftsman, Imaginative Creator, Teller of Life Stories, Originator of New Forms, Gypsy, Wordsmith, Content Editor, Weaver, Independent Learner, Interested Teacher, Individualist, Persevering Seeker, Wounded Healer, Explorer of the Psyche, Spiritual Gambler, Edge-Walker, Velveteen Rabbit, Dramatist, Artist, Poet, Actor, Passionate Soulmate, Unfulfilled Lover, Vengeful Lover, Romantic Rival, Jealous Competitor, Intense Seeker, Witty Pundit, Social Critic, Insightful Commentator, Public Artist, Public Designer, Architect, Artistic Director, Refined Elitist, Social Muck-raker, Alienated Idealist

 

[Renn]

Infj ones are always concerned on doing the right thing. They are more detached and pragmatic compared to infj fours who are more caught up in emotional intensity. That's what I think though I'm not quite sure because I haven't observed an infj four in real life. I'm an infj 1w9 and my concern is more of doing the right thing in a harmonious way. One accounts for the perfectionism and nine for the harmony and I think my nine wing provides a good balance. Doing other things stops me from being a super criticial one. Though my critical attitude does comes out every now and then when I can't control it. Sometimes, my results come out as four in the enneagram. Then I have this artistic and mysterious side with deep emotions overflowing. Maybe, it was during the times that I am being unhealthy that I typed as four or probably its because the infj personality has a lot of sides and faces that I can't really pigeonhole myself on a specific description for a long time.

 

[iwakar]

[MENTION=4945]EJCC[/MENTION], you got me thinking that perhaps there is something to the Enneagram Tritype business. I consistently type as a 4, but feel myself identifying with its shortcomings and strengths less and less. I thought this meant I was just occupying the healthy range more because I was learning how to channel my feelings into something productive rather than a cesspool of internalized rainbow muck. But having reread the Type 1, I see some heavy overlap, although I can't identify with all of it. I also can identify with the Type 5 description, which I chalked up to a heavy wing. Perhaps I am a 4-1-5. It's not hard to imagine an INFJ seeking to redirect their volatility into something meaningful, might walk this path. Perhaps your mother is the same?

 

[EJCC]

[MENTION=4945]EJCC[/MENTION], you got me thinking that perhaps there is something to the Enneagram Tritype business. I consistently type as a 4, but feel myself identifying with its shortcomings and strengths less and less. I thought this meant I was just occupying the healthy range more because I was learning how to channel my feelings into something productive rather than a cesspool of internalized rainbow muck. But having reread the Type 1, I see some heavy overlap, although I can't identify with all of it. I also can identify with the Type 5 description, which I chalked up to a heavy wing. Perhaps I am a 4-1-5. It's not hard to imagine an INFJ seeking to redirect their volatility into something meaningful, might walk this path. Perhaps your mother is the same?

It's hard to know if it's tritype or not, since healthy Fours go to One and unhealthy Ones go to Four. I think the way my mom expressed Four-like traits when she was a kid was not particularly healthy, so it's more likely than not that she was Disintegrating, not Integrating.

It sounds like in your case it could be tritype, and also being a healthy enough 4 that you show a lot of 1 traits.

 

[LotsOfHeart]

I'm an INFJ and most times I took the Enneagram I got type 5, but a friend who is very well-versed in the Enneagram told me I seemed like a definite 4. I read the description of the 4, and related to that extremely, more-so than 5, so I identify with being a 4.

This is all pretty interesting because it shows just one of the many ways people with the same personality type can be different.

 

[Rail Tracer]

This isn't to say that all INFJ 1s are like that, since not all INFJ 1s care about politics. But I think they do seem a little more uptight than other INFJs. I had an INFJ roommate who may have been either a 4 or a 9w1 and she walked around with a dreamy smile on her face everywhere she went -- whereas INFJ 1s always look pretty focused, I've noticed. How can you not be, if you walk around noticing everything that's out of place, wherever you go? (And before you say I'm biased, I'm a 1w2 also and I know from experience!

The bold is my general feeling.

There is probably some bits of a difference between 1w9 and 1w2. I am not as likely to tell the world off, but sometimes that underlying need to tell someone off is there. I think the 2 wing makes the 1's more likely to voice their opinions while the 9 wings makes it a little less likely.

Probably more likely to relax a bit.

[MENTION=14498]Cloud of Thunder[/MENTION]

They are probably similar because both focus on a type of "ideal." Type 1 seeks a type of "perfection" while Type 4 seeks a type of "idealized image."

Type 1

If, finally, the focus is upon the discrepancy between the idealized image and the actual self, then all he is aware of and all we can observe are his incessant attempts to bridge the gap and whip himself into perfection. In this event he keeps reiterating the word "should" with amazing frequency. He keeps telling us what he should have felt, thought, done. He is at bottom as convinced of his inherent perfection as the naively "narcissistic" person, and betrays it by the belief that he actually could be perfect if only he were more strict with himself, more controlled, more alert, more circumspect.

Type 4

If the focus is on the realistic self which by comparison with the idealized image is highly despicable, self-derogatory criticism is in the foreground. Since the picture of the self that results from such disparagement is just as far removed from reality as is the idealized image, it could appropriately be called the despised image.

 

[EJCC]

There is probably some bits of a difference between 1w9 and 1w2. I am not as likely to tell the world off, but sometimes that underlying need to tell someone off is there. I think the 2 wing makes the 1's more likely to voice their opinions while the 9 wings makes it a little less likely.

For sure. I'll bet you're right.

If, finally, the focus is upon the discrepancy between the idealized image and the actual self, then all he is aware of and all we can observe are his incessant attempts to bridge the gap and whip himself into perfection. In this event he keeps reiterating the word "should" with amazing frequency. He keeps telling us what he should have felt, thought, done. He is at bottom as convinced of his inherent perfection as the naively "narcissistic" person, and betrays it by the belief that he actually could be perfect if only he were more strict with himself, more controlled, more alert, more circumspect.

This is interesting. I pretty much 100% relate to it. But it's misleading in the word choice of "narcissistic", because to be fair, if Ones are "convinced of (their) inherent perfection", they're convinced of the inherent perfection of literally everything else in the world too.
^ I only bring this up to make more clear the 4/1 difference.

 

[Rail Tracer]

For sure. I'll bet you're right.

This is interesting. I pretty much 100% relate to it. But it's misleading in the word choice of "narcissistic", because to be fair, if Ones are "convinced of (their) inherent perfection", they're convinced of the inherent perfection of literally everything else in the world too.
^ I only bring this up to make more clear the 4/1 difference.

Yeah, I think the author of the statements was trying to make a point using less than ideal examples.

Well, the author does talk about the similarities of 1, 4, and 7 and how they are different from one another.

http://www.davesenneagram.com/blog/idealized-image-and-types-1-4-and-7