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  1. #1
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    Default The difference between Fe of INFJ and Fi in general?

    Fe and Fi are supposed to be in conflict with each other. Fe is about harmony over strict values and authenticity and Fi about values and authenticity over harmony.

    Yet I know, both by having read type descriptions and knowing them in real life, that INFJs, despite of being Fe sec, are all about true feelings. One INFJ (woman), for example, has told me that what she says or writes usually comes straight from her heart with no "proof-reading".

    This makes Fe of the INFJ sound more like Fi to me. What is it that I am not seeing here? Or is it just that the INFJ's seek for harmony comes straight from the heart as well so that what comes from there is already biased by Fe?
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  2. #2
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    In general. That is the key, I think, to understanding how a function changes as it goes from the outside to the inside of a person. There will be gray areas.

    Fe is about harmony over strict values and authenticity and Fi about values and authenticity over harmony.
    When you try to apply values language to functions, I think that is when things go awry. Fe is both of the above, as is Fi.


    Fe is simply an extraverting of feeling. Fi is an introverting of feeling.

    Fe is turning feeling outward onto people and animals and including them in its context. Fi is turning feeling inward into yourself and considering how things should be among others and in the world.

    Both can be warm, authentic, values-driven, imaginative, etc. It's just a different focus.

    Fe is warmer outside, Fi is warmer inside. Both can be cold at times, and an Fe user uses Fi, just as an Fi user uses Fe.


    It's just that most of the time, Fe is concerned with others, and Fi is concerned with a more abstract right.


    I sort of think when functions are extraverted, they are necessarily more concrete, and when introverted, abstract.

    Therefore, the most abstract functions are the introverted irrational ones (Si, Ni); followed by the introverted rational ones (Fi, Ti).
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  3. #3
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    For myself... I am more concerned about being understood (misunderstood), than I am about being authentic.

    I don't think that's because I feel that being inauthentic or fake is ok or a good thing. I would say it's more because I already know I am authentic, I know that I am...myself and I have a clear sense of my own identity. I know that I don't always act consistently and I do let myself and others down at times, but generally I don't worry about being real and true to myself - it is fairly instinctive/intuitive.

    However, I worry a great deal about being misunderstood by others; I also worry about whether I am overestimating my own ability to understand others, since I feel that they misunderstand me so much.

    Do you guys think this is more of a personal thing, or is it reflective of the fact that I am Fe aux as an INFJ? It does seem to me that "authenticity" is more something within, not affected to the same degree by interaction with others, which would seem to match with Fi; whereas being understood and understanding others is necessarily based on a relationship/communication with other people. (Fe)

    Sorry if this seems irrelevant to the OP, but it is what came to mind!
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  4. #4
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gandalf View Post
    One INFJ (woman), for example, has told me that what she says or writes usually comes straight from her heart with no "proof-reading".

    This makes Fe of the INFJ sound more like Fi to me. What is it that I am not seeing here? Or is it just that the INFJ's seek for harmony comes straight from the heart as well so that what comes from there is already biased by Fe?
    I think your example has more to do with how expressive the individual is, rather than Fe or Fi. More context here would help. When I risk conflict to give someone I care about advice, it "comes straight from my heart". When I try to defend something I really care about, it also "comes straight from my heart" (and if I'm really passionate about it there will be no "proof-reading") Fe seeks harmony -- but not in the sense that everyone has to be all happy and sweet all the time. If conflict is necessary, Fe can become pretty 'inharmonious'. However, the main thing is, Fe seeks to change the situation to attain harmony again (whether the adjustment comes from their part or other people's). Fi makes no such conscious effort to change itself or the environment.

    But this in no way means that Fe is inauthentic and Fi is authentic. I totally agree with what @SilkRoad said about Fe and authenticity.
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  5. #5
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gandalf View Post
    Fe and Fi are supposed to be in conflict with each other. Fe is about harmony over strict values and authenticity and Fi about values and authenticity over harmony.

    Yet I know, both by having read type descriptions and knowing them in real life, that INFJs, despite of being Fe sec, are all about true feelings. One INFJ (woman), for example, has told me that what she says or writes usually comes straight from her heart with no "proof-reading".

    This makes Fe of the INFJ sound more like Fi to me. What is it that I am not seeing here? Or is it just that the INFJ's seek for harmony comes straight from the heart as well so that what comes from there is already biased by Fe?
    My simple solution is just to say that INFJ is not equal to NiFe, at least not when talking about real people. It's not as if to say this INFJ type of person doesn't have personal values. Being INFJ or NiFe doesn't eliminate the possible of those.

    I can't figure out what is so Fi about writing from the heart anyway.
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  6. #6
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    i think the thing about Fi and "from the heart" is Fi users often think in terms of "fuck context, this is what it is", when we're thinking about our feelings or values, and therefore our expression of such things is often "unfiltered". whereas Fe users, while no less genuine, are more likely to tamper things to adjust to external context, what with Fe being an extraverted function and all. it's like what silk said about being concerned about being misunderstood - it's rare that such a concern comes to my mind in everyday life. i don't change things up front to be better understood, usually... i'll explain afterwards if i have to. so Fi can be more "authentic", if you will, in the sense that it is unchanged from inside to outside, but its true meaning is often lost in translation, whereas Fe can actually remain more constant from inside to outside because the user has adapted the "language" of the expression of Feeling to meet the understanding of those who are going to be exposed to it. but i don't think that means changing the Feeling, it's just about language.

    but as for the OP, if you are dealing with a Ni dom, Fe will usually be serving the endgoals of Ni, so...

    what i see in FJs is usually a more longterm outlook than FPs.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    i think the thing about Fi and "from the heart" is Fi users often think in terms of "fuck context, this is what it is", when we're thinking about our feelings or values, and therefore our expression of such things is often "unfiltered". whereas Fe users, while no less genuine, are more likely to tamper things to adjust to external context, what with Fe being an extraverted function and all. it's like what silk said about being concerned about being misunderstood - it's rare that such a concern comes to my mind in everyday life. i don't change things up front to be better understood, usually... i'll explain afterwards if i have to. so Fi can be more "authentic", if you will, in the sense that it is unchanged from inside to outside, but its true meaning is often lost in translation, whereas Fe can actually remain more constant from inside to outside because the user has adapted the "language" of the expression of Feeling to meet the understanding of those who are going to be exposed to it. but i don't think that means changing the Feeling, it's just about language.
    I can see that. It corresponds with what Jung said about Ti and Fi. According to Jung, they share in being theoretical, although the Fi uses "feeling-theory." In my own words, Ti aims for truth, Fi aims for authenticity. But they are both objective, they want their truths to be unsullied by some external context. Perhaps the concept that merges the two types is "right versus wrong," although the Ti function sees this as theoretical and the Fi function sees this as moral.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
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  8. #8
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mal12345 View Post
    I can see that. It corresponds with what Jung said about Ti and Fi. According to Jung, they share in being theoretical, although the Fi uses "feeling-theory." In my own words, Ti aims for truth, Fi aims for authenticity. But they are both objective, they want their truths to be unsullied by some external context. Perhaps the concept that merges the two types is "right versus wrong," although the Ti function sees this as theoretical and the Fi function sees this as moral.
    How can introverted functions be objective?
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    Do not resist an evil person, but to him who strikes you on the one cheek, offer also the other. ~Matthew 5:39

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  9. #9
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    How can introverted functions be objective?
    Fi and Ti are not perceiving functions, but judging functions.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  10. #10
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Argh, you ask such interesting questions sometimes, but only because I keep mentally probing deeper into the issue. The process starts out as subjective, but the goal is to objectify the subjective content.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

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