User Tag List

First 678

Results 71 to 78 of 78

  1. #71
    Senior Member Santosha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    MBTI
    HUMR
    Enneagram
    6 sx
    Socionics
    iNfp Ni
    Posts
    1,521

    Default

    I don't believe there is any objective moral truth. Infact, I struggle with the concept of objective knoweldge entirely. The problem that science faces when it attempts to explore the true nature of the universe, or to know anything for that matter, is that it is only using physical manifestations and observation. Subject-object divide.

    "It's like trying to look at your own head with your eyes. The best you can do is to observe the reflection in a mirror, and draw conclusions from a two dimensional representation of your three dimensional head. You will never be able to see your own head with your own eyes."

    The one thing that seems to really resonate within me is the zero-point field, a theory in quantum physics that attempts to prove that there exists an energy field that shows all things are connected.

    So If I subscribe to the idea that everything is connected (and I do) then when I really look at the bigger-big picture, everything is one. And if everything is one.. then any attempt to distinguish this from that is an illusion. An illusion I believe is created by the human brain processor, in an attempt to understand self, when self is actually a consciousness not created by the brain. And there is quite a bit of evidence to support this- when you start looking at mind over matter, brain activity in placebo affects and hypnosis, and even people that are flatlining in highly monitored states, only to go on and recall experiences outside the body that do not align with DMT release and firing neurons.

    "To set up what you like against what you dislike - this is the disease of the mind"
    Dam skippy. It's an illusion, too.

    So what your doing when ever you create a preference for basically anything.. (be that good/bad, sweet/sour, individualism, id-ego-egosim constructs) is attempting to disconnect from all-connected. And I just don't buy it. I can't proove it, obviously.. but clearly I am skeptical of ALL proofs.

    Yet I am still forced to experience with my mind, in a body, on a material plane. If we are all connected, the collective unconscious, then what is the point? What purpose could this serve? Many modern spiritualists will say, we are here to experience what we are NOT, to understand what we are. And that doesn't really make sense if we are everything.

    Meh. I'm not sure if I conveyed this as well as I could *shrugs* but sticking to the original points... I believe I do fall under the oh-so-limiting vocab of "moral nihilism." And I just want to add, that I do NOT believe moral nihilism is simply a copout to justify crude or apathetic behaviors. I think there is a much bigger picture being over-looked by a few here. I am very interested in thoughts that others might have in HOW you can morally align yourself if you believe in a collective unconscious.

    Edit: Is morality not really just a complex code that aids in survival?
    Man suffers only because he takes seriously what the gods made for fun - Watts

  2. #72
    Senior Member Santosha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    MBTI
    HUMR
    Enneagram
    6 sx
    Socionics
    iNfp Ni
    Posts
    1,521

    Default

    [YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3R4zkblHZk"].[/YOUTUBE]
    Man suffers only because he takes seriously what the gods made for fun - Watts

  3. #73
    Senor Membrane
    Join Date
    May 2008
    MBTI
    INFP
    Posts
    3,190

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Huxley3112 View Post
    I don't believe there is any objective moral truth.
    In practice, anything people call objective is just a vote among top scientists. Usually not even that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Huxley3112 View Post
    I am very interested in thoughts that others might have in HOW you can morally align yourself if you believe in a collective unconscious.
    What do you mean? I believe in collective unconsciousness, and collective consciousness. I see most people living in a state of immorality that has been patched up by society's moral code. They are unconscious. Some become more conscious and they start to have morals of their own. But there is no reason to blame the ones who don't become more conscious because it is like blaming a seed for failing to grow.

    Quote Originally Posted by Huxley3112 View Post
    Edit: Is morality not really just a complex code that aids in survival?
    Yes. But that is no reason to disrespect the code. People always say 'It is just a part of our nature', or 'Love is just chemicals', and it is weird. It's like, if you can explain something by something, it's somehow losing value (or dropping to the level of valuation of the object that explains it). Even if it is just an aid in survival, so what? Life is just a flash between two eternal darknesses, and that's marvelous!

  4. #74
    Junior Member sqnh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    9
    Posts
    29

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Huxley3112 View Post
    What thoughts do INFP's have on moral nihilism? Do INFP's reject the notion?
    I'm an INFP, a seminary student, and I might very well be a moral nihilist!

    I absolutely believe that morality is subjective, it changes - it's dynamic. I think it's possible for humans to convince themselves (and others) constructs are moral and immoral. Scientifically speaking, I think most life-forms instinctually strive to survive, and perhaps the adaptation of moral behavior has evolved to support survival. I don't think that there's anything inherently right or wrong woven into any given phenomenon, however. I have my own ideals that I won't violate, but I'm cognizant that I'm always a stroke a way from being even the slightest aware of morals, you know?

    So, I'd say - yeah - definitely possible to be a moral nihilist. As far as how that would look, for example, the INFP nihilist could say that they don't kill people because they believe it to be bad, though killing itself does not have any inherent value. The nihilist admits that they are placing a value on the object. Does that sound right?

  5. #75
    Señora Member Elfa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    4w5
    Posts
    269

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    Um, gravity, biology, and chemistry serve very practical purposes.
    Moral nihilism is a philosophy view. Doesn't philosophy's views have practical purposes?

  6. #76
    Permabanned
    Join Date
    May 2009
    MBTI
    ISFP
    Enneagram
    6w7 sx
    Socionics
    SEE Fi
    Posts
    25,301

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Elfa View Post
    That's a philosophy view. Doesn't philosophy's views have practical purposes?
    Not necessarily.

  7. #77
    Señora Member Elfa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    4w5
    Posts
    269

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    Not necessarily.
    Ok, if you think that way, but I desagree.

  8. #78
    Senior Member BAJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    MBTI
    ISFP
    Enneagram
    4w5
    Posts
    631

    Default

    I'm not sure if my first post was relevant. I was explaining how my sensitivity to fish death changed over time. First morality: the fish is in pain, this is bad.

    Current morality: 1.) sometimes fish pain is bad 2.) fish taste good 3.) sometimes you must kill one fish for the benefit of many 4.) if there is no market for the fish, then it must die. Who will buy the fish and why? Etc.

    I agree with morality being somewhat arbitrary or relative to culture. If you were born into a different culture, with a different upbringing, then eating puppies would be yummy. Inside me, I see the seeds for almost every kind of evil, but some are sat upon stones and get no rain.

    But I have a problem with the concept of nihilism. Why would a nihilist care? Why would they even get out of bed?

    How is being a true nihilist different from being a complete sociopath in a moral sense?

Similar Threads

  1. [INFP] Help me survive INFP Silent Treatment!
    By lithasblot in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 08-08-2015, 12:56 PM
  2. [INFP] Please help me understand an INFP
    By Saslou in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: 02-07-2010, 04:38 PM
  3. [INFP] DARNED ESFPs and your caring! [Help me INFP]
    By Koocoomoo in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 09-10-2009, 02:40 AM
  4. Replies: 110
    Last Post: 05-03-2009, 12:49 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO