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  1. #131

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    Quote Originally Posted by violaine View Post
    I'm a sensation seeking INFJ (woman). I've always had a fascination for physical challenges. And fast rides. And traveling. I didn't try those things out as readily when I was younger, but I was hyper aware of my attraction to such things. I know the way I can be surprises people.

    I genuinely prefer to be kind and polite for the most part but I can't stand when someone mistakes kindness for weakness. I've had people think I'm a pushover and they get a very rude shock if they try to walk on me or mine. I admit that it annoys me greatly when anyone presumes that I'm a shy retirer because of the type I identify with. If I think about some of the INFJs on the board, they seem some of the most adventurous, accomplished people, just a bit more under the radar about it.

    If my experience is anything to go by, I suspect INFJs have a strange relationship with our own ability to be powerful or with people thinking we aren't. It's like a snake in the grass sometimes, darting out unexpectedly and sinking it's teeth in. I don't think an INFJ has the kind of control an ESTP might over those flashes. Even the way I'm describing it is far more self-conscious than an ESTP might describe the way they flex their persona. I think it's because an INFJ IS self-conscious about such things, there's a lot of thought that precedes anything we do.

    I notice that the baby ESTP comes out to play with a vengeance when I've been feeling too intensely in a way that is burdensome. When I feel like I've been at the mercy of my feelings or a situation, something flips inside and then I just cannot care at all for a little while. I need to blow off emotional steam. It's better if I don't let myself ricochet back and forth between those states. It doesn't happen as much if I'm engaging in regular, fun, physical activity.

    My parents were both ESPs and performers as well, so I'm sure that has a lot to do with it. I don't crave attention though, if, in fact, ESTPs do. My ESTP father and I have a strange mobius strip reflection of each other going on... I'm the one rolling eyes at his level of consideration of others now, (esp in traffic!)

    I'd never be mistaken for an ESTP if someone were really watching me though. (I did walk the Bay-To-Breakers in little more than my underwear recently, but my partner in crime and I did it in quite an ice-princess-y/classy manner of course. :p ) It's a matter of frequency. I go out one night and shock my E friends with my level of energy but then I'll need to go curl up in a ball for the next week, or two, or three.

    Also, I kinda like when I'm in the middle of fighting for something that's important to me or someone I care about. And it's almost like the messier the better. Makes me feel like I can do anything when I'm engaged in those situations.

    I don't think anything I've described above is at all uncommon for INFJs.
    I identify with this 100 f**king percent.
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  2. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by violaine View Post
    I'm a sensation seeking INFJ (woman). I've always had a fascination for physical challenges. And fast rides. And traveling. I didn't try those things out as readily when I was younger, but I was hyper aware of my attraction to such things. I know the way I can be surprises people.

    I genuinely prefer to be kind and polite for the most part but I can't stand when someone mistakes kindness for weakness. I've had people think I'm a pushover and they get a very rude shock if they try to walk on me or mine. I admit that it annoys me greatly when anyone presumes that I'm a shy retirer because of the type I identify with. If I think about some of the INFJs on the board, they seem some of the most adventurous, accomplished people, just a bit more under the radar about it.

    If my experience is anything to go by, I suspect INFJs have a strange relationship with our own ability to be powerful or with people thinking we aren't. It's like a snake in the grass sometimes, darting out unexpectedly and sinking it's teeth in. I don't think an INFJ has the kind of control an ESTP might over those flashes. Even the way I'm describing it is far more self-conscious than an ESTP might describe the way they flex their persona. I think it's because an INFJ IS self-conscious about such things, there's a lot of thought that precedes anything we do.

    I notice that the baby ESTP comes out to play with a vengeance when I've been feeling too intensely in a way that is burdensome. When I feel like I've been at the mercy of my feelings or a situation, something flips inside and then I just cannot care at all for a little while. I need to blow off emotional steam. It's better if I don't let myself ricochet back and forth between those states. It doesn't happen as much if I'm engaging in regular, fun, physical activity.

    My parents were both ESPs and performers as well, so I'm sure that has a lot to do with it. I don't crave attention though, if, in fact, ESTPs do. My ESTP father and I have a strange mobius strip reflection of each other going on... I'm the one rolling eyes at his level of consideration of others now, (esp in traffic!)

    I'd never be mistaken for an ESTP if someone were really watching me though. (I did walk the Bay-To-Breakers in little more than my underwear recently, but my partner in crime and I did it in quite an ice-princess-y/classy manner of course. :p ) It's a matter of frequency. I go out one night and shock my E friends with my level of energy but then I'll need to go curl up in a ball for the next week, or two, or three.

    Also, I kinda like when I'm in the middle of fighting for something that's important to me or someone I care about. And it's almost like the messier the better. Makes me feel like I can do anything when I'm engaged in those situations.

    I don't think anything I've described above is at all uncommon for INFJs.
    Amen to that, sista!

  3. #133
    Crazy Diamond Billy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    If you get your typing information from Vicky Jo rather than a more credible, intellectual source than there's nothing left to discuss. Seriously.

    That woman is a pariah.

    At least I don't have my own web site and claim to be an "expert."
    As I said I get my info from a variety of sources, I dont just read what I think other people think is popular and then pretend I am better then everyone else like you do. And the funny part of you claiming objectivity was you claiming to be anything remotely objective... you were joking right?
    Ground control to Major Tom

  4. #134
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by violaine View Post
    I'm a sensation seeking INFJ (woman). I've always had a fascination for physical challenges. And fast rides. And traveling. I didn't try those things out as readily when I was younger, but I was hyper aware of my attraction to such things. I know the way I can be surprises people.

    I genuinely prefer to be kind and polite for the most part but I can't stand when someone mistakes kindness for weakness. I've had people think I'm a pushover and they get a very rude shock if they try to walk on me or mine. I admit that it annoys me greatly when anyone presumes that I'm a shy retirer because of the type I identify with. If I think about some of the INFJs on the board, they seem some of the most adventurous, accomplished people, just a bit more under the radar about it.

    If my experience is anything to go by, I suspect INFJs have a strange relationship with our own ability to be powerful or with people thinking we aren't. It's like a snake in the grass sometimes, darting out unexpectedly and sinking it's teeth in. I don't think an INFJ has the kind of control an ESTP might over those flashes. Even the way I'm describing it is far more self-conscious than an ESTP might describe the way they flex their persona. I think it's because an INFJ IS self-conscious about such things, there's a lot of thought that precedes anything we do.

    I notice that the baby ESTP comes out to play with a vengeance when I've been feeling too intensely in a way that is burdensome. When I feel like I've been at the mercy of my feelings or a situation, something flips inside and then I just cannot care at all for a little while. I need to blow off emotional steam. It's better if I don't let myself ricochet back and forth between those states. It doesn't happen as much if I'm engaging in regular, fun, physical activity.

    My parents were both ESPs and performers as well, so I'm sure that has a lot to do with it. I don't crave attention though, if, in fact, ESTPs do. My ESTP father and I have a strange mobius strip reflection of each other going on... I'm the one rolling eyes at his level of consideration of others now, (esp in traffic!)

    I'd never be mistaken for an ESTP if someone were really watching me though. (I did walk the Bay-To-Breakers in little more than my underwear recently, but my partner in crime and I did it in quite an ice-princess-y/classy manner of course. :p ) It's a matter of frequency. I go out one night and shock my E friends with my level of energy but then I'll need to go curl up in a ball for the next week, or two, or three.

    Also, I kinda like when I'm in the middle of fighting for something that's important to me or someone I care about. And it's almost like the messier the better. Makes me feel like I can do anything when I'm engaged in those situations.

    I don't think anything I've described above is at all uncommon for INFJs.
    I don't identify 100%...but something like 80%. I come from a VERY IxxJ family, and that has formed me to an extent...well, quite a large extent. We all adore travel but in most respects we're fairly scholarly bookish types (and my brother has synthesized that in interesting ways - he writes about hockey and travel, but in a refined, classy way ) But my crazy fun-loving side has come out more since I've gone out on my own. I also shock people sometimes with the silliness and the fun. It's funny, some people who've almost exclusively seen me in those situations probably think I'm an ESFP or something. I've been called a socialite and a party girl before...hardly the case really. But I have my moments and they can be so fun.

    I also hate it when people mistake kindness for weakness...it's happened too many times now so that it's actually likely to make me disproportionately angry. But I hate conflict and fights. Maybe it does bring out a certain power, but it can also make me feel ugly and vicious, like I really want to hurt someone...there is a part of me that wants to hurt people who've hurt me.

    I also agree about INFJs being - in many cases - very adventurous and accomplished but they may not advertise it! I still have friends I've known some time who are shocked when they learn about things I've done, because I might only talk about them when drawn out or if it seems VERY apt to the situation and the moment.

    I do wonder how different I might be if I'd grown up in something like an ExxP family...! I think my parents and brother do think I'm the crazy, fun-loving one, although they know fundamentally what I am is serious and sensitive.


    EDIT: Btw Violaine, I wonder if big city living has partly made you "less considerate" in some situations (like you said about you and your dad in traffic)? It certainly has me...in some ways I think it's good cause I'm more assertive, in some ways bad because I have a shorter fuse.
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  5. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy View Post
    As I said I get my info from a variety of sources, I dont just read what I think other people think is popular and then pretend I am better then everyone else like you do. And the funny part of you claiming objectivity was you claiming to be anything remotely objective... you were joking right?
    No I'm not joking, and I do not believe that you've read Jung or Beebe.

  6. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by violaine View Post
    I'm a sensation seeking INFJ (woman). I've always had a fascination for physical challenges. And fast rides. And traveling. I didn't try those things out as readily when I was younger, but I was hyper aware of my attraction to such things. I know the way I can be surprises people.

    I genuinely prefer to be kind and polite for the most part but I can't stand when someone mistakes kindness for weakness. I've had people think I'm a pushover and they get a very rude shock if they try to walk on me or mine. I admit that it annoys me greatly when anyone presumes that I'm a shy retirer because of the type I identify with. If I think about some of the INFJs on the board, they seem some of the most adventurous, accomplished people, just a bit more under the radar about it.

    If my experience is anything to go by, I suspect INFJs have a strange relationship with our own ability to be powerful or with people thinking we aren't. It's like a snake in the grass sometimes, darting out unexpectedly and sinking it's teeth in. I don't think an INFJ has the kind of control an ESTP might over those flashes. Even the way I'm describing it is far more self-conscious than an ESTP might describe the way they flex their persona. I think it's because an INFJ IS self-conscious about such things, there's a lot of thought that precedes anything we do.

    I notice that the baby ESTP comes out to play with a vengeance when I've been feeling too intensely in a way that is burdensome. When I feel like I've been at the mercy of my feelings or a situation, something flips inside and then I just cannot care at all for a little while. I need to blow off emotional steam. It's better if I don't let myself ricochet back and forth between those states. It doesn't happen as much if I'm engaging in regular, fun, physical activity.

    My parents were both ESPs and performers as well, so I'm sure that has a lot to do with it. I don't crave attention though, if, in fact, ESTPs do. My ESTP father and I have a strange mobius strip reflection of each other going on... I'm the one rolling eyes at his level of consideration of others now, (esp in traffic!)

    I'd never be mistaken for an ESTP if someone were really watching me though. (I did walk the Bay-To-Breakers in little more than my underwear recently, but my partner in crime and I did it in quite an ice-princess-y/classy manner of course. :p ) It's a matter of frequency. I go out one night and shock my E friends with my level of energy but then I'll need to go curl up in a ball for the next week, or two, or three.

    Also, I kinda like when I'm in the middle of fighting for something that's important to me or someone I care about. And it's almost like the messier the better. Makes me feel like I can do anything when I'm engaged in those situations.

    I don't think anything I've described above is at all uncommon for INFJs.
    Yes! This is just how it is!

  7. #137
    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
    Dig that, brother Alex.
    Thank you, Sir!

    -Alex

    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    2) @Halla74, your post was perfect.
    EDIT:

    Exactly!
    Thank you very much, EJCC.
    I appreciate that very much.



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  8. #138
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Esoteric Wench View Post
    "Dear INFJ Gentlemen, you are NOT ESTPs... So quit acting like it!"

    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    Let me be the first to point out that the above statement does not apply to all INFJ gentlemen. And the ones it does apply to, it doesn't apply all the time. Nonetheless, I feel like it has to be said.

    I've seen several INFJ gentlemen in my acquaintance act like the most obnoxious... well like really obnoxious ESTPs. (No offense to ESTPs. I'm not talking about a normal, mentally-healthy ESTP.) I'm talking about people acting out their shadow functions. According to Jung, everyone has a shadow aspect to their personality that consists of repressed weaknesses, shortcomings, and instincts. For an INFJ, their shadow functions are embodied in an ESTP's dominant functions.

    Some - but not all - of the behavior I've noticed includes blatant womanizing and a really annoying BMOC (big-man-on-campus) attitude. It's sort of like they are trying so hard... too hard... to not be the sweet, sensitive, quiet guys they were born to be.

    I've often thought that INFJ men were dealt a tough hand. In fact, our culture teaches men to be as un-INFJ as possible doesn't it? That's gotta be a real mind f*ck to the heterosexual male INFJ mindset.

    The same could be said for all NF males. But I think that INFJ and INFP males have a particularly tough time of it. But I've only noticed this "shadow embracing" pattern in INFJ males. (Admittedly my anecdotal evidence is based on a small sample set. There are so few INFJ males out there.)

    This won't be the first thread on how one struggles with being an NF male. And it won't be the last. I guess I was hoping for advice on how to be a good friend to my INFJ male friends when they are feeling the weight of society's expectations on them. Up until this point, the only thing I can think of is to whack 'em on the back of the head in the way Gibbs does to DiNozzo on NCIS.
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  9. #139
    violaine
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilkRoad View Post
    EDIT: Btw Violaine, I wonder if big city living has partly made you "less considerate" in some situations (like you said about you and your dad in traffic)? It certainly has me...in some ways I think it's good cause I'm more assertive, in some ways bad because I have a shorter fuse.
    I'm sure it has. I'm always kind first, that is a conscious choice. If I didn't carve out my own space, as everyone else is doing in NYC I'd be perpetually annoyed. It's been a great training ground. Being more assertive (not aggressive) on a daily basis has carried over to make that whole "conflict" realm much easier to deal with as well. I still lurch at little inside when I know I'm going to be getting into it with someone seriously. But I've noticed serious conflict takes much less of a personal toll when it's dealt with sooner rather than later. (Because in truth, I am very focused on resolving things, it's just that in the past it used to be in a "death by 1000 paper cuts" way.)

  10. #140
    Aquaria mrcockburn's Avatar
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    I don't think they're necessarily fighting against their nature or deliberately ungaying themselves. Sometimes you just want a jagerbomb.
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