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  1. #11
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Im not sure how much help I can be with this..

    I can forgive someone.. but I do have trouble forgetting.
    Example: Someone borrows money from me, intentions to pay it back may or may not have been there, but it never does get paid back. While I DO forgive them, and I don't hold that grudge against them (i.e. it no longer affects our relationship, friendship, etc.), I'm not going to loan them money again.
    Another example: In a relationship, someone has lied to me.. and while I forgave them for that, they thought that meant I would never EVER look for signs of being lied to again. While I didn't go crazy and start accusing them without signs and signals, when I started to see them again, they got all up in arms about it as if it were a lack of trust.

    I don't know if this is the best way to do things, it probably isn't, but it allows me to survive and maintain connections with people.
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  2. #12
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    This isn't about "endless forgiveness". This is about infatuation. This guy is giving you something you want and that's why you want/need to forgive him. It's self-deluding /unhealthy to set yourself up as some kind of saintly all-suffering martyr.

    You've already made a bunch of judgements about him. He's a liar, a cheat, an addict and a "douchwaffle" (wtf?). You don't have to ask yourself questions about the virtue of forgiveness, you just have to ask yourself whether you can live with those traits. Whether all the stuff that you like about him balances out against the weight of his (pretty serious) faults.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  3. #13
    Junior Member a24kar's Avatar
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    Endless forgiveness can be a wonderful thing in many circumstances! The first example that pops into mind is the role of a parent or teacher. The loving guardian is able to nurture and heal the delicate and growing child. They are safe from the scaring hammer of justice dealt out by many a parent and teacher.

    It can also be something that is very dangerous to an INFP's capability of protecting themselves. Endless forgives, in it's darkest quality, can become the thread that stitches together something rotten.

    As an INFP, you will may always forgive endlessly. My grandmother is an excellent example of this. She is married to a man who, at this point in their lives, verbally abuses her on a nearly hourly basis. No one in our family understands why she stays with this man. I suppose it is the same reason that you mentioned yourself; being infatuated with the person.

    I would offer two thoughts toward your struggle:

    1. Since it is nearly impossible for INFPs to know an appropriate time to stand up for themselves, let your close friends' and families' perspectives influence your decision. You would, of course, want to make sure that the people you are asking about this know as much as possible about the betraying and how the person treats you in general.

    2. If this person shows a pattern of betrayal, how valuable must they find you? Also, the more you allow a person to walk all over you, the less they will respect you. So, essentially, if this cycle is allowed to contaminate your relationship, he will continue to walk all over you and respect you and your relationship less and less as time goes by.

    I would say that if you want to avoid this, listen to your friends. If all of your friends and family have nothing but negative things to say about him, that is a red flag! I would take that very seriously!

    This is only my personal opinion but, I sincerely hope this is helpful for you.

  4. #14
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    Thanks to you both, I have made judgments about him obviously. That is where it gets murky. I have several streams of thought about it.

    1. Hmm once again a man with very similar issues (dishonesty being the worst), perhaps this is just the human condition and they are all this way.

    2. I am no saint myself, where do I get off expecting perfection? We are all works in progress.

    3. I divorced after 16 years of marriage (I married at 16), so essentially I fear that from now on I will just keep "quitting" people because they aren't "good enough" and end up alone due to an inflated sense of ego or pride.

    I realize staying married for 16 years isn't exactly a record of quitting on people, but at this point I've played the picket fence game, got all the outer trappings though my soul was screaming silently for REAL LIFE and I felt dead. Then I went out and found the live in the moment artistic guy that completely changed my life and how I perceived everything in the world including myself in a positive way, then that all collapsed because well he pretty much fabricated who he said he was. Now I'm wondering, can people change in two seconds, or is he geuinely full of crap. BTW he has been married 3 times and almost died 2 times from drinking. He has been very self destructive in the past.

    Everyone except my own dysfunctional drunken family thinks he has proven himself to be a poor choice. They all look like they are going to cry when they ask me if I'm still speaking with him. 75% of them want to kick his ass.

    I guess it's a case of low self esteem, or I am attached and addicted to what I thought was real?

    Life sucks really at this moment.

  5. #15
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    You sound very vulnerable. He sounds like a bit of a shit. Some people like shits, it takes all sorts. But don't go into this expecting him to change. Either you can accept ("forgive") him as he is, or you should get out. It really is that simple.

    3. I divorced after 16 years of marriage (I married at 16), so essentially I fear that from now on I will just keep "quitting" people because they aren't "good enough" and end up alone due to an inflated sense of ego or pride.
    It doesn't sound to me like unrealistically high expectations are your problem. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  6. #16
    Junior Member a24kar's Avatar
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    to address your streams of thought:

    @ 1. There are honest men on this planet. If you want to be with an honest man then leave the ones who prove themselves to be dishonest. Eventually you will find yourself an honest one.

    @ 2. To expect a certain degree of honesty in a relationship = expecting perfection??? (I would disagree)

    @ 3. Settling for a bad match only because you're afraid of being alone is a very, very self destructive and unhealthy thing to do.

    "Everyone except my own dysfunctional drunken family thinks he has proven himself to be a poor choice. They all look like they are going to cry when they ask me if I'm still speaking with him. 75% of them want to kick his ass."

    ^this is the red flag I was talking about earlier!!

  7. #17
    Secret Sex Freak Hazashin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by purledbanjo View Post
    Hi new here!

    I'm struggling with myself right now in the area of being "walked on" and not standing up for myself. I was, well am in a relationship with someone that lied to me about his past, in an area that I have been burned in before and he was aware, and he did a couple of other douchewaffley things as well.

    I love him, beyond the moon. In a way that makes people barf. I feel like I'm in a Lifetime movie, one of "those stupid chicks" that just won't let go of the bad guy.

    Everyone I know thinks what he did was inexcusable, they see nothing but trouble coming from this guy. I am sheepishly still enmeshed with him.

    I know there isn't anyone but me who can decide if forgiveness/staying together is right, but I tend to be an uber forgiver.

    I always see the good person, I see everyone on a spectrum, we all have a shitty dysfunctional side. I tend to give chances, to always see the good, always believe the best can come of anyone and anything.

    How do you really clearly see things in order to make good choices? This heartache sucks, but what I've experienced on a spiritual/physical level with this person I have never known with another. I'm not child, and I was married for years. I don't want to blow it if this is like "the big one".

    I know I sound cheesy. But still......I don't want to be self destructive.
    That's amazing. I truly love that.

    I'm just like you in that regard. Forgiveness FTW!
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    Fi > Ne > Ti > Fe > Se > Si > Te > Ni

    "Forgiveness means letting go of the past." ~ Gerald Jampolsky
    "I am justice!" ~ Light Yagami, Death Note
    "The choices people make tell you a lot about a person, but the reasons [...] tell you even more." ~ Albus Dumbledore (paraphrased)

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