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  1. #11
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by violaine View Post
    Well, I'll hazard a guess as to the process that occurs inside intense people, taken to an extreme. I think some people are disposed to losing themselves in the fantasy of an attraction because it feels good to them. I can imagine INFJs as a type might often enjoy losing themselves in daydreams about their love interest. Heightening things in their imagination because it feels good, listening to certain types of music to feed the feeling, more elaborate daydreams as time goes by, eventually to the exclusion of reality if at an extreme. (Thinking it's particularly so for the socially isolated ones.) Unless a person learns to discipline their minds and modulate this tendency, and perhaps wait for mutual attraction, if you trigger their fantasy mode, they can in effect start to become really attached to the fantasy of you. It can happen without you even knowing. And then it comes across as being SUPER-INTENSE, because you aren't aware of all the scenarios you've been posed in in their mind, and all the ways they've inserted themselves into your future. (Ew, I'm INFJ and that even creeps me out.) Some people seem to run down this pathway in their mind quite quickly, ime, and only one or two interactions are enough to trigger it.

    I think it is unhealthy as all get out, as are all indulgences taken to an extreme. In the absence of mutuality, best not to run away with oneself.
    This is pretty damn accurate, I'm afraid.

    The weird thing about me, and possibly other INFJs...if I'm in a relationship with you, or intensely attracted to you (which, I should add in my case, only happens when I have gotten to know you fairly well, and only if I feel I am getting messages of attraction from you), my feelings are super-intense. However, I have that cool exterior which apparently doesn't look intense at all or else the intensity seems to be directed in other directions. And I tend to think that consciously or unconsciously I keep much of the intensity in check because I know that inside I'm kind of an obsessive stalker type, and I'd rather you didn't know that.

    So what this amounts to is...you're unlikely to find out just how intense I am until everything falls apart (ie. we break up, or you inform me you're not interested or somehow reject me.) Then you will find out, because (depending on the situation) I'll write you an eight-page letter telling you everything you did wrong in the relationship; have a giant sobbing fit in public; send you the cruellest text messages you have ever received in your life; coldly cut you off and refuse to ever have anything to do with you again; tell our mutual friends to not only ensure we never have to be in the same room again, but that I'd prefer to never hear the tiniest bit of news about you ever again because it's just going to trigger unwanted memories; etc.

    Unfortunately, I am writing this from experience... I'm trying to work on switching my inner neuroticism and my outer sang-froid around a bit, so that I am a bit less neurotic on the inside, and a bit less chilled-out on the outside. Wish me luck!
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  2. #12
    Vaguely Precise Seymour's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by violaine View Post
    Well, I'll hazard a guess as to the process that occurs inside intense people, taken to an extreme. I think some people are disposed to losing themselves in the fantasy of an attraction because it feels good to them. I can imagine INFJs as a type might often enjoy losing themselves in daydreams about their love interest. Heightening things in their imagination because it feels good, listening to certain types of music to feed the feeling, more elaborate daydreams as time goes by, eventually to the exclusion of reality if at an extreme. (Thinking it's particularly so for the socially isolated ones.) Unless a person learns to discipline their minds and modulate this tendency, and perhaps wait for mutual attraction, if you trigger their fantasy mode, they can in effect start to become really attached to the fantasy of you. It can happen without you even knowing. And then it comes across as being SUPER-INTENSE, because you aren't aware of all the scenarios you've been posed in in their mind, and all the ways they've inserted themselves into your future. (Ew, I'm INFJ and that even creeps me out.) Some people seem to run down this pathway in their mind quite quickly, ime, and only one or two interactions are enough to trigger it.

    I think it is unhealthy as all get out, as are all indulgences taken to an extreme. In the absence of mutuality, best not to run away with oneself.
    This sounds very textbook enneagram 4 to me (yearning for the idealized yet unavailable other, amping up emotional intensity). Not saying it can't be INFJ, too, but sounds awfully e4 to me.

  3. #13
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    I think you may be onto something, Seymour. I don't identify as much with that sort of thing, although I do know that I probably don't show the intensity of my feelings (or maybe know them myself) until there is some kind of crisis. Then I hate how obsessed I get about figuring it all out (I think I say goodbye okay as long as I feel some sense of closure or understand what's going on. Otherwise, I can get a little fixated.)

    I'm an 1w2 so/sx

  4. #14
    violaine
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    (Aw, I feel all judgmental now due to my added commentary about it being creepy. I just can't imagine it being creepy coming from you @Silk.)

    -----------
    Hmm, I was talking with an INTJ, and he was telling me about a frustration that he'd been keeping in that had now grown into something that required a confrontational conversation. It made me think about this thread, (skipping over a few steps in my mind) specifically how some people feed their fantasy life inside so that grows into something of it's own. And I decided that there's something dishonest about that. Is it how a person really feels? Or is it just the same old circuits being stimulated by someone new. I know this is true of some people, and someone I was even in a relationship with, who admitted to me that he just liked the feeling of being in love. (Yuck. Turned me off so quickly, it wasn't about me at all.) It's like they are rubbing a love nub inside their soul. He wasn't INFJ so I don't think this is type related, though some characteristics INFJs have in common may be a good predictor for such behavior.

    It also does the daydreamer no good. The person retreats into fantasy land instead of engaging the other appropriately. Waiting to be engaged by the other. It assumes that the other person will engage, which is like planning to fail and letting the other person helm the interaction. The other person may be just as reticent about letting their feelings show.

    That's why I'm a big fan of a well placed "I like you", not too early on, but early enough that it gets things on the correct track. Whether that be moving into a relationship or not.

  5. #15
    violaine
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    @Seymour. (hi). I've seen it in E2s and E7s as well as E4s. Yeah, don't think it's nec INFJ related.

  6. #16
    violaine
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crescent Fresh View Post
    I've re-read this post a couple of time. I think it is true to the core but my version is ultimately this:

    INFJs are super hard on themselves as they are such a perfectionist and set a high bar so high that it's hard for others to catch up with. Though once they're romantically involved with another, they focus on the other more intensely with extremely high expectation. Perhaps that's why the honeymoon period of a relationship can be relatively short if they start to ignore setting the same expectation toward themselves.

    I realized this pattern can be extremely harmful as it's almost unconscious. Now I realized the best way to approach a relationship is to expect nothing in the beginning and hope good surprises will come afterwards.
    Yeah, INFJs can be really hard on themselves. (Phew, I think the ISTJs I know take the cake on that though.) I think with some INFJs, it's like they are attraction-ready, waiting for the right one to come along and then pinning a lot of hopes and dreams to that person.

    (There again, don't think it's so much INFJ related, I would imagine a lot of people do this.)

  7. #17
    Señora Member Elfa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seymour View Post
    This sounds very textbook enneagram 4 to me (yearning for the idealized yet unavailable other, amping up emotional intensity). Not saying it can't be INFJ, too, but sounds awfully e4 to me.
    All I know is that I believe I'm a enneagram 4 and I don't see much of myself in the descriptions of the INFJs here...

  8. #18
    Aquaria mrcockburn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    well, being a self employed ESTP So dom 3, you probably attract them at first and then they get overwhelmed by your choleric, dramatic personality. that would be my guess
    1. I'm an ESFP.
    2. Sanguine, not choleric
    3. Drama? Not from my end.
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  9. #19
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcockburn View Post
    1. I'm an ESFP.
    2. Sanguine, not choleric
    3. Drama? Not from my end.
    ESFP makes sense for you
    you're a self employed 3, I'm not denying that you're more Sanguine, but you're probably at least somewhat Choleric too, especially for a sweet little INFJ guy who is easily startled. drama and dramatic are not the same thing. dramatic means that you exude powerful, intense energy in an animated, confident way. drama is emotional upheaval and communication of powerful emotion to another person. if you're 3w4 (you sorta seem more wing 2 to me from what little I've seen of you) you're probably a pretty rational, collected person, but still with a flair for spice and theatrics that might be too much for an INFJ to handle (not that this is your fault)
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  10. #20
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by violaine View Post
    (Aw, I feel all judgmental now due to my added commentary about it being creepy. I just can't imagine it being creepy coming from you @Silk.)
    Nah, don't worry I didn't take it that way at all...and to be fair to myself, things like giant sobbing fits in public and eight page letters were many years ago now

    I tend to get to that over-intense (mainly internally) stage without even realizing it's happening, which is something I am now watching out for.

    The last thing most people would perceive me as is some sort of drama queen, but I think where my intensity can shock is that a) they just didn't realise I cared so much, and b) I can lay down the law with great clarity and even harshness. "Your behaviour is unacceptable; I have endured your nonsense in x,y and z manner for x number of years and can do so no more;" and so on. From any feedback I've had, this can make me look pretty terrifying. (If the person actually has behaved badly and I have been kind of "wronged", that can bring it home to them quite effectively, I hear...) However, I wonder if it mainly looks like some kind of martinet/judge. They're less likely to know that I go off and cry and obsess privately - and the obsessing can be extremely prolonged, sometimes. (And there are also situations where I've just avoided and disappeared, as sometimes I feel that's all I can do.) As Fidelia mentioned, major closure is required to short-circuit the obsessing - and even then it may continue a little bit, though that should mostly take care of it. That aspect really depends on the situation.
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