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  1. #251
    Senior Member Sizzling Berry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cascadeco View Post
    I'm not exactly sure what you mean by what's in parentheses, but if I'm in a shady location and am distrustful of the vibes/person I'm around, then I'll act accordingly and might be more brusque/assertive.

    What's going on in my head? I dunno? That I generally want to treat people well? I don't know that there's anything deeper than that. The opposite would be for me to approach everyone with a scowl, disrespect, condescension, rudeness, what have you. I don't see how that would be a benefit to anyone, nor do I think the other person deserves my being rude and mean to them, so I'm pleasant because I want to treat people well. If I quickly learn they're an asshole or if they're rude to me, I'll be colder or will disengage. Like I said though, I'm not one to strike up conversations with strangers. This is hypothetical chit-chat situations -- my sitting on a bus and someone asks me something, or my interacting with a store clerk, or meeting someone at a party, or what have you.
    This is precisely what I meant in the bit in parentheses.

    So basically you value your kindness and politeness towards others .
    Hot-hearted head

  2. #252
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jixmixfix View Post
    doesn't get much clearer that that.
    Yep, looks like you didn't read the post before the one you just quoted.

    Thank you for lying to yourself. In your own words, you're being fake.

    Your toughness to call a person a degenerative word was just a mask.

    Thank you.

  3. #253
    Happy Dancer uumlau's Avatar
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    Forget the Fe function. I think those people who use the cosecant function are fake and manipulative. I mean, why can't they just take the reciprocal of sine, like any normal person would?!

    As Marm mentioned, Fe both affects and is affected by others' emotional states. That's just how it is, a state of being. It will seem fake when it is affected by others, and seem manipulative when it affects others. This is different from being deliberately deceptive, disingenuous, or scheming, though it can certainly overlap. This is entirely analogous to Te affecting and being affected by the logistics of the world. In the normal course of setting a goal and striving to achieve it, the interactions necessarily alter the world as they alter oneself (however temporarily).
    An argument is two people sharing their ignorance.

    A discussion is two people sharing their understanding, even when they disagree.

  4. #254
    FRACTALICIOUS phobik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    Forget the Fe function. I think those people who use the cosecant function are fake and manipulative. I mean, why can't they just take the reciprocal of sine, like any normal person would?!

    As Marm mentioned, Fe both affects and is affected by others' emotional states. That's just how it is, a state of being. It will seem fake when it is affected by others, and seem manipulative when it affects others. This is different from being deliberately deceptive, disingenuous, or scheming, though it can certainly overlap. This is entirely analogous to Te affecting and being affected by the logistics of the world. In the normal course of setting a goal and striving to achieve it, the interactions necessarily alter the world as they alter oneself (however temporarily).
    Sinc is clearly superior, but alas, beyond the grasp of mere mortals.
    To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, be nothing.
    ~ Elbert Hubbard

    Music provides one of the clearest examples of a much deeper relation between mathematics and human experience.

  5. #255
    Ginkgo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resonance View Post
    I uhh.... I'm having trouble grokking this.
    Ok, that was my shitty attempt at being blow-by-blow logical.

    Just forget I said that.

    Functions are cognitive mechanics, not behavior. While they do correspond and correlate with behavior, there are is no viable way in which we can observe behavior and explain through functions with any certitude. We can make guesses. We can even be correct, but we will never know. It is a practice of conjecture and theorizing. Matters are made even more complicated in that multiple functions may become conscious within the span of a short span of time. Let's say microseconds. Even if only one function is is possession of consciousness at any point in time, all 8 may bear the fruit of a single behavior lasting only seconds. Order of preference has nothing to do with the line of reasoning that leads one from function->behavior; however, I'm sure there are demonstrable correlations between type and behavior.

    That said, if we are to discuss functions with any sense of certainty, we must analyze motivations, hidden, unconscious, or otherwise.

    Fe-ers tend to have a sense of what's collectively "ideal". Speaking as an Fi dom, idealism is somewhat of a bad addiction for me, though I quietly scrutinize everything according to my own standards, which are often not even particularly defined. It seems that I have difficulty defining those ideals or even coming forth with them to others because they are so tightly woven to my own body of thought - my own giant web of what different shit makes an impression on me. Laying it all out would be as time consuming as dissecting a blue whale.

    So I'm going to assume that it's easier for Fe-ers to vocalize those impressions because they are more relative to the world. So demonstrable. Do you dress nice? Are you of esteem to us? Is the show popular? Should a program be "good"? Are you a crack whore? Etc. etc.

    So Fe-ers are more aware of those interpersonal doodads. It doesn't necessarily mean that they're taking advantage of them, being underhanded, or even coddling them.

    Wight?


  6. #256
    Energizer Bunny Resonance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ginkgo View Post
    Ok, that was my shitty attempt at being blow-by-blow logical.

    Just forget I said that.

    Functions are cognitive mechanics, not behavior. While they do correspond and correlate with behavior, there are is no viable way in which we can observe behavior and explain through functions with any certitude. We can make guesses. We can even be correct, but we will never know. It is a practice of conjecture and theorizing. Matters are made even more complicated in that multiple functions may become conscious within the span of a short span of time. Let's say microseconds. Even if only one function is is possession of consciousness at any point in time, all 8 may bear the fruit of a single behavior lasting only seconds. Order of preference has nothing to do with the line of reasoning that leads one from function->behavior; however, I'm sure there are demonstrable correlations between type and behavior.

    That said, if we are to discuss functions with any sense of certainty, we must analyze motivations, hidden, unconscious, or otherwise.

    Fe-ers tend to have a sense of what's collectively "ideal". Speaking as an Fi dom, idealism is somewhat of a bad addiction for me, though I quietly scrutinize everything according to my own standards, which are often not even particularly defined. It seems that I have difficulty defining those ideals or even coming forth with them to others because they are so tightly woven to my own body of thought - my own giant web of what different shit makes an impression on me. Laying it all out would be as time consuming as dissecting a blue whale.

    So I'm going to assume that it's easier for Fe-ers to vocalize those impressions because they are more relative to the world. So demonstrable. Do you dress nice? Are you of esteem to us? Is the show popular? Should a program be "good"? Are you a crack whore? Etc. etc.

    So Fe-ers are more aware of those interpersonal doodads. It doesn't necessarily mean that they're taking advantage of them, being underhanded, or even coddling them.

    Wight?

    Dunno. I think my N fell out. I'd better go find it.
    The beauty of a living thing is not the atoms that go into it, but the way those atoms are put together. ~ rCoxI ~ INfj ~ 5w6 so/sp

  7. #257
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ginkgo View Post
    Ok, that was my shitty attempt at being blow-by-blow logical.

    Just forget I said that.

    Functions are cognitive mechanics, not behavior. While they do correspond and correlate with behavior, there are is no viable way in which we can observe behavior and explain through functions with any certitude. We can make guesses. We can even be correct, but we will never know. It is a practice of conjecture and theorizing. Matters are made even more complicated in that multiple functions may become conscious within the span of a short span of time. Let's say microseconds. Even if only one function is is possession of consciousness at any point in time, all 8 may bear the fruit of a single behavior lasting only seconds. Order of preference has nothing to do with the line of reasoning that leads one from function->behavior; however, I'm sure there are demonstrable correlations between type and behavior.

    That said, if we are to discuss functions with any sense of certainty, we must analyze motivations, hidden, unconscious, or otherwise.

    Fe-ers tend to have a sense of what's collectively "ideal". Speaking as an Fi dom, idealism is somewhat of a bad addiction for me, though I quietly scrutinize everything according to my own standards, which are often not even particularly defined. It seems that I have difficulty defining those ideals or even coming forth with them to others because they are so tightly woven to my own body of thought - my own giant web of what different shit makes an impression on me. Laying it all out would be as time consuming as dissecting a blue whale.

    So I'm going to assume that it's easier for Fe-ers to vocalize those impressions because they are more relative to the world. So demonstrable. Do you dress nice? Are you of esteem to us? Is the show popular? Should a program be "good"? Are you a crack whore? Etc. etc.

    So Fe-ers are more aware of those interpersonal doodads. It doesn't necessarily mean that they're taking advantage of them, being underhanded, or even coddling them.

    Wight?



    I've always had a hard time being able to relate to, care about, or articulate the bolded, but even more so when I was younger, because I think as I've gotten older I may have more shadow-y or pseudo-Fe.

    The only one of those you listed that I really grasp at all is "are you of esteem to us" and that may be because of being an Extrovert and an Enneagram 6 rather than having Fe.

  8. #258
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    Quote Originally Posted by Burning Rave View Post
    Yep, looks like you didn't read the post before the one you just quoted.

    Thank you for lying to yourself. In your own words, you're being fake.

    Your toughness to call a person a degenerative word was just a mask.

    Thank you.
    LOL no kidding, you actually me seriously in me telling you to jump off a bridge? wow... learn to lighten up or stop being such a pussy!.

  9. #259
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ginkgo View Post
    Fe-ers tend to have a sense of what's collectively "ideal". Speaking as an Fi dom, idealism is somewhat of a bad addiction for me, though I quietly scrutinize everything according to my own standards, which are often not even particularly defined. It seems that I have difficulty defining those ideals or even coming forth with them to others because they are so tightly woven to my own body of thought - my own giant web of what different shit makes an impression on me. Laying it all out would be as time consuming as dissecting a blue whale.

    So I'm going to assume that it's easier for Fe-ers to vocalize those impressions because they are more relative to the world. So demonstrable. Do you dress nice? Are you of esteem to us? Is the show popular? Should a program be "good"? Are you a crack whore? Etc. etc.

    So Fe-ers are more aware of those interpersonal doodads. It doesn't necessarily mean that they're taking advantage of them, being underhanded, or even coddling them.

    Wight?
    I consider Fe sort of like how you described it (with a slight mix of Ne and Ni.) Fe is something macro while Fi would be micro.

    We can take the "American Dream" as an example, everyone has a sense of what the American Dream embodies, but each one of us also have slight variations in what we think the American Dream is. Those slight variations make up the American Dream as a whole, just as there wouldn't be an American Dream without those variations. We decided to build one idea through all those values and variations so that that one idea encompasses those variations.

    For some, their American Dream can include getting rich, having freedom, having a better life, owning a home, living without feeling threatened by their old country, living equally with his/her peers, or etc. But all these are still part of the American Dream (or not part of the original American Dream if you are a Si addict that doesn't want it changed .)

    Thus, we call it the "American Dream". It is under one banner, but it has many variations.

  10. #260
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