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  1. #41
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CurlyJoe View Post
    Of course, you're right. I know what needs to be done, but it's still difficult to communicate it a way that's opposite to your type. I can prepare like crazy by reading about personality types and by considering how I want to change my behavior, but when the rubber hits the road I often revert to type and only realize it later.
    I hear ya. It all seems easier to figure out in retrospect. She's got to feel good though if you feel that it's worth researching enough to even understand where the problems might lie!

  2. #42
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janea View Post
    Interesting observation! I would think that has to do with the J part....there's some rigidity there that most P's I know are not as prone to. It can be hard to see outside of our little box. I think we not only have a tendency to put other people in boxes but we put ourselves in boxes as well, trying to figure ourselves out and establish an identity (again having to do with security & safety) and that tendency can create "blind spots" like you mentioned.
    Despite initial rigidity, I can appreciate that INFJs usually DO come around perspective-wise, but then the other part that gets me is they don't admit that it was at your prompting. I'll tell my INFJ "The situation is likely X" and he'll be like, "No, no, I think it's Y". Then a week later, he'll say, "I've realized the situation is likely X". Then I really have to bite my tongue to not say "I told you so".

    Also, while most INFJ door slams are permanent & not enacted without good reason (most NFJs I know are very loyal & in it for the long haul), some can be frivolous & unwarranted, in which case, treat them as such. My INFJ aunt door slams my family every so many years, but she weasels her way back into the family eventually like nothing happened. I see this as a perspective shift also; she's become aware that no one was as insufferable as she thought & that she overreacted, but she'll never admit it outright. Thankfully, my ISFJ mom has stopped extending her the olive branch (when she has done nothing wrong); ignoring my aunt's hissy fits seems to work just as well, it just takes a bit longer. I notice her immediate family handles her this way also (ignore - run & hide if necessary), but unfortunately, no one can call her on it....
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  3. #43
    Member Tofu562's Avatar
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    How does one get into a relationship with an INFJ... That is the question!

  4. #44
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tofu562 View Post
    How does one get into a relationship with an INFJ... That is the question!
    You're an NFP - just be YOU :P .

    I know I'm a magnet for NFJ men. I'm not complaining either .
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  5. #45
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CurlyJoe View Post
    Yes! I agree that INFJs are easily spooked and that they see trends in little things, but I struggle with this. As an ISTP, I also analyze things and see trends, but one or two data points do not make a trend.

    I feel that my INFJ girlfriend often overreacts. If I am unresponsive during a phone call and say that it's because I'm tired, she rarely takes that at face value. No, she has to read something else into it. There must be a problem in the relationship. I'm no longer interested. Whereas if she is unresponsive and says she is tired, I believe her and think nothing more of it. Only if it was repeated often would I look for other reasons.
    This is a good point. And a very good example too! I had the same problem during the first year or so of my relationship, and it took me a long time to learn that when my boyfriend sounds like he doesn't want to talk to me, it's just because he is tired or stressed out and it has nothing to do with me or the relationship. It's most likely that your INFJ feels somewhat responsible for the less-than-happy conversation and thinks she must be doing something wrong, or that you are mad at her, or you're no longer happy about being with her.

    It takes time -- perhaps quite a long time -- and a lot of reassurance that your tone of voice is NOT an indication of your level of interest before your INFJ will realize that this is really the case. I know this sounds stupid, but Ni + Fe is programmed to take into account all non-verbal signs as well, which includes tone of voice, choice of words, conversation flow, length of conversation, time of conversation, what you talked about in the last conversation, yes, everything, to make sure they understand all there is to understand. Taking things literally is very unnatural and a very foreign concept for INFJs. Over time, if your behavior is consistent, she will learn to trust you and understand that there is really NO hidden meaning.

    I can be on my best behavior for months, but if I do one thing wrong, she will still be spooked.
    INFJs are very, very slow to open up, and very, very slow to trust. My boyfriend said this as well: "One little slip and you're that sad?" Well, the INFJ tends to interpret something like this as a sign that deep down you don't want to do what you have been doing so great for months, and the 'slip' is your 'true self' surfacing. And, of course, this leads to all sorts of crazy thoughts like how you might not be compatible or how she is trying to change you too much and will eventually make you unhappy or how it's not going to work.

    Wow, this post makes INFJs sound neurotic

    One thing I think I should mention is a little note on the Fe-language. If you mention right at the beginning of the phone call that you had a rough day and are tired she will tune in to that. (How does this work? This is Fe on your part anticipating that the felicity of the conversation will be affected and asking the other party to adjust. She will "adjust" to it by not taking the 'tired tone of voice' personally and paying more attention to comforting you and making sure you are happy. All this is natural for her, perhaps even unconscious. "Our happiness" is the goal, so if you can make her understand where you are coming from, you have created the "us" and she will do everything to make "us" happy)

    Similarly, if you have to say no to something, break your word, cannot spend time with her, or do anything that she will feel negatively about, make sure you tell her about the 'fix' immediately after the bad news. "I know we were supposed to go out tonight, but there's this report at work that needs finishing and my boss wants it now. So how about we do popcorn and dvd later instead? You get to pick the movie!" This shows consideration for the "us" and she'll be all sweet and loving when you get home
    4w5 sp/sx EII

  6. #46
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CurlyJoe View Post
    Even though I've complained a little here, I do realize the big payoff that awaits should I successfully navigate the minefield.
    You both are in the Ti and Fe camp, so with a lot of communication there's a very good chance that it will be a happy and fulfilling relationship
    4w5 sp/sx EII

  7. #47
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huxley3112 View Post
    I dated, lived with, and was engaged to an INFJ for about 5 years. I have never experienced anything close to what they call the "INFJ doorslam" and wonder if I/E nfp's might just be immune to it. Or I had a ridiculously persistent INFJ on my hands.

    I also have not experiened this difficulty of getting INFJ's to open up, romantically. Friends are a different story. I think that when you get like partners together, in the case of NF-NF, alot of defense mechanisms just naturally fall down, without one even completely realizing it at the time.

    In any of my NF-NF pairings, things came together very quickly. And while the infj and infp might seem to have all these pre-reqs of potential mates, I don't seem them play out as much IRL. It's easy to analyze this from afar, theoretically, but don't forget that both are tremendously romantic, wanting to be understood, and willing to go to hell and back for someone they love. So I guess what I'm saying is that it's possible that initially it looks hard, but once they have their minds set up, INFJ's will move fucking mountains to keep the relation. If that means they have to adjust expectations, be sometimes insanely tolerant, they do this. Mine did.
    Yep, there's a weird quality about Fi that turns the INFJ's world upside down and the normal tricks don't work and they can't really say what it is but they get intrigued and can't get enough of it even if it leads to the path of doom

    Edit: Oh ya, the one ENORMOUS exception.. INFJ's MUST have security. They carefully weigh up the potential and possibilities for the two of you to build the life that they have in their minds. If an INFJ falls in love with someone that is unable to do this, they are at a TERRIBLE cross-roads, and it can drive them quite literally insane. A healther INFJ might let you go, as they should.. and a less healthy INFJ will try endlessly to conform or mold you.
    Oh, this is soooo true I don't have words to describe how.

    Sorry it didn't work out for you guys
    4w5 sp/sx EII

  8. #48
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 21% View Post
    This is a good point. And a very good example too! I had the same problem during the first year or so of my relationship, and it took me a long time to learn that when my boyfriend sounds like he doesn't want to talk to me, it's just because he is tired or stressed out and it has nothing to do with me or the relationship. It's most likely that your INFJ feels somewhat responsible for the less-than-happy conversation and thinks she must be doing something wrong, or that you are mad at her, or you're no longer happy about being with her.

    It takes time -- perhaps quite a long time -- and a lot of reassurance that your tone of voice is NOT an indication of your level of interest before your INFJ will realize that this is really the case. I know this sounds stupid, but Ni + Fe is programmed to take into account all non-verbal signs as well, which includes tone of voice, choice of words, conversation flow, length of conversation, time of conversation, what you talked about in the last conversation, yes, everything, to make sure they understand all there is to understand. Taking things literally is very unnatural and a very foreign concept for INFJs. Over time, if your behavior is consistent, she will learn to trust you and understand that there is really NO hidden meaning.


    INFJs are very, very slow to open up, and very, very slow to trust. My boyfriend said this as well: "One little slip and you're that sad?" Well, the INFJ tends to interpret something like this as a sign that deep down you don't want to do what you have been doing so great for months, and the 'slip' is your 'true self' surfacing. And, of course, this leads to all sorts of crazy thoughts like how you might not be compatible or how she is trying to change you too much and will eventually make you unhappy or how it's not going to work.

    Wow, this post makes INFJs sound neurotic

    One thing I think I should mention is a little note on the Fe-language. If you mention right at the beginning of the phone call that you had a rough day and are tired she will tune in to that. (How does this work? This is Fe on your part anticipating that the felicity of the conversation will be affected and asking the other party to adjust. She will "adjust" to it by not taking the 'tired tone of voice' personally and paying more attention to comforting you and making sure you are happy. All this is natural for her, perhaps even unconscious. "Our happiness" is the goal, so if you can make her understand where you are coming from, you have created the "us" and she will do everything to make "us" happy)

    Similarly, if you have to say no to something, break your word, cannot spend time with her, or do anything that she will feel negatively about, make sure you tell her about the 'fix' immediately after the bad news. "I know we were supposed to go out tonight, but there's this report at work that needs finishing and my boss wants it now. So how about we do popcorn and dvd later instead? You get to pick the movie!" This shows consideration for the "us" and she'll be all sweet and loving when you get home
    Huge YESes to all of this!!!!!!!!

  9. #49
    Junior Member janea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 21% View Post
    And, of course, this leads to all sorts of crazy thoughts like how you might not be compatible or how she is trying to change you too much and will eventually make you unhappy or how it's not going to work.
    so true, so funny, and yet so sad...... this spiral of thinking has gotten me into so much trouble!!!! for me it tends to go from "it's not going to work" to "let's just break up right now!" or "screw it, I'm just gonna do whatever the hell I want because this relationship is a joke". Which is INCREDIBLY immature and unhealthy! It's something I'm really working hard on now....but it's interesting how quickly the thought process can spiral out like that and go to the destructive extreme! scary!
    The most beautiful people we have known are those who have known defeat, known suffering, known struggle, known loss, and have found their way out of the depths. These persons have an appreciation, a sensitivity and an understanding of life that fills them with compassion, gentleness, and a deep loving concern. Beautiful people do not just happen. ~ Elisabeth Kubler-Ross

  10. #50
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    This is an interesting thread. It's what I visualize in my mind about friendships with INFJ's, and what I imagine they are looking for and thinking.

    Nice but a little scary to see it all laid out plain like this.
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

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