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  1. #71
    Per Ardua Metamorphosis's Avatar
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    But in the end it all comes down to functions. What's important isn't I and N and F and J. It's the introverted or extroverted nature of the functions and how they interact.
    "You will always be fond of me. I represent to you all the sins you never had the courage to commit."

    Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions, and can never pretend to any other office
    than to serve and obey them. - David Hume

  2. #72
    Furry Critter with Claws Kiddo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ByMySword View Post
    And I am a little atypical.
    Quite. Ultimately, you are the only person who can determine what your type is. From what you display here, I am inclined to believe you are an ENFJ.

    Quote Originally Posted by Metamorphosis View Post
    But in the end it all comes down to functions. What's important isn't I and N and F and J. It's the introverted or extroverted nature of the functions and how they interact.
    Same functions, different order.

    INFJ - Ni, Fe, Ti, Se
    ENFJ - Fe, Ni, Se, Ti

    So it is perfectly percievable that an ENFJ could believe they are an INFJ, especially if they are male and don't want to demonstrate a dominant Feeling function.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
    OMNi: Wisdom at the cost of Sanity.

  3. #73
    ByMySword
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Quite. Ultimately, you are the only person who can determine what your type is. From what you display here, I am inclined to believe you are an ENFJ.
    Like I said, I'm like this here because I'm comfortable. If I met you on the street, I probably wouldn't be this way. Of course, I can be more outgoing to strangers, but it doesn't come naturally. This is something I've forced myself to do over time. By making myself go against my nature, I've somewhat conquered it. I can appear an extrovert, but it isn't natural by far. I just adopt the "fuck it" attitude. lol

    Everything I've ever read on INFJs fits me to a T. lol. There are some aspects of ENFJs that fit me, but not as much. I would say that by nature, I'm an INFJ. Even though I'm an atypical one. I think my extraversion is more learned behavior. If you had met me in high school, you wouldn't have even known I was there. My first love kind of changed that. In order to win her, I made myself become more extraverted. When I realized that I made more friends that way and got more positive attention, I adopted it as part of my arsenal. But I'm still an introvert at heart.

    I found this helpful:

    Extraversion and introversion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

  4. #74
    Furry Critter with Claws Kiddo's Avatar
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    I would say that if you have developed to the point that extroversion is your main preference then you are no longer an INFJ. Who said you are stuck in one type for your entire life? Maybe you were an INFJ, and events in your life have changed how you fundamentally think and now you are an ENFJ.

    But since you are insistent that you are an introvert, I'll leave it be.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
    OMNi: Wisdom at the cost of Sanity.

  5. #75
    Senior Member alcea rosea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ByMySword View Post
    Also, is hiding your true self a trait of INFJs? I didn't think it was. I thought we usually confide in everyone as well. I was reading Alcea Rosea's experience with meeting an INFJ, and felt that in that respect that I was different from her friend. Her friend didn't want people to know her true self. Not me at all. Rather, I want everyone to know the real me, even though sometimes I can confide too much. Many times I bet I put people in the same position that I'm in when people confide in me. So I try to not to do that as much.
    Hiding the true self might not be INFJ trait. Maybe this friend of mine had some bad experiences in her life and that why she preferred to hide herself and show her true self only to few people. Or maybe she just enjoyed to see people trying to figure her out. Who knows?

  6. #76
    ByMySword
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    I would say that if you have developed to the point that extroversion is your main preference then you are no longer an INFJ. Who said you are stuck in one type for your entire life? Maybe you were an INFJ, and events in your life have changed how you fundamentally think and now you are an ENFJ.
    I never said that it was my main preference. I just said I can act extroverted if I feel it would help me. And usually I have to have a friend there to help me feel more comfortable. As much as I can convince someone, its still painfully uncomfortable for me to be that way. But sometimes it is necessary. And since I broke up with the girlfriend 3 yrs ago, I've gradually grown more introverted again. No need to impress her anymore anyway. But the extroversion tool is still there for me to use at my disposal. So I'm still an INFJ.

    Actually, now that I think about it, it could be that I adopt my shadow type in order to be extraverted. Of course, I'm still learning about those, so I don't know.

    But even so, I don't think I have to be shy in order to be an Introvert. I can be charismatic and still have the values of an introvert, which is the real way you can tell an introvert.

  7. #77
    Furry Critter with Claws Kiddo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ByMySword View Post
    As much as I can convince someone, its still painfully uncomfortable for me to be that way.
    Uncomfortable? In what way?

    Actually, now that I think about it, it could be that I adopt my shadow type in order to be extroverted. Of course, I'm still learning about those, so I don't know.
    Convert to an ESTP eh? I think that is only typical when under stress, otherwise it requires a large amount of energy.

    I can be charismatic and still have the values of an introvert, which is the real way you can tell an introvert.
    What are the values of an introvert vs. an extrovert?
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
    OMNi: Wisdom at the cost of Sanity.

  8. #78
    ByMySword
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Uncomfortable? In what way?
    Well, ok. Like right now I'm comfortable. Don't know why I'm comfortable on a forum. But in rl, when I'm assuming the role of an extrovert, it just doesn't feel natural. I don't know how to explain it. I make myself "feel" like I would if I was immediately comfortable. Its a mental thing. Now there is a bright side to this. If I'm talking to this person for an extended period of time, then I will hopefully gradually become comfortable. Then I become more myself. Its funny, even though I'm acting like an extrovert, I'm still hiding my true self. Hmmm. I just realized that. Go figure. Once I become comfortable, then I begin to show the real me.


    Convert to an ESTP eh? I think that is only typical when under stress, otherwise it requires a large amount of energy.
    Stress, huh? Yep, then that would explain it. Social interactions are very stressful for me in rl.

    What are the values of an introvert vs. an extrovert?
    An introverted person is likely to enjoy time spent alone and find less reward in time spent with large groups of people (although they tend to enjoy interactions with close friends, and are in many cases married). They prefer to concentrate on a single activity at a time and like to observe situations before they participate.

    Introversion is not the same as shyness, though introverts may also be shy. Introverts choose solitary over social activities by preference, whereas shy people avoid social encounters out of fear.

    An introvert is energized when alone. Introverts tend to "fade" when with people and can easily become overstimulated with too many others around. Introverts tend to think before speaking.

    An extravert is energized when around other people. Extraverts tend to "fade" when alone and can easily become bored without other people around. Extraverts tend to think as they speak. When given the chance, an extravert will talk with someone else rather than sit alone and think.

  9. #79
    Member Shinzon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    I would say that if you have developed to the point that extroversion is your main preference then you are no longer an INFJ.
    I was under the impression that your type preference never changes, just your reaction to stimuli which is equal parts learned behavior and type. An INFJ doesn't become a extrovert just by developing a outgoing interaction style, no more than an F becomes a T if forced to work in a field for which hard logic is required; you just become more comfortable using your less dominant functions. Look at all those male INFJs who have claimed to favor their thinking ability and shunned their use of Fe. Are these guys INTJs because they've spent their life focusing on their T because of social pressures?

    For what its worth, I identify with most of what ByMySword is saying. I too have been often mistaken as an extrovert because I have such a gregarious speaking style. Since my early teens I have spent a lot of time developing this and I probably learned most of it from my ENFP best friend because I was quite reserved until I started hanging out with her. When I speak, I speak with a learned enthusiasm because I've witnessed it work so well for her so many times. It's just hard getting me to say more than a few words to anyone other than my close friends and interacting with people as a whole is extremely draining for me, especially strangers. This fake extroversion may also be a factor of my youth (and it looks like BMS is pretty close to my age).

    The strength of each cognitive process is not set in stone, just which one is running the show; the hierarchical order. You may think I'm an ENFJ after you get a couple of drinks in me and I'm talking my best friends ear off, but appearances can be deceiving depending on circumstance.

  10. #80
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    I think a comfortable INF can extrovert pretty well without being an extrovert. If I'm comfortable, I'm fairly outgoing and chatty. I don't have the charisma of an extrovert, but the fact that I'm for real, I don't take life too seriously, and I treat everyone like my equal does shine through sometimes. Charisma is, in part, making people feel better when you are around than when you are not, so it's not a stretch for a caring person to have a kind of charisma of their own, even if they are introverted.

    Edit: But you know, after I'm done chatting up the teachers and the cashiers, etc, I'm hiding in my room with a book.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

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