[Fi] Why does everyone hate on Fi?

[OrangeAppled]

Yeah I think Elfboy was correct that Ne is more hated IRL than Fi.

Nah, IRL, Ne-doms are charming & funny & navigate the social world pretty well. They might appear impulsive & provoking to non Ne types at times, but I don't think they're misunderstood or disliked on the whole. Fi-doms may not be hated, but will find themselves misunderstood more & inspiring indifference, if not hate. As an INFP, to me, ENFPs seem to pull of weird-charming better; us Fi-doms, unfortunately, seem more weird-creepy.

The biggest gulf is how Ni is perceived online (in MBTI communities that is) vs. real life. IRL, I see Ni-doms regularly being dislike by many, viewed as odd/creepy/arrogant/etc, whereas online they seem almost worshiped.

 

[Little Linguist]

Why has no one called them on this? Look at what we have: (1) Fi is responsible for the Declaration of Independence and civil liberties, (2) only NJs and NPs question authority, and (3) NPs have been historically persecuted. WTF.

They have overgeneralized, which is common, I guess.

 

[Little Linguist]

Nah, IRL, Ne-doms are charming & funny & navigate the social world pretty well. They might appear impulsive & provoking to non Ne types at times, but I don't think they're misunderstood or disliked on the whole. Fi-doms may not be hated, but will find themselves misunderstood more & inspiring indifference, if not hate. As an INFP, to me, ENFPs seem to pull of weird-charming better; us Fi-doms, unfortunately, seem more weird-creepy.

The biggest gulf is how Ni is perceived online (in MBTI communities that is) vs. real life. IRL, I see Ni-doms regularly being dislike by many, viewed as odd/creepy/arrogant/etc, whereas online they seem almost worshiped.

I can live with 'weird-charming,' hehe.

 

[Thalassa]

I'm just curious: How does it manifest differently?

My instinctive forum example is to compare me (ENFP) with Simulated World (ENTP). Equal enthusiasm for certain topics, slight leaning toward preaching and cajoling, but totally different methods.

Look at the way an ENFP on the forum "causes trouble" and the way our ENTPs "cause trouble." A lot of it is nothing more than play, but some of it is very SRS and passionately driven. I think Ne doms collectively cause more "trouble" than any other types, though don't get me wrong there's all different kinds of trouble to be had.

What OrangeAppled said up there about us being "provoking" is probably what causes others the most annoyance IRL.

I recently posted about this in my blog, and KDude gave a video example of a passionate ENTP.

 

[Randomnity]

Why has no one called them on this? Look at what we have: (1) Fi is responsible for the Declaration of Independence and civil liberties, (2) only NJs and NPs question authority, and (3) NPs have been historically persecuted. WTF.

No point. Debating this would be like critiquing dada art.

(it can be done, it's just pointless)

 

[Orangey]

No point. Debating this would be like critiquing dada art.

True, but it should at least be noted and called stupid. Think of the children.

 

[Thalassa]

Nah, IRL, Ne-doms are charming & funny & navigate the social world pretty well. They might appear impulsive & provoking to non Ne types at times, but I don't think they're misunderstood or disliked on the whole. Fi-doms may not be hated, but will find themselves misunderstood more & inspiring indifference, if not hate. As an INFP, to me, ENFPs seem to pull of weird-charming better; us Fi-doms, unfortunately, seem more weird-creepy.

The biggest gulf is how Ni is perceived online (in MBTI communities that is) vs. real life. IRL, I see Ni-doms regularly being dislike by many, viewed as odd/creepy/arrogant/etc, whereas online they seem almost worshiped.

Yeah I agree about Ni doms, especially INTJs...I know I dated an INTJ when I was about 20, and I remember one of my friends being like "geez, god, why him? he's such an arrogant prick! WHY? WHY?" I also had this INTJ math professor who I ADORED (as a person, not in a romantic way), and other students, and some professors even, gave me odd looks because of my fondness for him, citing him as being "weird, creepy, um what? that guy?"

Yeah I agree that ENFPs can persuade others with a zany charm. I just would think that Fi doms (IxFPs) would be less intrusive or annoying to others, on the whole.

 

[Glycerine]

you've got to be kidding me. Ne is THE most hated on function in IRL. any extremist authoritarian state will basically kill you if you use Ne (aka, the people who say "what if you're wrong" when the state is trying to brain wash them"

HAHA! Great point. Not only that, but IRL non NE users seem to think Ne users are just flat out Nut Jobs.

For real? I thought they were perceived as the "crazy but cool" folks.

 

[Viridian]

Ne types are quite popular in rom-coms, especially, of course, ENFPs. Their "job" is to get the resident ISxJ out of hir "rut", like in Along Came Polly. In RL, they're either loved or considered annoying, I think.

 

[OrangeAppled]

Yeah I agree about Ni doms, especially INTJs...I know I dated an INTJ when I was about 20, and I remember one of my friends being like "geez, god, why him? he's such an arrogant prick! WHY? WHY?" I also had this INTJ math professor who I ADORED (as a person, not in a romantic way), and other students, and some professors gave me odd looks because of my fondness for him, citing him as being "weird, creepy, um what? that guy?"

Yeah I agree that ENFPs can persuade others with a zany charm. I just would think that Fi doms (IxFPs) would be less intrusive or annoying to others, on the whole.

Yes, we're probably less "annoying" in that respect, but Ne-doms are intrusive like a hyper puppy dog....they're still cute & you wanna play with them . On the one hand, I can't stand my ENTP dad, but I'll also admit he is humorous & intelligent, and I can see why he has many friends, even if they think he is a bit odd.

Fi-doms are certainly less intrusive, but that can also be read as stand-offish, unfriendly, & other negative traits. Like I said though, IRL, I think we inspire indifference more than anything. I don't find myself hated much either. I don't polarize people the way I see Ni-doms do.

I would say that Fi is not really hated so much as dismissed & trivialized. It's seen as silly & without much usefulness. I just quoted this recently in another thread, but this sums up the attitude, IMO:

The situation [of Fi being trivialized] is complicated by the fact that only 6% of Americans use Introverted Feeling as their primary approach to life. This means that a great many types associate this function largely with its bottom-rung potential for impressionism and sentimentality.

 

[Little Linguist]

Marmie, that's really fascinating...I see so much of myself reflected in there. I also have bursts of enthusiasm which just make people smile and laugh, but I can't help it - it's just so effervescent -

Because of his capacity, when orientated more towards men than things, to make an intuitive diagnosis of their abilities and range of usefulness, he can also 'make' men. His capacity to inspire his fellow-men with courage, or to kindle enthusiasm for something new, is unrivalled, although he may have forsworn it by the morrow. The more powerful and vivid his intuition, the more is his subject fused and blended with the divined possibility. He animates it; he presents it in plastic shape and with convincing fire; he almost embodies it. It is not a mere histrionic display, but a fate.

Yep. But often it comes at a price:

a. I lose myself in it. At the end of the day, I have no life. Argh.

b. I don't have structure.

c. I lose myself in activism to the point that I lose focus and question why I even started.

Typical evaluation:

Good: varied methods, always interesting, always different, enthusiastic, interested in the students, accommodates individual preferences, never boring, motivates students

Bad: lack of structure, sometimes too interested in what the students want (e.g. not strict enough, not simply telling people what to do).

Hmm. My advisor told me "You have structure, but it's not direct or linear. You have to sketch your structure so that people know where you're going."

Or here's another comment, "At first, when you started, I wondered, 'Will this thing have a structure?' But as you went on, I saw how everything fit together, and I really liked it."

 

[KDude]

I'm not sure I am hated. Besides, if anything, I'm probably more self-critical than anyone here can match. I've got it covered, thank you very much.

 

[Thalassa]

Marmie, that's really fascinating...I see so much of myself reflected in there. I also have bursts of enthusiasm which just make people smile and laugh, but I can't help it - it's just so effervescent -



Yep. But often it comes at a price:

a. I lose myself in it. At the end of the day, I have no life. Argh.

b. I don't have structure.

c. I lose myself in activism to the point that I lose focus and question why I even started.

Typical evaluation:

Good: varied methods, always interesting, always different, enthusiastic, interested in the students, accommodates individual preferences, never boring, motivates students

Bad: lack of structure, sometimes too interested in what the students want (e.g. not strict enough, not simply telling people what to do).

Hmm. My advisor told me "You have structure, but it's not direct or linear. You have to sketch your structure so that people know where you're going."

Or here's another comment, "At first, when you started, I wondered, 'Will this thing have a structure?' But as you went on, I saw how everything fit together, and I really liked it."

I think the most hated thing for me is when I get enthusiastic about something then change my mind a few days later.

Especially since some people have taken me so seriously because I can come across so strongly.

I guess that's what they mean about "abandoning" something "cold-bloodedly." It's less cold-blooded, and just that I saw the error in my thinking, or thought about the situation from a different angle, and realized a new way of thinking is in order.

That can get embarrassing. However, when I keep being passionate about something over a long period of time, over and over again, over the course of weeks months and years, that's when to take me seriously. If you keep hearing or reading it.

 

[Little Linguist]

I think the most hated thing for me is when I get enthusiastic about something then change my mind a few days later.

Especially since some people have taken me so seriously because I can come across so strongly.

I guess that's what they mean about "abandoning" something "cold-bloodedly." It's less cold-blooded, and just that I saw the error in my thinking, or thought about the situation from a different angle, and realized a new way of thinking is in order.

That can get embarrassing. However, when I keep being passionate about something over a long period of time, over and over again, over the course of weeks months and years, that's when to take me seriously. If you keep hearing or reading it.

OMG You do that? I do that, too. And then I lose credibility because people think I just get excited about anything. But I really AM that excited. I just noticed something later because I don't have an eye for detail.

 

[Thalassa]

OMG You do that? I do that, too. And then I lose credibility because people think I just get excited about anything. But I really AM that excited. I just noticed something later because I don't have an eye for detail.

YES! Exactly! Either someone else points something out to me that shifts my perception, or I notice something on my own. But nothing that I declare in an emphatic manner is false, it's very real enthusiasm or passion, it's just that I may have...missed something. Or thought better of it.

It does cause some people to think you're not credible (you, the general you, Ne doms, maybe ENFPs) when these things occur. Yet it is always totally sincere.

This hearkens to a thread I posted in last night where an ISxJ said they don't trust ENFPs to know who they really like or are friends with. Well...I genuinely like all the people I'm friends with. But you know if I like you *particularly* because I give you *moar* attention, or keep coming back to you *repeatedly over time.*

It's pretty much the same with my Fi morals and emphatic ideas. You can be sure that I mean what I say at any given time (unless I'm in some situation where I feel that lying is necessary for survival reasons, which is pretty damn rare) ...but if you want to know what I'm really made of, note what I keep coming back to repeatedly and consistently. Because the Fi is definitely there, it totally is. It's just buried sometimes under all that Ne excitement.

I lack structure, too, BTW. I totally relate with you on that.

It's good to find people who understand!!!

 

[skylights]

Why has no one called them on this? Look at what we have: (1) Fi is responsible for the Declaration of Independence and civil liberties, (2) only NJs and NPs question authority, and (3) NPs have been historically persecuted. WTF.

yeah i don't know, i don't buy all this glorious persecution crap either.

 

[Thalassa]

yeah i don't know, i don't buy all this glorious persecution crap either.

Lord Elfboy, Most High, is Duke of Delusionville.

Don't contradict him.

 

[INTPness]

Why does everyone hate on Fi?

Cuz nobody knows how to "love on Fi". Scientists from around the globe are still trying to figure this out (mainly NT scientists). Experts say we should have a cure for cancer by the year 2020. Some 50 years after that, we may have more insight into Fi and how to properly handle it/give it the love it deserves.

 

[Anew Leaf]

Cuz nobody knows how to "love on Fi". Scientists from around the globe are still trying to figure this out (mainly NT scientists). Experts say we should have a cure for cancer by the year 2020. Some 50 years after that, we may have more insight into Fi and how to properly handle it/give it the love it deserves.

I have a pet bunny, Ebony. She is ADORABLE! But she is a bunny and therefore a prey animal. Bunnies are social animals and like to play games. She sometimes wants to play games with me. Sometimes that game is "chase me!"

It starts off with her coming near me and looking at me expectantly with big, soft brown eyes. I put my hand down to pet her, and she hops away a few feet... turns... looks at me again. I get up, get closer, and away she leaps! hopping another few feet away. She eyes me again, all alertness, ears pricked up, one paw half off the floor.

"Ah, you want to be chased!" I think to myself.

So I comply, and shuffle closer to her, watch her hop away.... I shuffle closer.... she hops... This continues for a few minutes.

I see her little bunny brain whirring. "I'm being chased! This is so much fun!" (hop hop HOP!)

And then it changes....to.....

"OMG IM BEING CHASED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" *running, thumping hind leg, ears flattened, eyes bulging out, peeking out from behind one of my chairs, her little nose going a mile a minute*

Eventually she will calm down and remember that it is me, the one who pets her and brings her treats, and she will creep out to be snuggled.

In conclusion:

1st RULE: You do not talk about FIGHT CLUB.

2nd RULE: You DO NOT talk about FIGHT CLUB.

 

[NegativeZero]

They are just so full of themselves.

I mean, kind of. My Fi is really selfish. Not to mention, Fi happens to be the source of pretty much all navel gazing. Also, Fi is pretty useless. I find if I neglect my Fi too long, I start to feel unhappy and dysfunctional. It's a shame I'm an NF because I prefer to rely on Ti and Ne for most situations.