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  1. #21
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Is this thread billed for work or play?
    Or do INFPs prefer play over work?
    Just wait until someone asks a serious question that engages Fi. You've been around here longer than I have. You're familiar with the INFP wall-o-texts that ensue.

  2. #22
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nijntje View Post
    our flights of fancy are CLEARLY better than stinking real world stuffs
    Yeah, did I just say I wanted to be mature? Who am I kidding?

    Down the rabbit hole, I go....


  3. #23
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Is it easier for INFPs to drop straight into Ne mode?
    Why do you do that?




    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...eply&p=1545797

    like i'm one to talk
    This is from Socionics, but it still applies.. I've seen Myers address auxiliary the same (at least, in introverts).

    Creative function
    This function describes the primary mode of application of the base function. If the base function forms the core of the individual's personal quests and interests ("What's in it for me?", "What do I want to be?"), the creative function describes his main instrument for interacting with the rest of society ("How do I make contact with other people?").

    People use their creative function less than their base function and attach less personal significance to it, although due to the nature of blocked functions it is usually used in tandem with the base function. In their value system, their creative function activities seem less personally significant than their base function activities. When other people try to make this function the main criterion for everything, light irritation can arise, and the person may try to "correct" the other person's emphasis by presenting a perspective from his base function and suggesting that this is more important. Also, when other people express problems having to do with this information aspect, the person quickly takes interest and tries to present solutions — but always through his own base function. For instance, an ESFp will try to help other people solve their Fi related problems (relationships and understanding between people) through a Se perspective (making sure you know what you want and are trying to achieve it; understanding the territorial aspect of interaction; recognizing the obvious "dumb things" that people are doing that are ruining the relationship). When people get to use their creative function to help others' problems, they feel needed and fulfilled and begin to live more fully. Likewise, criticism in this area is more sensitive and unpleasant than in the base function.
    Use of the creative function — while frequent and effortless — seems to turn on and off. One moment the person may seem highly interested in this aspect, and the next — totally indifferent. This may jar people for whom this aspect of reality is of more supreme importance and who expect more consistent attention and effort in this area. A good example of this is one's interaction with their mirror partner; each person's leading function is subject to the other's creativity function, so even though both partners do share similar worldviews, they are apt to 'correct' or add on to the other's rigid and finalized points.

  4. #24
    Uniqueorn William K's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nijntje View Post
    What is Ne mode?

    My answer: Because we're awesome. and our flights of fancy are CLEARLY better than stinking real world stuffs
    That's part of it. Also, one of the things Fi does for me is separate between important and not-so-important stuff. When it's not so important stuff that needs to be extraverted, fluffy Ne mode is so much less stressful and quicker to act
    4w5, Fi>Ne>Ti>Si>Ni>Fe>Te>Se, sp > so > sx

    appreciates being appreciated, conflicted over conflicts, afraid of being afraid, bad at being bad, predictably unpredictable, consistently inconsistent, remarkably unremarkable...

    I may not agree with what you are feeling, but I will defend to death your right to have a good cry over it

    The whole problem with the world is that fools & fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts. ~ Bertrand Russell
    Likes Florence Atley liked this post

  5. #25
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JivinJeffJones View Post
    Just wait until someone asks a serious question that engages Fi. You've been around here longer than I have. You're familiar with the INFP wall-o-texts that ensue.
    Oh, I know all this, actually.
    (I'm just trying to stimulate conversation until the real questions show up!)

    And like I hinted above, I'm kind of a big Ne whore myself.
    My favorite parts of my relationships with my INFP friends are how we "play" together.

    I just have to think of a really great question that might trigger an INFP deluge of fervent diatribe. Hmmm..... Where to start?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kdude
    Creative function
    This function describes the primary mode of application of the base function. If the base function forms the core of the individual's personal quests and interests ("What's in it for me?", "What do I want to be?"), the creative function describes his main instrument for interacting with the rest of society ("How do I make contact with other people?").

    People use their creative function less than their base function and attach less personal significance to it, although due to the nature of blocked functions it is usually used in tandem with the base function. In their value system, their creative function activities seem less personally significant than their base function activities. When other people try to make this function the main criterion for everything, light irritation can arise, and the person may try to "correct" the other person's emphasis by presenting a perspective from his base function and suggesting that this is more important. Also, when other people express problems having to do with this information aspect, the person quickly takes interest and tries to present solutions — but always through his own base function. For instance, an ESFp will try to help other people solve their Fi related problems (relationships and understanding between people) through a Se perspective (making sure you know what you want and are trying to achieve it; understanding the territorial aspect of interaction; recognizing the obvious "dumb things" that people are doing that are ruining the relationship). When people get to use their creative function to help others' problems, they feel needed and fulfilled and begin to live more fully. Likewise, criticism in this area is more sensitive and unpleasant than in the base function.
    Use of the creative function — while frequent and effortless — seems to turn on and off. One moment the person may seem highly interested in this aspect, and the next — totally indifferent. This may jar people for whom this aspect of reality is of more supreme importance and who expect more consistent attention and effort in this area. A good example of this is one's interaction with their mirror partner; each person's leading function is subject to the other's creativity function, so even though both partners do share similar worldviews, they are apt to 'correct' or add on to the other's rigid and finalized points.
    Thanks for this.

    (As verification, I can see that same pattern in me too. Watch how I end up sharing Ti ideas via an Ne interface/connection pattern.... and how I end up obsessively tweaking and/or even becoming annoyed with the ENPs broad concepts that seem unnuanced to me... watch me and Oberon talk, for example.)

    I'll have to read more about this, thanks for the direction.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  6. #26
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    I definitely have "serious" questions concerning Fi (Fi is an interesting animal) but it's been my experience that Fi'ers really don't want/like those serious questions - and sometimes the dialogue becomes delicate, stressful, or even heated (both IRL and on the forum). So, if my question fits the "uncomfortable" category, just politely let me know and I'll skip on my merry way. I come not to stir up the pot, but to understand the animal that is Fi.

    I'll ask it bluntly: Why do you guys not clearly express what Fi is feeling/thinking? If you're upset, mad, angry, disappointed, frustrated, feeling ignored/betrayed, etc. - why not just tell the other person exactlly what those feelings are, which then gives that other person something tangible to work with. Basically, my confusion with this part of Fi is that if you never voice what's going on inside (plainly, clearly), then you'll probably never get any results that resemble what you're hoping for/wanting.

    If I could draw an analogy, it'd be something like this: The Fi'er really, really wants a shiny red sports car for their birthday (or a penguin, or a pony, or something along these lines). When someone asks you, "What would you like for your birthday?" (cuz they want to get you something you'll really like), you just say, "Ehhh, I dunno, a gift card"
    And, so, you end up getting a gift card and you feel upset or kind of sad that you didn't get the sports car. Well, you didn't get it cuz you didn't ask.

    Or, the Fi'er wants to spend time with someone they love. And they talk to the person they love on the phone and the person says, "Whatcha doing tonight?" And the Fi'er says, "Heh, not much." So, the other person thinks, "Hmmm, OK, they aren't doing much and I'd like to see them, but I know they like their space and I don't want to impose, so I'll just leave it at that and maybe see them next week sometime." Then they say, "OK Fi'er, good talking to you, we'll catch up next week." And then find out later that Fi'er was very upset and wanted them to come over.

    Why doesn't Fi'er just say, "Yo, check it out. I want a red sports car for my birthday and I also want you to come over tonight and hang out with me cuz I miss you." Straight up. Tell it like it is. Done! Finished! Wish granted. It can be so easy, so simple. But, instead, you never voice these Fi desires and so the other person..........never knows what it is you wanted. Inevitably, this will cause feelings of hurt and neglect and "he just doesn't know me".

    I've heard 2 different reasons for this "holding back": 1) It's hard and/or uncomfortable to express. 2) Fi'er doesn't want the other person to do something for them "just because they told them they wanted it" (thereby "prompting" the action); instead, Fi'er only wants things to be done for them without prompting, completely of the other person's free will.

    If I compare Fi to my own Ti, then yeah, I can relate that it's sometimes hard to express "complex thoughts" into mere words (and some things get lost in translation), but if I really want something, you better believe I'm coming out with it eventually.

    Why Fi'ers? Why?

    Again, if this question/probing seems in any way hostile, critical, or uncomfortable, just send me on my way and I'll leave. I think it gets touchy sometimes and that's not my intention here.
    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.


    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

  7. #27
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    You forgot the "sacrificial offerings of cute bunny, kitten, puppy, penguins, etc pictures" to help speed up the response time.

    But us Ti doms have to stick together -- I'll cover ya this time!







    There. That should cover you. Good luck!
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  8. #28
    Senor Membrane
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTPness View Post
    I've heard 2 different reasons for this "holding back": 1) It's hard and/or uncomfortable to express. 2) Fi'er doesn't want the other person to do something for them "just because they told them they wanted it" (thereby "prompting" the action); instead, Fi'er only wants things to be done for them without prompting, completely of the other person's free will.
    Yeah, you pretty much answered it yourself. I can elaborate a bit on these.

    1) It's not only that it is hard or unconfortable. It's also that I know how seriously people take words, and if I explain exactly how I feel it will give a different image of the situation. This has backfired on me so many times. I tell someone how I feel about some situation, and they completely overreact to it. I guess it's because I try so hard to explain it to the smallest detail that it all comes overwhelming to the other person and they think like I am about to explode any minute. And in fact this was not an extreme feeling like that for me. It might also be some sort of a shock to get this from a person who is outwardly quite calm and collected most of the time. So, if I tell anything about anything I am feeling unconfortable with, it is taken as some sort of a special occation that even I could be uncomfortable and uncertain about something. So, I don't tell them because they get the wrong message.

    2) Yes. Asking for people to do something for me is uncomfortable. I feel like I am imposing on them. I feel good about a situation where people know that they can trust the fact that they are important to me just being who they are, not because they do something for me. Also, when someone gives me a present, there is the expectation that I should give something back sometime in the future. I don't like putting people in situations like that because I don't like that sort of expectations myself. But this might be more prominent in myself because I don't like consumerism at all, and so, wouldn't buy stuff for people anyways and discourage people buying stuff for me.

    EDIT: BTW, the sacrificial bunny was appreciated.

  9. #29
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    LOL. Nice. Thanks, Jennifer. Those little hobgobblins definitely demand a speedy response.
    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.


    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

  10. #30
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    Yeah, you pretty much answered it yourself. I can elaborate a bit on these.

    1) It's not only that it is hard or unconfortable. It's also that I know how seriously people take words, and if I explain exactly how I feel it will give a different image of the situation. This has backfired on me so many times. I tell someone how I feel about some situation, and they completely overreact to it. I guess it's because I try so hard to explain it to the smallest detail that it all comes overwhelming to the other person and they think like I am about to explode any minute. And in fact this was not an extreme feeling like that for me. It might also be some sort of a shock to get this from a person who is outwardly quite calm and collected most of the time. So, if I tell anything about anything I am feeling unconfortable with, it is taken as some sort of a special occation that even I could be uncomfortable and uncertain about something. So, I don't tell them because they get the wrong message.

    2) Yes. Asking for people to do something for me is uncomfortable. I feel like I am imposing on them. I feel good about a situation where people know that they can trust the fact that they are important to me just being who they are, not because they do something for me. Also, when someone gives me a present, there is the expectation that I should give something back sometime in the future. I don't like putting people in situations like that because I don't like that sort of expectations myself. But this might be more prominent in myself because I don't like consumerism at all, and so, wouldn't buy stuff for people anyways and discourage people buying stuff for me.
    Thanks, nolla! Interesting. What say you about these things:

    if you never voice what's going on inside (plainly, clearly), then you'll probably never get any results that resemble what you're hoping for/wanting.
    and

    you never voice these Fi desires and so the other person..........never knows what it is you wanted. Inevitably, this will cause feelings of hurt and neglect and "he just doesn't know me".
    Oh, almost forgot:

    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.


    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

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