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  1. #41
    Senior Member copperfish17's Avatar
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    Billy: Thank you for your input - I appreciate it. Your thoughts gave me a different perspective to look at the situation from.

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy View Post
    I would have to disagree on this... I can easily see said ENFJ going on a shopping spree stressing out to get a dozen or so gifts for all these people and being a little sloppy about it. To me, judging the gift harshly seems inappropriate. Especially if you remember she didn't have to get anyone anything at all.
    Yes, that is true. The reason I felt pretty hurt was that the gift she got for me reflected nothing about our relationship and certainly barely anything about me. I know she's not a mind-reader and accept that she didn't mean to give me something I frankly hate to receive as gifts. I wouldn't have given the situation much thought if she didn't give me anything at all. It's like... I'd rather not have gotten anything as this gift makes me doubt that you know me (she said the gifts reflect each recipient's personality).

    I don't feel so hurt anymore as I've come to accept that she meant well and that there isn't much I can do about this situation. I don't blame her for anything, just myself for allowing myself to feel this way (as I've mentioned in my first post).

    And I dont know about the rest of you, but I have had friends for 7 years, hell longer then 7 years and my relationships are NEVER beholden to requirements. Anyone who requires a certain level of attention/homage from me is quickly removed from my life. I have my own life to live and its hard enough as it is without people worrying about being my "favorite" or "bff" I tell everyone the same and I wish everyone else would do the same...
    Hey, that's great. I'm in my early twenties, and the longest friendship I'm holding onto is more than 12 years long.

    Requirements? It's not that I think she HAS to give me something I like/show me more appreciation than others in order for us to remain friends. I, however, do wish my friends would understand what makes me tick and what doesn't. I don't think that's unreasonable, though I suppose it's somewhat idealistic of me to expect that.

    It's not so much that I'm upset I'm not her "favorite" or "bff" - if anything, I'm the one who typically refuses to label any of my friends my "best friend." Everyone has something unique to offer, and I'm certainly not capable of putting my friends (as opposed to acquaintances) in a hierarchy. In this case, I felt... well, misunderstood. I'm lost as to what connection she saw between me and the gift that supposedly reflects my personality.

    1. Friendship is either true or fickle.

    Based on commonalities which transcend time and distance or its merely a convenience. I have 1000s of "friends" not a single "best friend" I dont believe in it. My closest friends, for example my ENFJ pal, met on the bus in elementary school, we come and go out of each others lives, but when we are around do try to meet up every week or every other week to stay current. but there is no requirement for this. Sometimes we will go a month or two, but when we get together we never miss a beat, we go right back to where we had been. I have other friends I see more often, whom I would not mind losing at all, why? Because our relationships aren't based on meaningful connection and commonalities like my friend Dan and I, but we work near one and other and or with each other and its efficient and convenient. These people come and go without thought to the future, if they come around again I welcome them back again. I wish MORE people would view friendships this way. It seems the most mature, and friendships with requirements of time and sacrifice? I dunno to me its just bunk.
    1st bolded: To me, the LACK of this is what the ENFJ's gift seems to reflect. It's shows no understanding, no connection.

    2nd bolded: I guess this is where we differ in perspective. I don't bother keeping people who aren't consistently going to be in my life around; people don't have to be physically with me, but ideally we would contact each other on a fairly regular basis via email etc. Sure, there can be breaks, but if those breaks are too long, I don't see the point in investing in the relationship. Better a neighbor nearby than a brother far away. A nearby neighbor is more readily available to help you out in crisis. In that sense, to me, people who are with me at this moment matter the most (of course there are exceptions).

    I dont think this specific ENFJ has anything to apologize for, you issues exist outside of her, that you feel some type of way is on you and not on her. I dont agree with anyone who tells you that she has been a bad friend given the data you have provided.
    Yeah, I agree with you that the ENFJ has nothing to apologize for - as I've mentioned already in two other posts I've made in this thread. I'm still not sure where I stand with her at the moment, and it looks like I won't be able to talk to her till late May since both of us are going to be excruciatingly busy till then.

    At this point, I've decided that I'm not going to bother questioning her about our relationship. Not because I've deemed her a lost case, but because I don't see a point in doing so. If I do choose to let her slide through, it would be better to do so while I can genuinely wish her well.
    Enneagram: 5w4 5-9-2 (5w4 9w1 2w1) sp/so

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    The worst mistake people make in political arguments is assuming that the other side is not trying to do the right thing. This simple oversight makes productive conversation nearly impossible.

  2. #42
    Dali
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    So, an ENFJ called me their boyfriend... and told me they're falling in love with me... is it stupid of me to feel that I don't deserve them and that they'll come to their senses and leave any minute now? I mean, this is an extremely popular, gorgeous, successful (career wise) socialite and... I'm some weird, lanky workaholic that's a little too fond of his novels and his weed. What do they see in me? I've fallen hard but I still feel that this is an unequal dynamic and I'm holding part of myself back.

    I don't particularly want to be reassured, I need straight talk.

  3. #43
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy View Post
    Do you, ENFJs, tend to emotionally vent to the ones closest to you? I have spent a lot of time listening to my wife unload a world of emotions on me cause of a series of events that occurred that day. While she is venting, she's constantly looking for a unspoken gesture and/or a response from me which usually leads to her feeling alone and disconnected from me. Most of the time my responses are driven by my Ni which is a timely process. By the time I do respond, she's on to completely different subject leaving a huge gap for miscommunication.
    They do. My ENFJ doesn't vent very much, more because he's a man but from time to time he does. So of course I listen but my brain is 25 steps ahead of him..FIXING THE PROBLEM. That's what I do. That's what I'm really good at. But he doesn't want me to fix it. He wants me to listen. It's hard because just listening seems so goddamn useless. But that's what he wants. So I hug him and listen and kind of take over for the day if it's been really bad. I'm good with that. It's productive. I'm doing something. But I zip it with the problem solving until later, maybe.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  4. #44
    Senior Member Sparrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dali View Post
    So, an ENFJ called me their boyfriend... and told me they're falling in love with me... is it stupid of me to feel that I don't deserve them and that they'll come to their senses and leave any minute now? I mean, this is an extremely popular, gorgeous, successful (career wise) socialite and... I'm some weird, lanky workaholic that's a little too fond of his novels and his weed. What do they see in me? I've fallen hard but I still feel that this is an unequal dynamic and I'm holding part of myself back.

    I don't particularly want to be reassured, I need straight talk.
    Yes it is stupid of you to think that you don't deserve her!!! I as an ENFJ like all different types people . You shouldn't think of yourself as a lesser person! Just go for it man, don't doubt yourself!
    Fe | Ni | Se | Ti ... 3w4 ... Lawful Neutral ... Johari -Nohari

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dali View Post
    So, an ENFJ called me their boyfriend... and told me they're falling in love with me... is it stupid of me to feel that I don't deserve them and that they'll come to their senses and leave any minute now? I mean, this is an extremely popular, gorgeous, successful (career wise) socialite and... I'm some weird, lanky workaholic that's a little too fond of his novels and his weed. What do they see in me? I've fallen hard but I still feel that this is an unequal dynamic and I'm holding part of myself back.

    I don't particularly want to be reassured, I need straight talk.
    You could always flip the coin, so to speak, to get perspective. Like, why is this socialite hanging out with a fantasy(or whatever word you want) person like me? They must be looking for something, or maybe they want to learn how to be more like you. Truth is, being the socialite they are, they usually are very grounded in reality. So they might see you as beyond reality, and thus them, which is very appealing.

  6. #46
    Senior Member sciski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dali View Post
    So, an ENFJ called me their boyfriend... and told me they're falling in love with me... is it stupid of me to feel that I don't deserve them and that they'll come to their senses and leave any minute now? I mean, this is an extremely popular, gorgeous, successful (career wise) socialite and... I'm some weird, lanky workaholic that's a little too fond of his novels and his weed. What do they see in me? I've fallen hard but I still feel that this is an unequal dynamic and I'm holding part of myself back.

    I don't particularly want to be reassured, I need straight talk.
    If you're holding part of yourself back, that may later become the reason your ENFJ will break up with you. Which would be terribly ironic, so don't go there. Just enjoy it for what it is, now.

  7. #47
    Dali
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    Thanks a lot for the advice, guys.

    Unfortunately, it's been sort of overtaken by events.

    I've been a bit unhappy with my ENFJ recently. I'd started to feel like he valued his friendships more than he did our relationship and like he wanted to change who I was and, as a result, as of a week ago, started to withdraw and grow a bit unresponsive. He texted me one day and asked me if everything was ok and I texted back saying that it wasn't and very tactfully told him why I thought so.

    Big mistake.

    I got three monolithic, extremely antagonistic texts detailing every single wrong that I'd done over the past couple of months including things that he said he 'was cool with' and things he said he liked about me. I could literally feel the vitriol coming off his texts. It was clearly designed to make me feel as absolutely rotten as possible and in stark contrast to what I knew of him.

    We haven't spoken or met up in five days and he just texted saying he wants to meet up tomorrow to 'clear the air' and 'iron out our issues'. Thing is, I like him plenty but I know I'd never be able to forgive him for making me feel the way he did. Even if I were to eventually forgive him, I wouldn't be able to trust him again. The only option for me is seeking a way out.

    I could do it the 'easy way out' by withdrawing completely and cutting off contact but I'd never be able to forgive myself if I did so.

    His friends have all become my friends and we hang out at the same places and in the same 'scene'. I enjoy their company and they like me plenty (which he's made a point of telling me several times). I'd like to make this as clean and as 'un-messy' as possible but after last week's display, I'm a bit trepidant about the whole thing. I also care for him and I don't want to hurt him but I feel it's better to do this sooner rather than later.

    So... any tips on how to break up with an ENFJ?

    p.s. Yes, I know I've not been an angel in all of this.
    Last edited by Dali; 06-07-2011 at 04:05 AM.

  8. #48
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    Dear ENFJ's,

    What happens when you try to delegate some part of a project to a friend and they aren't responsive to your request/demand? Like, "Oh my gosh, I'm so stressed. Please help me. I really need you to do this for me." And then the friend is like, "Sorry, no can do. I'm busy. Can't help this time. Good luck though!"

    I really, really hope that you guys don't take it personal. It's just that ------------------- well, every time you need something RIGHT NOW, I can't stop everything and come running. Ya know? How can I say, "Take a hike, I'm not your minion", but still remain friends with you?
    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.


    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

  9. #49
    Senior Member Sparrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dali View Post
    Thanks a lot for the advice, guys.

    Unfortunately, it's been sort of overtaken by events.

    I've been a bit unhappy with my ENFJ recently. I'd started to feel like he valued his friendships more than he did our relationship and like he wanted to change who I was and, as a result, as of a week ago, started to withdraw and grow a bit unresponsive. He texted me one day and asked me if everything was ok and I texted back saying that it wasn't and very tactfully told him why I thought so.
    Oh gosh, my boyfriend has gotten mad at me for something similar. What you guys gotta realize is that ENFJs are people persons!! We are genuine with most everyone and treat a lot of people with the same genuine interest. He got jealous and scolded me for it twice...and I ended up feeling like he was trying to change who I was as a person lol!!! It is natural for me to want to connect with people ! But yeah...I am a firm believer in compromise in relationships so when he is with me I tone it down and pay a little more attention to him lol. He is worth it <3 I love him .

    Big mistake.

    I got three monolithic, extremely antagonistic texts detailing every single wrong that I'd done over the past couple of months including things that he said he 'was cool with' and things he said he liked about me. I could literally feel the vitriol coming off his texts. It was clearly designed to make me feel as absolutely rotten as possible and in stark contrast to what I knew of him.
    Fe Alert! Fe Alert! lol.... if you give him a chance maybe he will apologize? No one is perfect and relationships always have a few bumps in the road, communication and compromise is key.

    We haven't spoken or met up in five days and he just texted saying he wants to meet up tomorrow to 'clear the air' and 'iron out our issues'. Thing is, I like him plenty but I know I'd never be able to forgive him for making me feel the way he did. Even if I were to eventually forgive him, I wouldn't be able to trust him again. The only option for me is seeking a way out.

    I could do it the 'easy way out' by withdrawing completely and cutting off contact but I'd never be able to forgive myself if I did so.

    His friends have all become my friends and we hang out at the same places and in the same 'scene'. I enjoy their company and they like me plenty (which he's made a point of telling me several items). I'd like to make this as clean and as 'un-messy' as possible but after last week's display, I'm a bit trepidant about the whole thing. I also care for him and I don't want to hurt him but I feel it's better to do this sooner rather than later.

    So... any tips on how to break up with an ENFJ?

    p.s. Yes, I know I've not been an angel in all of this.
    Your gonna throw it all away so soon!? Hear him out!!! But if your for sure about not ever being able to trust him again, and he is for sure not worth your time anymore, just be honest with him. Be gentle though . He might still be open to staying friends who knows! Good luck to ya, hope every thing goes smoothly.
    Fe | Ni | Se | Ti ... 3w4 ... Lawful Neutral ... Johari -Nohari

  10. #50
    Senior Member Sparrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTPness View Post
    Dear ENFJ's,

    What happens when you try to delegate some part of a project to a friend and they aren't responsive to your request/demand? Like, "Oh my gosh, I'm so stressed. Please help me. I really need you to do this for me." And then the friend is like, "Sorry, no can do. I'm busy. Can't help this time. Good luck though!"

    I really, really hope that you guys don't take it personal. It's just that ------------------- well, every time you need something RIGHT NOW, I can't stop everything and come running. Ya know? How can I say, "Take a hike, I'm not your minion", but still remain friends with you?
    Ohhh! No problemo . Just be honest and sincere about it. In a nice way say something like: "I'm sorry but I cant help you this time around, I <<insert reason here>>." Easy as 1-2-3! Just dont be mean about it! ENFJ's are sensitive .
    Fe | Ni | Se | Ti ... 3w4 ... Lawful Neutral ... Johari -Nohari

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