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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    Saying that you dislike mind games is itself a part of the game.
    So, everything is a game? Nothing is relatively more game than another?

  2. #32
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    in regards to the op... i don't like games in the sense that you know you're toying with another person, for the sake of your own benefit, but to some extent we all manipulate how much of ourselves and our feelings we show and how much we do not.

    in that sense, i agree that you do not want to hide too much, because then the other person will never understand that you are interested, but you also do not want to show too much, because people are complex, multifaceted, and very different from one another. we have defense systems for our relational and emotional selves, and to fully open up either of those selves to someone else would be highly likely to engage the other's defenses, not to mention allowing ourselves to be very relationally and emotionally vulnerable. i feel like relationships are, if not a game, a dance. many tempos, many styles, but all about the push and pull between two people.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    It's being out of control that is painful.
    yeah. true. it probably always fails in my case because i've already forked a huge portion of control over my feelings to the other person.

    edit - huh. upon reflection, i guess i create my own failsafe. smart, and yet really stupid all at once.

    Quote Originally Posted by nolla
    Desperate also means "I have to have that one, no matter what it costs me"
    sometimes yes. other times, no. if you're fighting an obvious "no", then it would be desperate. if they are ambiguous or receptive, then it is, as marm said, perhaps obsessive, but perhaps also "devoted".

    still, how many love stories depict the assertive pursuer and the rejecting pursued? even as modern as harry potter, look at james and lily. obviously my most important point being that harry potter wouldn't be around if it weren't for desperation.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    So, everything is a game? Nothing is relatively more game than another?
    You must know it's a game if you think openly liking one person looks "desperate."

    Because many people fall in limerence or have a crush on one particular person. It's the being honest about it that's bad.

    Furthermore, I thought about all the women who tell guys to go away, but just want to test him to see if he'll stick around and continue persuing her.

    But apparently in reverse this is not the case. It's all like a huge experiment, like I said, and in the end I've come to the conclusion that the "old fashioned way" is quite effective.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    So, everything is a game? Nothing is relatively more game than another?
    I was thinking that too. Seems like a semantic point rather than anything else. Twisting everything people do towards one another to fit "mind game" rather than looking at what the people are using the term to mean.

    Mind games here seem to mean deliberate deception. It's certainly possible not to deliberately deceive people in the area of relationships. Difficult I'm sure, but definitely possible.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    yeah. true. it probably always fails in my case because i've already forked all control over my feelings to the other person.



    sometimes yes. other times, no. if you're fighting an obvious "no", then it would be desperate. if they are ambiguous or receptive, then it is, as marm said, perhaps obsessive, but perhaps also "devoted".
    Exactly. It's an attempt to show someone - who is ambiguous, who has never said "I don't like you, I am not attracted to you, I only like you as a friend, and/or go the fuck away" or something along those lines - you are devoted (though it may begin to look obsessive, depending on the person...that's just the thing, too...some people are impressed by "devoted" and other people are scared by "obsessive" it actually depends on the person in question and their perceptions and comfort level with such behavior...some people LIKE IT.)

  6. #36
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Was going to post more but realised that this was in the NF realm so my apologies for intruding.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    So, everything is a game?
    Yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    Nothing is relatively more game than another?
    No, but the "gaming" can be more or less transparent (i.e., bad.)
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    You must know it's a game if you think openly liking one person looks "desperate."
    I know there is a game going on, but I'm not all that confident that everyone is playing it. To say everyone is playing, is still not saying everyone is playing it equally. If someone is playing the game of no game to protest the game, is he playing more or less? Does it have to be another layer of the game or is it about neutralizing the effect of the game?

    What I mean is that this idea that everyone plays feels to me like "don't worry about being honest, because no one is".

  9. #39
    No moss growing on me Giggly's Avatar
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    I don't think everyone plays games. But those who don't (i.e. are loving, open and honest) will look desperate and/or unattractive and will be ignored, dumped or get cheated on.

    My older sister once told me "The one who loves the least controls the relationship".

    It's true.

    This is why I despise games, but as much as I wish they didn't exist, they do exist.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giggly View Post
    I don't think everyone plays games. But those who don't (i.e. are open and honest) will look desperate and unattractive and will be ignored, dumped or get cheated on.
    Why is that a fact? I don't see nothing preventing this if you are being dishonest.

    Besides, if you are honest to yourself you might end up doing those things. Except that if you cheated you would come clean about it and get dumped, probably.

    Quote Originally Posted by Giggly View Post
    My older sister once told me "The one who loves the least controls the relationship".
    Yeah, control is really the problem. There is no openness where someone wants to have control over the other. The thing is you can't fight control with control. If you want openness there is no choice but to be open.

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