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  1. #61
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    I agree...like how I am with children, I either feel neutral toward them or even dislike them like I would adults (except in the case of disliking a child I wouldn't be as open about it as I would be with an adult, I would just stay away from them, because I would never want to hurt a child even if they got on my nerves) ...or I bond with them like a friend. I still keep their age in mind, but there isn't as much of a distinct "me adult, you child" role-playing scenario. I tend to be able to manage middle-school aged and sometimes even high-school aged kids fairly well for this reason, because outside of obvious concessions to their immaturity and youth, I treat them like equals, like people.

    I think it's why I like cats so much too, because I respect their individuality, even though they are animals, I think they are unique personalities just like anyone else...and I think people who don't like cats refuse to understand that, and treat them as mere pets to be dominated. My mom is also an FP, and she likes dogs, and I've noticed she has a similar way with her dogs, like they are individuals to her, and she even brings one along on car rides and buys them plain hamburgers and things in the drive-thru lol. My mother is also very good with children, very flexible, but I think she is over-permissive, though.

    I can get along with NFJs and SFJs quite well despite their need for roles. With FJs I just accept that it's going to be more of a "process" to get close to them, like they have to decide where I fit in to the framework, what my role is in their life. It's actually great to have two FJ sisters because they adore me on the simple grounds that I am family, and in their minds family is family is family. It makes me feel very accepted and forgiven. On the other hand, with FJs who aren't family, like I said there is more of a process until they decide which place they can trust me to be in their life.

    I used to kind of get amused with my ESFJ ex's insistence on roles (and even frustrated once and a while) but I have to admit it actually made me feel secure with him, like I could depend on him to do certain things, because he perceived that as his role in our relationship.

    I love SFJ men. They're like having a mommy, sometimes, even though they're boys. LOL. That sounds weird, I know. I like their nurturing and their guidance. So in that sense I like it when they play the role, and I don't mind their feeling of dominance or superiority in doing so, I'm attracted to it, as long as it isn't taken too far.

    I guess I'm kind of replying both to what you said, and also to what skylights said.

  2. #62
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    this is because Fi bonds more on a symbiotic level. Fe attaches a particular social role and dynamic to a relationship (helper/victim, mother/child etc). Fi bonds basically the same way with a child, an old woman or even a dog. there is no expection of reciprocation or dominance, it's just there. this is one reason why FPs tend to get along so well with animals and children even when they're very old. there is a kind of mutual respect and honor in an Fi bond that is very different from the more group dynamic oriented Fe.
    huh. that's an excellent point, and i've definitely seen Fe dom/auxs on this site relate to seeing relationships in terms of roles - be it friend, helper, mother, etc. i imagine that Ni, with its archetypes, would also tend to emphasize that feeling.

    i feel like there's not much difference in how i treat kids and adults... try to approach them on their level

    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest
    I can get along with NFJs and SFJs quite well despite their need for roles. With FJs I just accept that it's going to be more of a "process" to get close to them, like they have to decide where I fit in to the framework, what my role is in their life. It's actually great to have two FJ sisters because they adore me on the simple grounds that I am family, and in their minds family is family is family. It makes me feel very accepted and forgiven. On the other hand, with FJs who aren't family, like I said there is more of a process until they decide which place they can trust me to be in their life.
    yeah!!! there are definitely upsides to it. like once you're in that role, you're in that role. it generally doesn't shift without you knowing, like Fi relationships can. it's comforting and stable. i too have had to learn to be more patient

  3. #63
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    I wouldn't be surprised if there was correlation with enneagram 4 and neuroticism also, because e4s seek highs & lows in life as "inspiration", feeling they need them to create. When everything constantly feels significant (either distinctly good or bad), and the familiarity with deep "lows" can push one to avoid it, then such a person may act more to achieve a high, thus making them more productive (if channeled well of course). The above mentioned the pairing of neuroticism with conscientiousness (which correlates with Je), which certainly could result in good work ethic. Imagine it paired with openness as well - you could get someone very innovative.
    Hmmm. I don't tend to score that high on neuroticism, usually about 50-55% but then apparently this is "higher than 66% of other respondents". But I agree that 4s would be unlikely to score low on neuroticism.

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    I think this is the result of expressiveness. Introverts just seem more impassioned. It's hilarious how people who are acquaintances think I have some zen thing going on, commenting on how I am always calm, must never get depressed, seem confident, etc. It's just because I am not that expressive (although my family would say differently....but they see another side, the temperamental, neurotic oen). Another anecdote: My teenage INTJ cousin is the stereotypical robot. I took him to an amusement a few years ago when he visited for the summer and he had no reaction to anything the whole time and barely said 5 words. Come to find out later that was the highlight of his trip and he had a blast. His excitement simply was not expressed, so to any onlooker, he did not seem happy at all (in fact, he even looked a bit pouty).
    This reminds me of a story my parents often tell about me. When I was 3 or 4 we went to a fair and they put me one of those merry-go-round swing thingees. Apparently I stared blankly ahead, gripping the bar the whole time and my parents were freaking out thinking I must be hating it. When it finished, they took me off and tried to comfort me, only for me to beg to go again.
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  4. #64
    lab rat extraordinaire CrystalViolet's Avatar
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    I'm highly neurotic ! It verges on paranoia (when I'm tired, it actually does become paranoia). Having said that, inspite of the wild mood swings it can create, in highly stressful situations at work, I've never dropped the ball, and made a bad call, unlike some of my other co-workers who would be considered much calmer.
    Away from work, and it's stressors, it's really hard to phase me though, and I do come across a bit Zen then (if it's life or death though, it adds an extra demension to situations.)
    I've always known it's made me more capable though, Just as I know, it overwhelms other people when Im frizting like hell. As a former co-worker said, I might be emotional and raw, I keep going as I'm channelling the excess emotion, where as other people just stop helpless. I wish other people would recognise that though.

    Sorry very off topic, NFJ's can seem very different to NFP's. ENFJ's aren't that similar to ENFP's in my experience. And some INFJ's (certainly not all) seem to have no basis in reality at all. Although that could be said about INFP's too, except at least here, all the INFP's who are regular posters seem more similar to each other than not. INFJ's seem to have a lot more variation in their type.
    Not that I'm saying INFP's are a cookie cutter type, we just seem to have a distinctive way of posting. It's very different to the INFJ's. Plus although I love some INFJ's, some really make me grind my teeth with frustration. I could say that for some ENFP too, except there is definitely more common ground there.
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  5. #65
    Senior Member animenagai's Avatar
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    Hey guys

    The point Elfboy made about Fi is a really good point. you know that old cliche, "why can't we just see each other as... people?", that's very much how I think socially. I have no problems bonding with all sorts of people, because I know that deep down we're pretty much the same. There are only so many emotions a person can have and i identify these similarities quite easily. There are times when i take this too far though. For example i once got angry at a 12 year old for table bashing rather than being rational. lol Yeah, not so great in hindsight.

    Back to the main point, I do find htat it's often easiest to bond with someone who actively use the same functions as you or maybe share the same enneagram type . In that sense, NFJ's have Ni > Ne and Fe > Fi so though it looks as though we should be able to communicate seamlessly, we often confuse each other with our preferences. They may not understand my Ne humor and their Fe preference could look a bit shallow to me.

    Ps: Still trying to figure out that enneagram eh, skylights?
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  6. #66
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    another thing I've noticed is that lots of NFJs seem to wish they had more Fi and lots of NFPs (self included) seem to wish they had more Ni (I mean come on, who wouldn't want to be able to predict the future and grasp complex systems in their entirety? that's friggin bad ass)

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by animenagai View Post
    Ps: Still trying to figure out that enneagram eh, skylights?




    fuckin' enneagram. i don't even know. numbers currently in the air are 6w7 and 4w3. tritype is ?w?-?w?-9w1, sx/so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy
    another thing I've noticed is that lots of NFJs seem to wish they had more Fi and lots of NFPs (self included) seem to wish they had more Ni (I mean come on, who wouldn't want to be able to predict the future and grasp complex systems in their entirety? that's friggin bad ass)
    yeah, i'd love a heaping dose of Ni. i think Ni (whether in myself or someone close to me) is a balancing force for me. it helps me focus, narrow, move towards a pointed goal.

    this might be getting more into enneagram territory, but related -- i have a close ENFJ friend that i try to poke with Fi from time to time. he's an e3w2, quite disconnected from his feelings. i feel like sometimes he pushes forward on the surface while things aren't okay underneath, and that moves him ahead on the surface, but it doesn't heal the wounds that lie below. he tries to resolve feeling with action, believing that if he can just move on and accomplish something else, the bad feelings will go away. sometimes that works... sometimes it doesn't. mostly i think it just works temporarily. but if i push him a bit into Fi territory, it helps him reconnect with himself and start to address old wounds. my hope is that by being patient, gentle, warm, and supportive when he expresses his feelings, and by not making any negative judgments, it can help him to feel more at peace with himself. he's very hard on himself. he's really an amazing person but i know that the outside glamour belies extraordinary internal stress. it's such a double-edged sword. i used to be very envious of him externally - i still am, relatively often - but i wish that he could appreciate himself as much as i appreciate him. it's bizarre, he seems to have a high level of self-confidence but a low level of self-worth. i want him to stop doing for a moment and appreciate the amazing person he is.

  8. #68
    Senior Member Viridian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    another thing I've noticed is that lots of NFJs seem to wish they had more Fi and lots of NFPs (self included) seem to wish they had more Ni (I mean come on, who wouldn't want to be able to predict the future and grasp complex systems in their entirety? that's friggin bad ass)
    What do you mean? Like, NFJs wish that they could be more accepting of themselves and others? That they could express deep, raw emotion though art? That they could state without shame what they believe in?

  9. #69
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Viridian View Post
    What do you mean? Like, NFJs wish that they could be more accepting of themselves and others? That they could express deep, raw emotion though art? That they could state without shame what they believe in?
    exactly

  10. #70
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    my ENFP cousin is neurotic as hell. he sometimes reminds me of a pregnant woman lol
    Lol. Yeah, I actually knew a neurotic 8w7 ENFP guy too, once, and the DQ (drama quotient) was absolutely cosmic.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

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