User Tag List

Results 1 to 5 of 5

  1. #1
    Senior Member Santosha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    MBTI
    HUMR
    Enneagram
    6 sx
    Socionics
    iNfp Ni
    Posts
    1,521

    Default ENFP's & Moral Do-Goodism

    The biggest change I've noticed in myself in the last few years is a more objective and critical analysis of ideals. I used to feel very passionate about injustice and took a strong stance on social and fiscal liberalism. Always supporting the underdog, and thinking society should too. Welfare state, social programs, animal activism, capitalist hatred with out any distinction between business and run away corporatism. You know, a hippy =) But in the last few years, I've felt my "humanitarian streak" take a different turn, and began to get tired of the underdog mentality.

    I started to feel more strongly that each person should be accountable for themself. I got tired of people using excuses to not succeed. I came across people that had overcome extremely difficult circumstances and prevailed, and started to wonder why someone else couldn't do this. Government handouts almost seemed insulting to me, as though to say "you can't make it on your own in the world, let us aid you." I started to see PETA and Ingrid Newkirk as a crackpot extremist, that could justify bombing a building with people in it to save animals. And it all led me to this "moral do-gooder" dislike.

    Ya, that is where I think I'm going with this. A "moral do-gooder" dislike. Isn't that crazy! Aren't ENFP's the epitome of moral do-goodism!? Please don't get me wrong here.. I still feel passionately about human rights, injustices. But It's almost like wherever there is a need, a genuine NEED.. people organize. And when they do someone almost ALWAYS finds a way to CAPITALIZE on it by appealing to your altruism. "Feed the Children" and you donate because ya, you want the kids to get fed.. but you didn't know that evey dollar you donate goes mostly towards ogranizational expense, and that .10 cents actually FEEDS THE CHILDREN!

    I used to donate to United Way, until a story hit about something like 2 billion dollars being "unallocateable." Honestly I could go on and on with examples of corruption, but It'd take all day.

    Another change. A mistrust of psychology in general. I LOVE psychology! Understanding behaviors and the mind fascinates me, always has. BUt you've got doctors taking kickbacks from pharmaceutical companies for prescribing X amount of Xanix, Prozac, Zoloft. I heard an advertisement on the radio the other day and it went something like this (in serious deep voice) "Do you pride yourself on a peaceful relationships? Are you lucky enough to say that you and your partner RARELY argue? Your relationship may be much worse than you realize. Studies show that partners that never fight have poor communication skills leading to opression, resentment, and apathy." And I thought to myself.. seriously? Like psychology doesn't have enough on its plate tagging future serial killers by age 6, and developing new behavioral techniques for virtually anyone that doesn't fit perfectly in the societal cube? You've now found a market creating doubt in peaceful relations?

    It just seems like there is a bigger than ever agenda to tell people how to live their lives, and I don't want to be apart of it. I think that freedom is of the highest value. Free to be wrong, free to fail, free to smoke 3 packs a day, free to be a heroin junkie, free to be a racist (even if it makes you an ignorant turd) free to own a gun, free to not own a gun, free to not wear your seatbelt if your an adult, free to end yourself if you choose. I believe moral justification to be very dangerous, in that you can rationalize almost any heinous action in pursuit of the greater good. And I don't think it only rears its head with suicide bombers. I think it starts small in the form of any kind of intolerance.

    This might come across as *tin foil hat*. I don't want to come accross as conspiracy theorist, as I objectivey critique those as well. I just wonder if any ENFP's have had these thoughts.. is this normal for an ENFP? *realizes normal and enfp is oxymoron* Do any of you ENFP's attribute true humanitarianism to little interference and personal freedom? If so, why do I hear that so many ENFP's are passionate idealists, activists, organizing programs, etc.?
    Man suffers only because he takes seriously what the gods made for fun - Watts

  2. #2
    Senior Member chachamaru's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    ?
    Socionics
    EXPP
    Posts
    451

    Default

    An ENFP can organize...?

    This sounds strange to me. Maybe you're picking up on the anti-establishment thinking that is going around?
    a cat is fine too

  3. #3
    Senior Member chachamaru's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    ?
    Socionics
    EXPP
    Posts
    451

    Default

    More specifically, maybe you're picking up on the tea-partyism that's going around?

    That group portrays themselves as a kind of underdog, so maybe you're not far from your base. Perhaps you identify more with them? Feel alienated from your old beliefs because this new "information" has tainted your view of them?
    a cat is fine too

  4. #4
    Banned
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    6w7 sp/so
    Socionics
    IEI
    Posts
    2,841

    Default

    Originally posted by Huxley3112
    Ya, that is where I think I'm going with this. A "moral do-gooder" dislike. Isn't that crazy! Aren't ENFP's the epitome of moral do-goodism!? Please don't get me wrong here.. I still feel passionately about human rights, injustices. But It's almost like wherever there is a need, a genuine NEED.. people organize. And when they do someone almost ALWAYS finds a way to CAPITALIZE on it by appealing to your altruism. "Feed the Children" and you donate because ya, you want the kids to get fed.. but you didn't know that evey dollar you donate goes mostly towards ogranizational expense, and that .10 cents actually FEEDS THE CHILDREN!

    I used to donate to United Way, until a story hit about something like 2 billion dollars being "unallocateable." Honestly I could go on and on with examples of corruption, but It'd take all day.

    Another change. A mistrust of psychology in general. I LOVE psychology! Understanding behaviors and the mind fascinates me, always has. BUt you've got doctors taking kickbacks from pharmaceutical companies for prescribing X amount of Xanix, Prozac, Zoloft. I heard an advertisement on the radio the other day and it went something like this (in serious deep voice) "Do you pride yourself on a peaceful relationships? Are you lucky enough to say that you and your partner RARELY argue? Your relationship may be much worse than you realize. Studies show that partners that never fight have poor communication skills leading to opression, resentment, and apathy." And I thought to myself.. seriously? Like psychology doesn't have enough on its plate tagging future serial killers by age 6, and developing new behavioral techniques for virtually anyone that doesn't fit perfectly in the societal cube? You've now found a market creating doubt in peaceful relations?

    It just seems like there is a bigger than ever agenda to tell people how to live their lives, and I don't want to be apart of it. I think that freedom is of the highest value. Free to be wrong, free to fail, free to smoke 3 packs a day, free to be a heroin junkie, free to be a racist (even if it makes you an ignorant turd) free to own a gun, free to not own a gun, free to not wear your seatbelt if your an adult, free to end yourself if you choose. I believe moral justification to be very dangerous, in that you can rationalize almost any heinous action in pursuit of the greater good. And I don't think it only rears its head with suicide bombers. I think it starts small in the form of any kind of intolerance.
    Your moral do-goodism seems fine if you ask me, considering that your up in arms about injustices that occur within social instiutions that you supported for so long, or psychologists throwing around bad information that isn't useful, or your loving of freedom for individuals.

    This might come across as *tin foil hat*. I don't want to come accross as conspiracy theorist, as I objectivey critique those as well. I just wonder if any ENFP's have had these thoughts.. is this normal for an ENFP? *realizes normal and enfp is oxymoron* Do any of you ENFP's attribute true humanitarianism to little interference and personal freedom? If so, why do I hear that so many ENFP's are passionate idealists, activists, organizing programs, etc.?
    Yep, this is normal for ENFP's (the epitome of oxymoron), myself included, I get so enraged by social injustices. :steam:

    I also greatly value human freedom and humanitarian standards of life, and I want to increase these things for everyone in society.

    ENFP's are passionate idealists, activists, organizing programs because we got that noble and fiery Fi, with the Ne-Te ability to get shit done

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Posts
    149

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Huxley3112 View Post
    The biggest change I've noticed in myself in the last few years is a more objective and critical analysis of ideals. I used to feel very passionate about injustice and took a strong stance on social and fiscal liberalism. Always supporting the underdog, and thinking society should too. Welfare state, social programs, animal activism, capitalist hatred with out any distinction between business and run away corporatism. You know, a hippy =) But in the last few years, I've felt my "humanitarian streak" take a different turn, and began to get tired of the underdog mentality.

    I started to feel more strongly that each person should be accountable for themself. I got tired of people using excuses to not succeed. I came across people that had overcome extremely difficult circumstances and prevailed, and started to wonder why someone else couldn't do this. Government handouts almost seemed insulting to me, as though to say "you can't make it on your own in the world, let us aid you." I started to see PETA and Ingrid Newkirk as a crackpot extremist, that could justify bombing a building with people in it to save animals. And it all led me to this "moral do-gooder" dislike.

    Ya, that is where I think I'm going with this. A "moral do-gooder" dislike. Isn't that crazy! Aren't ENFP's the epitome of moral do-goodism!? Please don't get me wrong here.. I still feel passionately about human rights, injustices. But It's almost like wherever there is a need, a genuine NEED.. people organize. And when they do someone almost ALWAYS finds a way to CAPITALIZE on it by appealing to your altruism. "Feed the Children" and you donate because ya, you want the kids to get fed.. but you didn't know that evey dollar you donate goes mostly towards ogranizational expense, and that .10 cents actually FEEDS THE CHILDREN!

    I used to donate to United Way, until a story hit about something like 2 billion dollars being "unallocateable." Honestly I could go on and on with examples of corruption, but It'd take all day.

    Another change. A mistrust of psychology in general. I LOVE psychology! Understanding behaviors and the mind fascinates me, always has. BUt you've got doctors taking kickbacks from pharmaceutical companies for prescribing X amount of Xanix, Prozac, Zoloft. I heard an advertisement on the radio the other day and it went something like this (in serious deep voice) "Do you pride yourself on a peaceful relationships? Are you lucky enough to say that you and your partner RARELY argue? Your relationship may be much worse than you realize. Studies show that partners that never fight have poor communication skills leading to opression, resentment, and apathy." And I thought to myself.. seriously? Like psychology doesn't have enough on its plate tagging future serial killers by age 6, and developing new behavioral techniques for virtually anyone that doesn't fit perfectly in the societal cube? You've now found a market creating doubt in peaceful relations?

    It just seems like there is a bigger than ever agenda to tell people how to live their lives, and I don't want to be apart of it. I think that freedom is of the highest value. Free to be wrong, free to fail, free to smoke 3 packs a day, free to be a heroin junkie, free to be a racist (even if it makes you an ignorant turd) free to own a gun, free to not own a gun, free to not wear your seatbelt if your an adult, free to end yourself if you choose. I believe moral justification to be very dangerous, in that you can rationalize almost any heinous action in pursuit of the greater good. And I don't think it only rears its head with suicide bombers. I think it starts small in the form of any kind of intolerance.

    This might come across as *tin foil hat*. I don't want to come accross as conspiracy theorist, as I objectivey critique those as well. I just wonder if any ENFP's have had these thoughts.. is this normal for an ENFP? *realizes normal and enfp is oxymoron* Do any of you ENFP's attribute true humanitarianism to little interference and personal freedom? If so, why do I hear that so many ENFP's are passionate idealists, activists, organizing programs, etc.?

    I totally agree with this, and have had a similar, though less dramatic change over my life.
    I tend to look at it more as a dislike of pretension though, the insincerity that surrounds charity and moral do-good-ism.

Similar Threads

  1. [ENFP] What attracts an ENFP male and how do you keep him?
    By Lightyear in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 51
    Last Post: 01-24-2017, 03:58 PM
  2. [ENFP] ENFP's, how much do you try to affect people's feelings?
    By Craft in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 11-15-2014, 12:22 AM
  3. ENFPs and ENTPs: What do you Think of Each Other?
    By Blackwater in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 05-28-2009, 09:43 AM
  4. [ENFP] How do ENFPs behave when attracted to someone?
    By RandomNF in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 08-01-2008, 03:58 PM
  5. [ENFP] Do ENFPs have to...
    By Little Linguist in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 07-31-2008, 02:21 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO