[MBTI General] Early thirties and direction in life

[Lark]

Hey Lark. Thanks for reviving this thread. I hadn't been on TypeC for a while but I have continued on my path to self-discovery.

No probs, its one of the best threads here and closely resonates with me. To be honest the fact that you've done or have a lot of the things I'm striving for but havent got or havent tried or havent decided about yet and still feel the way I do makes me have second thoughts about any of them by themselves as the solutions to the angst I experience.

Your idea on fighting for happiness is very appealing. In fact, if I can make a link, it seems to closely reflect Canadian author John Ralston Saul’s interpretation of the “pursuit of happiness” mentioned in the American constitution. This author’s interpretation of the intentions of the writers of the constitution was exactly that, the freedom to search for one’s “happiness” as a path rather than as an objective of flighty joy.
In the second paragraph that I’m quoting from you, I think that you are really getting at the heart of the matter for me, not complicating it further. Is authenticity even a route to happiness? What is more important, the form or the content? I know it would be tempting to say the content. But what about all those statistics that say that married, healthy, wealthy people are on average happier? Is happiness brought about by satisfying superficial requisites for success? Perhaps these people simply completely bought into the whole image or maybe this image of success closely resembles their personal requirements for happiness.

I have heard of Saul he is a critic of corporatism am I right? I'm not sure if its the same guy.

The think about authenticity is its, for me, something I've experienced rather than an abstract goal, it is something which has been conceptualised by religious who believe in predestination or preordained designs and divine plans as the feeling of being "on track" or "vocation" or "calling", when you feel that you're really living and being yourself, perhaps its contentment, although maybe its not because some of the most real living I've done HAS involved disappointment or suffering but its preferable to apathy or alienated mundanity.

I would say that there's no tick list for happiness and it does possibly change over time too, so its possible that for one person at one time that list of things, the superficial requisites, works but wouldnt for another, the difference being whether they experience them as enlivening, uplifting or challenging rather than just burdensome and boring.

 

[rav3n]

I’m not sure how looking into the past will necessarily help the future though. How did this help you out?

In understanding your foundational environment and authority figures, it helps you realise how some of your defensive mechanisms and also both positive and negative triggers, were created. There are times where I see a reflection of my own negative actions in how my parents react or what their expected reaction from myself or others would be. During these mirror times, I try to figure out the more emotionally healthy way to handle the situation.

 

[Anew Leaf]

Musttry: Trust me, it’s much harder said than done.

This must be a J/P thing... I find my INFJ friends have a pretty tough time in relaxing as well. One is a mother of 5 and she is always running around driving one of them to an activity, or baking cookies for another kid, etc. I keep telling her to take time for herself because it will make her a better her. She sometimes takes my advice.

I strive to have some prayer/meditation time each day, usually at the end of the day. It helps me get calmer/relaxed as needed, and is a way for me to seek God in my otherwise (fairly) busy life. Even 10 minutes of this can refresh me. Some days I look forward to it, and other days I feel kind of "eh" about it.

I think everyone should have some time to themselves where none intrude.

 

[King sns]

Although I agree with what you say, trusting life to do it’s part is a big leap of faith. You either approach this with hope or dismay but I don’t think that it is easy to be self-aware and trusting of life.

Trust me, it’s much harder said than done.

I understand what you're saying. For me, I figure that life and time will do whatever it wants whether I trust it or not. Almost everything is well beyond my control. I need to accept it. So part of acceptance for me is just trust. Sometimes that means accepting that things may go horribly wrong with my personal pursuit.

 

[Anew Leaf]

I understand what you're saying. For me, I figure that life and time will do whatever it wants whether I trust it or not. Almost everything is well beyond my control. I need to accept it. So part of acceptance for me is just trust. Sometimes that means accepting that things may go horribly wrong with my personal pursuit.

This has been one of the hardest things for me to learn , and I wish I had learned it much, much, much sooner than I did. (Ok, I am not entirely sure I HAVE actually learned it totally yet... )

@Jenaphor: In understanding your foundational environment and authority figures, it helps you realise how some of your defensive mechanisms and also both positive and negative triggers, were created. There are times where I see a reflection of my own negative actions in how my parents react or what their expected reaction from myself or others would be. During these mirror times, I try to figure out the more emotionally healthy way to handle the situation.

I like this as well. Being an only child I was close to both of my parents. Losing my mom last year severed one major tie. Having my dad change and now be marrying someone else, has changed the other tie. Changed for the best really. I think we have a much more adult relationship now that is based on mutual respect and trust. (We still bug each other! )

 

[cascadeco]

I understand what you're saying. For me, I figure that life and time will do whatever it wants whether I trust it or not. Almost everything is well beyond my control. I need to accept it. So part of acceptance for me is just trust. Sometimes that means accepting that things may go horribly wrong with my personal pursuit.

I think this is wise and true.

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Perhaps I'm a weird INFJ, but I have no problems relaxing and enjoying my free time. In fact I intentionally make sure I have this alone time, doing whatever I want to do (even if it's just sitting and contemplating things without any other distractions) simply because I know otherwise I become highly stressed/frazzled, and start crumbling, and also start feeling physically ill. Relaxation is a MUST for me! Plus... I don't really see the point of life if there isn't some element of enjoyment and pursuing ones' own interests/hobbies. Keeps me balanced.

 

[Anew Leaf]

I think this is wise and true.

---------

Perhaps I'm a weird INFJ, but I have no problems relaxing and enjoying my free time. In fact I intentionally make sure I have this alone time, doing whatever I want to do (even if it's just sitting and contemplating things without any other distractions) simply because I know otherwise I become highly stressed/frazzled, and start crumbling, and also start feeling physically ill. Relaxation is a MUST for me! Plus... I don't really see the point of life if there isn't some element of enjoyment and pursuing ones' own interests/hobbies. Keeps me balanced.

I will have to use you for my new example when I encourage my frazzled INFJ to take time for herself.

 

[Lark]

Whether its stoicism or trust in divine providence or resignation to the limits of free will those things can help cope with anxiety and angst but I think that there is also personal responsibility to do good and try to see good done in your personal sphere of influence.

 

[Betty Blue]

I have found somewhat of a way, but my way...no.

 

[InvisibleJim]

Bon Voyage

This must be a J/P thing... I find my INFJ friends have a pretty tough time in relaxing as well.

It's not a J/P thing, its a Se anima thing and it has been rather well documented. Ni dominants can often have a highly visceral reactionary status to changes in their environment especially when they lose trust in their environment. Outside of only a very few people who claim to be Ni dominant I have not found anyone who understand the disastrously unsettling nature of out of control changes in the environment and the warm sticky glue feeling when something sticks satisfactorily. It's always easy to spot the false Ni doms when you see their reaction to people undergoing this state.

With regards to losing trust in the environment or having to exist in an environment which is shifting under your feet, there is only one thing to do at such a time. Grab it by both hands and steer it regardless of direction; somewhat akin to falling down the stairs.

Do not worry, there is nothing unnatural that you may have missed this or the reasons for it; despite the detailed study by many individuals it is generally ignored on typology forums because Ni dominants actually slip from them due to the constantly unsettling and shifting environs; this tends to lead to most very attitude differentiated Ni users not hanging around to discuss it in depth.

The only documented and established way to keep an Ni dominant calm and placid without them crawling up the walls with stress is to ensure that any changes to their environment are entirely organic. Forced change will have a highly visceral reaction especially if it is sudden and without earlier signs that things would move in that direction to allow their brain to mentally process and accept those changes.

 

[King sns]

This has been one of the hardest things for me to learn , and I wish I had learned it much, much, much sooner than I did. (Ok, I am not entirely sure I HAVE actually learned it totally yet... )

Well, it's not a bad thing if people don't fully learn it. I think our mind protects us in a lot of ways. If I'm thinking that life is purely carrying me along like a baby at it's mercy, I get a little creeped out. Though I believe it is 95% truth, humans need to have a sense of control.

 

[cascadeco]

I will have to use you for my new example when I encourage my frazzled INFJ to take time for herself.

Well, it's only because I know I get stressed fairly easily, and am rather highstrung, that I know that I NEED the downtime/relaxation built into my life, so as to be able to function & remain balanced. Otherwise, like I said, it starts taking a toll on me physically & mentally.

It doesn't mean I'm really ABLE to mentally relax all of the time, if I have a lot going on, but at least having that time to myself where in theory I could relax, is important and I build it in. Also, I have key hobbies/interests that are almost guaranteed to get me out of my head, even if only for an hour. As a general rule I construct my life so as to avoid stress - I'm very... proactive about that, and self-monitoring. But again, it's because I know when I become overwhelmed, it takes a heavy toll on me. Those 'overwhelming' moments are unavoidable sometimes (i.e. a few months ago when I was looking for a new apartment to live in, making those calls, looking at the places, signing the lease, then the logistics of the whole move), but as a general Lifestyle I plan these Relaxation and Down Time moments/days into each week -- preventative measure, really.

 

[Anew Leaf]

It's not a J/P thing, its a Se anima thing and it has been rather well documented. Ni dominants can often have a highly visceral reactionary status to changes in their environment especially when they lose trust in their environment. Outside of only a very few people who claim to be Ni dominant I have not found anyone who understand the disastrously unsettling nature of out of control changes in the environment and the warm sticky glue feeling when something sticks satisfactorily. It's always easy to spot the false Ni doms when you see their reaction to people undergoing this state.

With regards to losing trust in the environment or having to exist in an environment which is shifting under your feet, there is only one thing to do at such a time. Grab it by both hands and steer it regardless of direction; somewhat akin to falling down the stairs.

Do not worry, there is nothing unnatural that you may have missed this or the reasons for it; despite the detailed study by many individuals it is generally ignored on typology forums because Ni dominants actually slip from them due to the constantly unsettling and shifting environs; this tends to lead to most very attitude differentiated Ni users not hanging around to discuss it in depth.

The only documented and established way to keep an Ni dominant calm and placid without them crawling up the walls with stress is to ensure that any changes to their environment are entirely organic. Forced change will have a highly visceral reaction especially if it is sudden and without earlier signs that things would move in that direction to allow their brain to mentally process and accept those changes.

Ah, ok. That makes a lot more sense then. I haven't done much reading up on Ni. It does help explain a lot of what I have seen in my INXJ friends though.

Well, it's only because I know I get stressed fairly easily, and am rather highstrung, that I know that I NEED the downtime/relaxation built into my life, so as to be able to function & remain balanced. Otherwise, like I said, it starts taking a toll on me physically & mentally.

It doesn't mean I'm really ABLE to mentally relax all of the time, if I have a lot going on, but at least having that time to myself where in theory I could relax, is important and I build it in. Also, I have key hobbies/interests that are almost guaranteed to get me out of my head, even if only for an hour. As a general rule I construct my life so as to avoid stress - I'm very... proactive about that, and self-monitoring. But again, it's because I know when I become overwhelmed, it takes a heavy toll on me. Those 'overwhelming' moments are unavoidable sometimes (i.e. a few months ago when I was looking for a new apartment to live in, making those calls, looking at the places, signing the lease, then the logistics of the whole move), but as a general Lifestyle I plan these Relaxation and Down Time moments/days into each week -- preventative measure, really.

Yeah, I hear you on this. I do my best to plan in my introvert time as needed as preventive care as well. So long as I can. Family/Work/Friends don't always allow me to do just that!

 

[CzeCze]

Question 1 (in addition to the pole)
Does anybody else feel bored even if their life is full and socially acceptable?

I don't give a damn about being socially acceptable. It's never been a priority for me, but it does cause anxiety because I still have a need to be accepted but I don't want to live a conventional life and I'm kinda on my own wavelength the way we XNFPs tend to be...>.< The idea of living a socially acceptable and conventional life with mom jeans and a sensible bob makes me die a little inside. It's actually a slight fear I have about having kids because I know there are many lifestyles that can accompany having children but...

Question 2
Is anyone else addicted to living in the future?

Yes. As a 'P' I'm addicted to plans and ideas for the future. ;_;

Question 3
Is this a type thing? Does this imply deep dissatisfaction with one's life? Does it go away? If so, for everyone or are NFs continuously looking for greener grass?

I don't know if it's that NFs are constantly looking for greener grass. I think there is an open-ness and a child-like "ooh I like!" quality to some NFs that combined means sudden decisions being made and thinking about possibilities. I think for some NF's we have a vague idea of picture of what kind of life we want but we aren't sure how to get it. At least ,this is my problem. Also, fear can be a big obstacle. There are definitely times in my life where I have been very content and even happy.

Question 4
Has anybody found a way to START relaxing without feeling guilty (as in, could not relax but now can, not just generally being able to relax)? Is it the beginning of your demise?

Um, can kinda relate as far as a quality of restlessness. But, I seriously like having fun and relaxing. And less about relaxing than about 'enjoying myself'. I have no qualms about age appropriateness when it comes to having fun, I will be a grandma at the club if that's fun for me. I feel no guilt enjoying myself. I'm pretty much a hedonist. I'm guessing our enneatypes are different because I'm a 7 and 7's crave excitement, pleasure, and enjoyable pursuits.

This worries me because I have met other men who are now in their forties and still haven't found their way and still haven't built anything because they are still searching. When did you find your way? Did you find your way? Were you looking for your way? Is finding your way equal to accepting the present? or is it equal to finding that challenge that will keep you moving in a direction?

Thanks for scaring me. Your question could be answered by a wise Buddhist. Something about the journey being just as imporant as the destination and how we ultimately only compete with our own selves and we have to learn to live in the moment and etc. etc. etc. SOOOOO, don't have an answer for you. But now you kinda terrified me. Thanks.

 

[Lark]

Thanks for scaring me. Your question could be answered by a wise Buddhist. Something about the journey being just as imporant as the destination and how we ultimately only compete with our own selves and we have to learn to live in the moment and etc. etc. etc. SOOOOO, don't have an answer for you. But now you kinda terrified me. Thanks.

That's the sunscreen song CzeCze!!

 

[CzeCze]

I hated that song ;_;

The voice actor who 'sung it' though - i felt happy for him. Got a bunch of face time and a nice check probably.

 

[Synapse]

Directionless and almost 34. I should be so lucky as I watch one of my high school friends on prime time tv. My friends move forward, while I remain in the same seat I have for the past 15 years, more, its become a nightmare of astronomical proportions. I am reminded of a teachers echo as she said to me in year 12 that I look the same as I did in the year 9 documentary I did about seniors.

 

[IZthe411]

Great discussion. I'll chime in later.

 

[Lark]

http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-reasons-life-better-after-age-30/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=fanpage&utm_campaign=new+article

Great link in relation to the thread I think.

 

[Anew Leaf]

Directionless and almost 34. I should be so lucky as I watch one of my high school friends on prime time tv. My friends move forward, while I remain in the same seat I have for the past 15 years, more, its become a nightmare of astronomical proportions. I am reminded of a teachers echo as she said to me in year 12 that I look the same as I did in the year 9 documentary I did about seniors.

There is no time like the present to jumpstart your life again.

It always feels impossible to change things, and that can be incredibly overwhelming. It's very easy to focus on the end result, the big picture, or the 100 things wrong with me. I found the best way to combat this is truly to take things one day at a time and work on mini-goals.

Let's say you want to change careers. Sit down for an hour and research options that you could do. See what interests you. Then the next day pinpoint one or two ideas and research them a bit further. Find out what you need to do in order to do that particular career.

If needed, get external help from friends, family, and/or a counselor.

If you feel that you have "wasted" time... then flip that idea on its head and make it into a positive. Let the past 15 years become your reason for change. Defeat always wants us to think that things can never change. But hope is there as a small ray of light to let us know that things can always change.