• You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to additional post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), view blogs, respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, so please join our community today! Just click here to register. You should turn your Ad Blocker off for this site or certain features may not work properly. If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us by clicking here.

[ENFP] ENFP or ENFJ

Sunny Ghost

New member
Joined
May 28, 2010
Messages
2,396
I have this friend whom I can't decide if she's ENFP or ENFJ. She's taken the test herself, as she's a psychology major, but even she can't decide. She always say's she feels very balanced all across the board. I originally pinned her for ENFJ... but now I'm contemplating ENFP for her as well. I have several ENFP friends and a couple of ENFJ friends, but she's one of the rare ones I feel caught in the middle with.

So, what are some good ways to determine? At least based upon observable behavior?

Would you say ENFJ's are more likely to be jokers than ENFP's, who may seem more serious? She's incredibly intelligent, very supportive and reaffirming, she's always turning everything into a joke and is great at making everyone laugh. How ever, it always seems as though she's got a lot of insight and knowledge, and can be very serious and firm in her thoughts, which are also always very well thought out. However, she considers herself a wild child and party girl, but a wild child and party girl with morals. Haha.
 

Thalassa

Permabanned
Joined
May 3, 2009
Messages
25,183
MBTI Type
ISFP
Enneagram
6w7
Instinctual Variant
sx
My best friend from high school is ENFJ and she's freaking hilarious. I can tell you that I think she's more evenly social across the board, can be a bitch but always knows the right thing to say, is very supportive and warm and loves people, but I think she's somehow inwardly more "distant" and less intense than me. People adore her, she has the ENFJ charisma.

She also knew exactly what she wanted to do as a career at a very young age. I would overall say she has more "smooth" Fe with people than me, even though I think some people think of us as being similar with our humor, etc, especially people we went to school with. Her nurturing is a very Fe kind of nurturing.

My sister is also ENFJ. She's a more stereotypical Fe dom in that she's very concerned with doing the right thing and keeping everyone behaving nicely. Like, she hates dramatic displays of emotion, she thinks there is an appropriate way to display emotion. I think my ENFJ bff thinks that too, but she doesn't push that opinion onto others, where as I think my ENFJ sister does. It's probably an enneagram difference. My ENFJ sister is really concerned with not taking sides and all people being treated fairly. I also think she can handle more constant people flow than I can.

I also see a lot of tert Se in both of them more than Te. My sister is kind of like Domino from this forum in that she likes to fix cars and things like that. My high school bff has always loved fashion and make-up.

I think ENFPs are more outwardly distant and ENFJs are more inwardly distant. In that I mean ENFPs can seem more flaky or play favorites, but when it comes down to it they show you who they are. ENFJs are more "present" with everyone and seem more fair, but inside are more guarded, I think.
 

Sunny Ghost

New member
Joined
May 28, 2010
Messages
2,396
hmmm... i'm trying to consider the inwardly distant and outwardly distant thing. i can definitely see what you mean when i think of my other ENFP and ENFJ friends.

i'm also thinking now about her determination. she seems very determined when it comes to school and career. for a long time we talked about doing volunteer work together, and she was very adamant about it. our schedules didn't allow for us to do volunteer work together, so we gave up. but when we were originally talking about it, she told me she didn't want this to be one of those things where we say we'll do this or do that, but have no follow through. she was very serious. i think this is much more J of her than P.

i would say she probably seems much more outwardly focused than inwardly (in the ENFP way). but not necessarily more guarded... this is at least not something i've picked up on.
 

Thalassa

Permabanned
Joined
May 3, 2009
Messages
25,183
MBTI Type
ISFP
Enneagram
6w7
Instinctual Variant
sx
Oh a couple more things - I remember when I first met my bff in high school. It always seemed like she knew everybody, and she never had a problem socially initiating. But here's what she said to me on our first meeting, "I'm intrigued by you because everyone seems to know who you are but no one seems to actually know you."

Also, I can't stress enough that PEOPLE LOVE ENFJs. People think my ENFJ sister is so nice, it's so easy for her to get people to take her side. While my ENFJ bff is more salty and less politically correct than my sis, she still has that ENFJ Pied Piper quality.

I'm not saying people don't love ENFPs, but because of our brutal honesty and quirky, sometimes dramatic displays, it makes it less easy to be loved by everyone. It's more of a case of being loved or hated.
 

Sunny Ghost

New member
Joined
May 28, 2010
Messages
2,396
hahaha. I love that she was intrigued by you for that.

That's basically how I've always described myself. I know tons of people, but none of them really know me. I consider myself friendly, but not actually social. It throws people off when they realize how guarded I am, considering how out there I am.

I would say this might be a quality of Fi, but ESFP's don't seem to be in that same distant or guarded boat. Perhaps this is another one of those reasons for why ISFP's and ENFP's get confused for one another at times.

I'd say, putting it in that respect as well, my friend is most likely more Fe.
 

Ulaes

loopy
Joined
Jan 11, 2009
Messages
850
MBTI Type
crak
Enneagram
sax
have you tried determining what functions she employs rather than comparing her to stereotypes?

Fe
The process of extraverted Feeling often involves a desire to connect with (or disconnect from) others and is often evidenced by expressions of warmth (or displeasure) and self-disclosure. The “social graces,” such as being polite, being nice, being friendly, being considerate, and being appropriate, often revolve around the process of extraverted Feeling. Keeping in touch, laughing at jokes when others laugh, and trying to get people to act kindly to each other also involve extraverted Feeling. Using this process, we respond according to expressed or even unexpressed wants and needs of others. We may ask people what they want or need or self-disclose to prompt them to talk more about themselves. This often sparks conversation and lets us know more about them so we can better adjust our behavior to them. Often with this process, we feel pulled to be responsible and take care of others’ feelings, sometimes to the point of not separating our feelings from theirs. We may recognize and adhere to shared values, feelings, and social norms to get along.

Ni
Introverted iNtuiting involves synthesizing the seemingly paradoxical or contradictory, which takes understanding to a new level. Using this process, we can have moments when completely new, unimagined realizations come to us. A disengagement from interactions in the room occurs, followed by a sudden “Aha!” or “That’s it!” The sense of the future and the realizations that come from introverted iNtuiting have a sureness and an imperative quality that seem to demand action and help us stay focused on fulfilling our vision or dream of how things will be in the future. Using this process, we might rely on a focal device or symbolic action to predict, enlighten, or transform. We could find ourselves laying out how the future will unfold based on unseen trends and telling signs. This process can involve working out complex concepts or systems of thinking or conceiving of symbolic or novel ways to understand things that are universal. It can lead to creating transcendent experiences or solutions.



Ne
Extraverted iNtuiting involves noticing hidden meanings and interpreting them, often entertaining a wealth of possible interpretations from just one idea or interpreting what someone’s behavior really means. It also involves seeing things “as if,” with various possible representations of reality. Using this process, we can juggle many different ideas, thoughts, beliefs, and meanings in our mind at once with the possibility that they are all true. This is like weaving themes and threads together. We don’t know the weave until a thought thread appears or is drawn out in the interaction of thoughts, often brought in from other contexts. Thus a strategy or concept often emerges from the here-and-now interactions, not appearing as a whole beforehand. Using this process we can really appreciate brainstorming and trust what emerges, enjoying imaginative play with scenarios and combining possibilities, using a kind of cross-contextual thinking. Extraverted iNtuiting also can involve catalyzing people and extemporaneously shaping situations, spreading an atmosphere of change through emergent leadership

Fi
It is often hard to assign words to the values used to make introverted Feeling judgments since they are often associated with images, feeling tones, and gut reactions more than words. As a cognitive process, it often serves as a filter for information that matches what is valued, wanted, or worth believing in. There can be a continual weighing of the situational worth or importance of everything and a patient balancing of the core issues of peace and conflict in life’s situations. We engage in the process of introverted Feeling when a value is compromised and we think, “Sometimes, some things just have to be said.” On the other hand, most of the time this process works “in private” and is expressed through actions. It helps us know when people are being fake or insincere or if they are basically good. It is like having an internal sense of the “essence” of a person or a project and reading fine distinctions among feeling tones.

you could try determing her enneagram and instinctual stacking as well, maybe she has an uncommon type/etype combo which would be misleading when taking the stereotype route.

:shrug:

you could post a picture of her (if she allows it), at least around her eyes, and we could try and determine her type. EFJ eyes usually jump out at me immediatley.
 

Thalassa

Permabanned
Joined
May 3, 2009
Messages
25,183
MBTI Type
ISFP
Enneagram
6w7
Instinctual Variant
sx
hahaha. I love that she was intrigued by you for that.

That's basically how I've always described myself. I know tons of people, but none of them really know me. I consider myself friendly, but not actually social. It throws people off when they realize how guarded I am, considering how out there I am.

I would say this might be a quality of Fi, but ESFP's don't seem to be in that same distant or guarded boat. Perhaps this is another one of those reasons for why ISFP's and ENFP's get confused for one another at times.

I'd say, putting it in that respect as well, my friend is most likely more Fe.

Yeah it does seem almost to be an Fi quality, with the exception of ESFPs who can seem more just straight out there and all over the place. I think the confusion between ENFP and ISFP is common because neither of us are as out there as ESFPs but also not as self-contained as INFPs. I think there are also other qualities ENFP and ISFP share, like both types may gravitate toward a hippie/bohemian lifestyle, etc. I actually considered ISFP for myself at one point.

I'm glad if I could help you type your friend at all. :)
 

Thalassa

Permabanned
Joined
May 3, 2009
Messages
25,183
MBTI Type
ISFP
Enneagram
6w7
Instinctual Variant
sx
I think my other best friend from high school is ISFP, and we had this profound emotional bond. We just "got" each other. It was really intense, as much as the ENFJ and I were close, with the ISFP there was this whole different level of closeness and psychological intimacy. I think that's the magic of Fi. I think she's ISFP because she was always very, very visually artistic and played several different musical instruments, needed her alone time, had this awesome individualistic fashion sense, and is just totally quirky cool. She's a married mother of three now, and going to school to be a nutritionist/dietician. But we had this super amazing connection, we bonded on some weird inner level that I never did with ENFJ as much as I love her and as close as we are and as much as we laugh at the same things.

With the ISFP it was almost like...a relationship, for lack of a better word. It was a very intense "romantic friendship." My grandparents were actually disturbed by our friendship, thought there was something unnatural about it, which is funny to me now. It didn't bother her mom at all. I think her mom might be ESFP like my mom.
 

ceecee

Coolatta® Enjoyer
Joined
Apr 22, 2008
Messages
15,908
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
8w9
hmmm... i'm trying to consider the inwardly distant and outwardly distant thing. i can definitely see what you mean when i think of my other ENFP and ENFJ friends.

i'm also thinking now about her determination. she seems very determined when it comes to school and career. for a long time we talked about doing volunteer work together, and she was very adamant about it. our schedules didn't allow for us to do volunteer work together, so we gave up. but when we were originally talking about it, she told me she didn't want this to be one of those things where we say we'll do this or do that, but have no follow through. she was very serious. i think this is much more J of her than P.

i would say she probably seems much more outwardly focused than inwardly (in the ENFP way). but not necessarily more guarded... this is at least not something i've picked up on.

Very determined, this seems to be a hallmark of ENFJ's, at least in my experience with them. I feel they are guarded somewhat but not in a way easily seen or picked up on. They are very funny, they have that sense of humor that's almost tailored to their audience and they are so charismatic, you can't help but love them. Funny though, my ENFJ man can grow more weary in social settings than I do at times, perhaps it's all those vibes from others, the ones I miss or will never see that wears him out. In that case, I am a good wingman and I can say...we're outta here without issue.

They are very observant, very much seeing what's needed and then doing or organizing the means to do what's needed. Perhaps that's why volunteering rates high for your friend. They don't like to talk the talk, that's for sure. When they set their minds to something, they do and do it well. Career, good is not enough. Standards are set very high for themselves (and others, they are motivators) they don't see failure as an possibility and take it very hard when failure does occur. I think it is a gift to know them well as generally, they know a lot of people and have a lot of acquaintances and friends but few people know them. They are protective and can be smothering from time to time. They very much give off a "parental" feeling and I think they enjoy it.
 

skylights

i love
Joined
Jul 6, 2010
Messages
7,756
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
6w7
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
ah, ENFP and ENFJ. my best friend is ENFJ :) i'll run through a few differences between us. from your first post, my guess is ENFJ. not sure why, just sounds more Jish in general.

anyway, the first point i have to make, which i suppose will underscore all of this, is that when a P does something, it's often just because it seems right, while a J almost always has a longer-term future intention. not to say us Ps don't have plans or goals, but Js are much more deliberate, and that probably is the biggest factor underlying the differences between ENFJ and ENFP. Ps act following our Fi beliefs - almost like a code for how we need to act / respond to situations that we assess with Ne, our Perceiving function. Js don't have that underlying code, but instead have a Ni vision that pulls them forward, motivating them, and then their Judging function, Fe, manipulates the external world to meet that vision. of course we both do some of each, responding and initiating, but in general the P is going to tend to respond (because we Perceive first), and the J to initiate (because they Judge first). this plays out IRL between my friend and i. i tend to take things as they come; she tends to have very longterm intentions. that seems exhausting and restricting to me, but my way seems unstable and uncertain to her.

so there's that fundamental difference, plus the secondary most important of extraverted Feeling first or extraverted iNtuition first. a relatively easy test for this is probably how much of a general nerd she is... if she's kind of nerdy across the board, point towards ENFP; if she's only nerdy in a few choice subjects, point for ENFJ. and then if she's socially open and well-liked, point towards ENFP; if she's socially smooth and well-respected, point towards ENFJ.

Very determined, this seems to be a hallmark of ENFJ's, at least in my experience with them. I feel they are guarded somewhat but not in a way easily seen or picked up on. They are very funny, they have that sense of humor that's almost tailored to their audience and they are so charismatic, you can't help but love them. Funny though, my ENFJ man can grow more weary in social settings than I do at times, perhaps it's all those vibes from others, the ones I miss or will never see that wears him out. [...]

They are very observant, very much seeing what's needed and then doing or organizing the means to do what's needed. Perhaps that's why volunteering rates high for your friend. They don't like to talk the talk, that's for sure. When they set their minds to something, they do and do it well. Career, good is not enough. Standards are set very high for themselves (and others, they are motivators) they don't see failure as an possibility and take it very hard when failure does occur. I think it is a gift to know them well as generally, they know a lot of people and have a lot of acquaintances and friends but few people know them. They are protective and can be smothering from time to time. They very much give off a "parental" feeling and I think they enjoy it.

yes, yes, and yes to all of this. subtle guardedness; more obvious guardedness when you know them better. as an ENFP, i open up often - i don't have much reservation sharing my inner struggles with acquaintances. i hide my secrets in breadth, not depth (people in my yoga class don't know i'm secretly in love with a range rover, etc.) i'm not particularly garrulous or even talkative by any means, but i'm pretty open when it comes to hard subjects. my ENFJ friend, on the other hand, is much more selective about when she opens up about her deeper feelings and struggles. not about things that are obvious - but like, deep running concerns about life in general. she's more paranoid than i am, and harder on herself in terms of meeting her own standards, whereas i tend to hit more rough emotional patches along the road. correspondingly, ENFP tends to fountain inner feelings, while ENFJ avoids talking about them, and ENFP also tends to blow up when we get pissed (apologies if you've seen that in action) - ENFJ tends to bottle up stress and get quiet/leave when upset.

my ENFJ friend also tires of social situations more quickly than i do - curious, because she is more conventionally "social" than i am. she's better at keeping up with people, maintaining steady (platonic) relationships. she's much more observant, and pays more attention to people interaction, while i'm more interested in individuals and "atmospheres". she can socialize plenty, but having many acquaintances and few close friends is true for her. i tend to have more close friends, though our relationships are not as steady and i might not like all of those people as much as you would think.

can be a bitch but always knows the right thing to say, is very supportive and warm and loves people, but I think she's somehow inwardly more "distant" and less intense than me [...] I would overall say she has more "smooth" Fe with people than me, even though I think some people think of us as being similar with our humor, etc, especially people we went to school with. Her nurturing is a very Fe kind of nurturing. [...] I think ENFPs are more outwardly distant and ENFJs are more inwardly distant. In that I mean ENFPs can seem more flaky or play favorites, but when it comes down to it they show you who they are. ENFJs are more "present" with everyone and seem more fair, but inside are more guarded, I think.

yes to this as well. if you can observe her across situations talking to people who have very different relationships to her, you can probably get a reading on Fe because of how much she will change from interaction to interaction. a Fi person will probably tend to respond a similar way to this people, because they're anchored with Fi inside, but a Fe dom will tend to do more adjusting of their responses to meet the needs of the other. i think it's also useful to observe her in conversation with you - does she tend to keep the conversation on other people, especially behavior, and long-term goals / implications of patterns (Fe + Ni), or does she tend to talk alternating between various theoretical topics and themselves or others' inner feelings (Ne + Fi)? i notice with Fe dom/auxs i have to struggle more to get them to talk about themselves in conversation - they often will talk about you until you directly ask them about themselves. they're more polite but more distant. also, when an ENFJ doesn't like you, you get the cold shoulder. like marm said - can be a bitch if they want to be! when an ENFP doesn't like you... well, depends on the circumstances, i guess. you'll probably just get told why, instead of the ENFP having to play social games (which we are generally bad at) to slowly demonstrate their dislike.

that's a big difference, actually - ENFJ is much more patient with social protocol in general; ENFP often couldn't give a damn. what else... ENFP is more flexible, easier to convince to break their plans. ENFJ tends to adhere to plans, especially when there are people involved. all ExFJs i know HATE letting people down. me, i feel guilty, but unless i really like them, i don't get upset enough to do anything about it. ENFJs are better in charge, ENFPs are better troubleshooters. ENFJ seems to manipulate as second nature, ENFP seems to disregard rules as second nature. i think we both play favorites... ENFP is probably a little more obvious about it though, lol...

i like this quote:
enWTFp said:
But really, you can just guess by how they're dressed. ENFPs look strange and charming, ENFJs are all class
it's true... i'm never really "polished" even when i'm all dressed up... i'm always a little too artsy... and she's still put-together even when she's in PJs and a torn shirt... it's just, that J edge and P fluidity tend to sneak into everything...

Aladdin-306x400.jpg

ENFP...

2hs464y.jpg

ENFJ...

but when we were originally talking about it, she told me she didn't want this to be one of those things where we say we'll do this or do that, but have no follow through. she was very serious. i think this is much more J of her than P.

yeah, that sounds J. as for the guardedness - it's very subtle, imo. and she probably runs close to the J/P border, which means that maybe it's less of a trait in her than in other ENFJs who are strong Js.
 
G

Glycerine

Guest
ENFJ= more formal, have a controlled energy, they may sound more definite in their speech, goes with the status quo but has underlying rebellious energy (if we don't like the social protocol, we make our own rules and follow those), colorful in dress but still kinda put together, more paranoid and privacy conscious, tangential in speech in a subtle way, ironic, banter sense of humor, detached friendliness/warmth (until you get close to them).

ENFP=casual. go with the flow energy, their own person (outwardly against the status quo), flashy and artsy in dress, tangential in speech in a broad way, punny, wordplay sense of humor, more personally warm.

That's all I can think of right now.

EDIT: I don't know if it is just me but it seems like the ENFPs on here seem more mellow but very individualistic and ENFJs on here seem friendly but at the same time, they give off a "we are going to kick your ass if you screw with us" vibe.
 

Neutralpov

New member
Joined
Jun 29, 2009
Messages
310
EDIT: I don't know if it is just me but it seems like the ENFPs on here seem more mellow but very individualistic and ENFJs on here seem friendly but at the same time, they give off a "we are going to kick your ass if you screw with us" vibe.

:solidarity::rofl1:
 

JoSunshine

That's my name biotch!
Joined
Dec 17, 2009
Messages
659
MBTI Type
eNfj
Enneagram
2
^ x2.

I agree with pretty much everything skylights said...for a minute I was wondering if I was her best friend. :newink:

As far as the wild child, party girl aspect goes. My ex boyfriend said I wasn't a social butterfly, I was a social pterodactyl :) I had HUGE parties a couple times a year and knew everyone if I went out for the evening. But in true ENFJ form, I would only go out if it didn't interfere with more pressing obligations. If I knew I had to be to work the next day, I would leave to go home at a decent hour. And even on the weekends, I was usually one of the first to leave because as has been mentioned, I would get drained and want to go home. The other thing to note is that even when going out for a big time, I would always call my close friends first and try to come up with a plan that all of my friends would enjoy and I would stay with them the whole night...if I wanted to stay someplace and they wanted to leave because they were unhappy, I would go. There were a lot of ENFJ attributes in my party girl behavior.
 
Joined
Feb 5, 2011
Messages
81
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Enneagram
4w3
you could post a picture of her (if she allows it), at least around her eyes, and we could try and determine her type. EFJ eyes usually jump out at me immediatley.

Wow, would you care to explain that bit about the eyes a bit more? I've never heard of this, but I'd love to find out more. I want to know if I've got ENFJ's eyes :smile:
 
Top