User Tag List

First 123 Last

Results 11 to 20 of 26

  1. #11
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    4,226

    Default

    I dunno red herring..

    so I am only at 2:36-but Fi can be very distinctly empathic (by which I mean I very distinctly feel the pain and suffering of another as my own pain and suffering). This empathy forces me to help them, even if not in my own best interest. I actually love the speculative idea that we mirror others...an Fi user mirrors other Fi users well...a Ti user mirrors the analysis of another person and tries to match up their Ti idea to the other by a sort of back and forth comparison...mutual mirroring of the idea/emotions....

    So I finished watching...there are pieces of this that could embody Fe, but so much of this could be captured by Fi and Te as well. The idea that Fi can not reach beyond itself and care for others in the world, serve as a force to bond others together is incorrect. I dont use Fe, yet I feel strong bonds of loyalty and commitment to many people around me. It feels like having my arms linked in their arms-even if I have never met them, and knowing that I will be there when they need me...and they will be there when I need them... The mechanics of the empathic connection differs from Fe, but it is functional..

    The concept of empathy being the point of civilization...an empathic civilization, that is Fe i guess. I suppose the goal of Te would be something involving objective accomplishments-we would be bound as a group by what we have accomplished with an underlying emotive content.

    It still seems to me that both Te and Fe could equally serve to detribalize and unify individuals into a larger group. So they could each exist in isolation..

  2. #12
    i love skylights's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    6w7 so/sx
    Socionics
    EII Ne
    Posts
    7,835

    Default

    Fe gathers people for the sake of people.
    Fi gathers people for the sake of causes.

    they are both empathetic.

    i tend to agree that Fi world seems like utopia... but to be sure, i know that i appreciate the loving warmth of my Fe dom mother and best friend. they are less universally accepting, and sometimes i think they sort of overlook very important things, but they are also more actively nurturing and stable than i am.

    we are best together.

  3. #13
    hypersane Hive's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    1,005

    Default

    Wouldn't this result in total anarchy and chaos since Fi is so subjective?

  4. #14
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    4,226

    Default

    But Te is objective. Fi serves internally, Te serves externally. So no anarchy. Te may not be guided ethically, however greviously unethical behavior is inefficient, cheats the system of needed resources, disrupts the timelines and is dishonorable, thus not tolerated.

    This question has been on my mind for about six months as I spent some time in the spring chatting with a very clever ENTP about how screwed up things can get across the Fi/Te to Fe/Ti boundary. It is very noticable in the ENTP:ENFP interaction because we love each other but also want to kill each other.

    As we chatted, sharing our different views, we pulled the two groups apart, and suddenly the two halves fell into beautiful patterns. It was clockwork-for every question we asked, this split model worked. In isolation, each half seemed to make total sense and is stable. This is how I approach most type related questions nowdays....Hmm, that ESTP is doing this weird thing. How would this influence an ISFJ? What would the ISFJ do to influence an ESTP? and so on.

    In combination, total disaster as we just keep misunderstanding each other over and over again. Between individuals it can be rough, but once you extend it to an organizational level, it can create havoc in groups. Under stress the two halves seem to migrate into opposite behavioral directions making things even worse. It appears perhaps evolution traded the ability to communicate effectively and understand each other, for the advantageous dissonance of the other half to produce new ideas. Out of endless conflict and unhappiness, comes endless potential for growth, I suppose.

    Somebody got offended by my earlier post, which wasnt the intent. No doubt I get driven a bit nuts by some of the Fe users I work with, but on a meta level, I want to understand what and how to modify group interactions or rearrange people patterns in order to ease those frustrations. I would love to develop a system where you take a leader, take members of a group, then help the leader understand how to better interpret and motivate the group. MBTI and DISC teach that people are different and should be accepted as different. Neither seems to teach that the internal projections of the individual have to be set aside in order to understand others around you. I havent seen programs addressing taking type and then approaching an entire group either, granted I need to look more deeply.

  5. #15
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    MBTI
    infj
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Posts
    2,460

    Default

    the rifkin empathic civilization ted-- i sent it to an enfp friend of mine. it expresses both of us.

    the vision of Fe is distorted. we focus on goals, interaction management, articulation. all my infp friends love leonard cohen. Fe. the emotional articulation matches their own emotional awareness/sophistication.

    let's look at a world with only Ni or Ne. it's an incomplete vision. it's either too much gravity = black hole or too much expansion with no connection, no orbits, no hierarchical purpose. it's emerson without whitman or vice versa. why?

    Fi moves towards faith and Fe moves towards communication, articulation, effective encoding. you test the language and the message quality not the truth of the message against an internal framework. it's an output stage, but both forms are permeable and affected by the environmental conditions holistically. Fe types feel the interaction, the language, the signs, Fi types feel their own remembrances, their own judgments, and their own worldview.

    taking these functions out of context doesn't really make sense as far as intent goes. maybe all i functions get slightly annoyed at their e counterparts for not being diligent enough, for hogging the floor, for pushing them out of the way and trying to control them. my mind, my memories, my learnings, my framework--don't fuck with it! we all feel like that in our own various ways. our inner sense of purpose (and perhaps self-righteousness). who we see ourselves to be. what is (at least as a process) consistent within us.

  6. #16
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    4,226

    Default

    state I love your posts. Really, they make my brain tingle!!!

    As for Ne-well NeFi. NeFi thinks everything is already connected. Fi says so-we are all one big connected blob-no arguments allowed, it is some sort of weirdly Fi-istic truth. So Ne just needs to find all the connections and map them out. Cause I know they are there! hehehehe. Ne just find stuff that Fi already knew was reality. Thus the result is a connected whole.

    Hmmmm sorta like Fe in an INFJ uses Fe to connect people on the outside perhaps to reach the one answer that Ni says is the final truth? I really have no idea, I am just dancing in the wake of your Ni-isms cause they are very pretty!!

  7. #17
    Undisciplined Starry's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    5,625

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    taking these functions out of context doesn't really make sense as far as intent goes. maybe all i functions get slightly annoyed at their e counterparts for not being diligent enough, for hogging the floor, for pushing them out of the way and trying to control them. my mind, my memories, my learnings, my framework--don't fuck with it! we all feel like that in our own various ways. our inner sense of purpose (and perhaps self-righteousness). who we see ourselves to be. what is (at least as a process) consistent within us.
    There are a few people on this site that literally blow me away each and every time they open up their brain and share. Here is one of them.

  8. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    MBTI
    STP
    Posts
    10,501

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Xellotath View Post
    Picture that somehow cognitive function preference was narrowed down to genetics and hormones. Next picture a biochemical bomb that instantly kills anything with a prominent Fe expression.

    You know, maybe that's not scientifically feasible.

    Fine! Picture a scenario where evil aliens visited the earth and somehow hated Fe people and holocaust'd them out of existence.

    Ooh.. classy.

    "What would a human world composed of only Fi dominants, auxiliaries, tertiaries and inferiors look like?"

    Would we tear each other apart, or would we by the very nature of possessing one part of this pseudo-cosmic universal feeling / value function ... all get along so well to make the Carebears jealous?
    [PS:
    I love you Fe folks, this is nothing against you. I would defend you all from Xenu if I had a chance.

    -Love, Xel <3 ]
    Yes. It would be yin and yang without balance. Both parts seperate without the glue to hold them together.
    Im out, its been fun

  9. #19
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    MBTI
    infj
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Posts
    2,460

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Orobas View Post
    state I love your posts. Really, they make my brain tingle!!!

    As for Ne-well NeFi. NeFi thinks everything is already connected. Fi says so-we are all one big connected blob-no arguments allowed, it is some sort of weirdly Fi-istic truth. So Ne just needs to find all the connections and map them out. Cause I know they are there! hehehehe. Ne just find stuff that Fi already knew was reality. Thus the result is a connected whole.

    Hmmmm sorta like Fe in an INFJ uses Fe to connect people on the outside perhaps to reach the one answer that Ni says is the final truth? I really have no idea, I am just dancing in the wake of your Ni-isms cause they are very pretty!!
    Ni isn't nearly so final truth as p types seem to think. yet, p types do generally notice right away that it's not as open to external possibilities. we've built a hierarchy that we trust, and while that hierarchy isn't ever FINISHED (ie it's never final, it's never totally singular, etc), it does have durabilities in many positions. so it is resistant to change. we have established a sense of declarative facticity in key points and those fortify the whole project, those related perspectives organize the conceptual tree structure, provide the overall shape of the model. this is different than the possibilities, subjective positions, and subjective explorations of right-brained experientially situated possibilities. new whitmanesque vistas provide episodic, pragmatic knowledge based on where you've arrived through your process, your path of discovery.

    the way any process connects the introverted framework to the extroverted world is really important. the j/p split creates a lot of complexity very quickly when differentiating the way these processes can fit together.

    also, i want to see how you see Fi. one giant blob? i have some mental pictures that i'd like to test but i don't have words for them yet. my Ne friends have been teasing me with possibilities. my entp friend was trying to pull this tesla coil shit on me. i admit i was starry-eyed smitten with the analogy.

    Quote Originally Posted by StarryKnights View Post
    There are a few people on this site that literally blow me away each and every time they open up their brain and share. Here is one of them.
    thanks! validation and cigarettes. a good way to spend the early morning. wait--isn't that a jarmusch film?

  10. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    270

    Default

    You get along with other Fi/Te types so well that it would be a utopia? I only understand INFJs, so a world of only FJs and TPs would still have great communication gaps to me.

    Oroabs and Xellotath, it sounds like you need to read up on the benefits of Fe. I'm sorry that you've had negative experiences, but us Fe users aren't just mean. We experience compassion and contribute to the world. And Fe users experience just as much frustration in dealing with Fi users. Promise. Hey, it's not like I'm blameless, either. Currently, I'm studying the benefits of Si so I don't think of it as superfluous.

Similar Threads

  1. [INFJ] shower thought (unconscious Fi)
    By chobus in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 05-23-2016, 05:10 PM
  2. Thought experiment
    By GarrotTheThief in forum General Psychology
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: 08-28-2015, 10:34 PM
  3. How do you experience Fi? Am I doing it right? For Fi users.
    By Istbkleta in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 07-17-2011, 10:55 AM
  4. [Fi] INFP/ENFP: Do you feel "safe" to openly & freely share your thoughts about Fi here?
    By PeaceBaby in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 367
    Last Post: 12-14-2010, 12:24 PM
  5. [NT] Thought Experiment
    By alakazam in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 31
    Last Post: 01-30-2010, 10:37 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO