User Tag List

12 Last

Results 1 to 10 of 11

  1. #1
    ReflecTcelfeR
    Guest

    Default xNFJ's and conflict

    I'm very interested in hearing how you first react to a conflict and then how you have stopped, or put an end to conflicts. This is mainly to see how I compare to how you diffuse conflicts. I'm questioning my INTP-ness. I feel like I have an exorbant amount of Fe. Please help.

  2. #2
    Member Affably Evil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    5w4
    Posts
    73

    Default

    Whose conflicts, your own or mediating another's?
    5w4 sx/sp

  3. #3
    ReflecTcelfeR
    Guest

    Default

    Mediating others. Though, I am apart of the conflict. I was called upon another friend to speak for him as no one else would listen to him. I was very willing to defend him as he was/is losing a great deal of some of his close friends because of it. I just greatly dislike unnecessary conflict. Perhaps this is Ti interplaying with Fe instead of the other way around?

  4. #4
    Member Affably Evil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    5w4
    Posts
    73

    Default

    I never have any problem mediating a conflict or defending a friend/articulating their position. I find it easy to see other people's points of view, priorities, their goals, and how they might be complementary or where they might cause friction with each other. It almost always requires appealing to some compromise between parties and fleshing out where their ends and values are similar, or at the very least areas of agreement.

    While I try to use my powers for good, I almost always have a idea of which is the "best right choice" for mediating disputes, and have ideas about what other people "ought to" do to reach that "best right choice", though I don't offer that advice unless specifically asked for it by one of the parties involved. Because people deserve that respect for their autonomy and decision-making. But if someone asks me "How to I fix things with ____?" I'll have very specific ideas about how to go about doing that, while trying to examine the conflict and incorporate the relevant points of view and feelings/compromises that would be most optimal for both people involved.

    Yeah, appeals. Dealing with things privately. Trying to assess values and goals, trying to find that best right choice that'll work for everyone. Reasoning out the other person's position to each other party, trying to find compromise. Being gentle with hurt feelings. But at the same time, there have been conflicts where I haven't wanted the namby pamby positive resolution, where I just wanted to find whatever was making my friend cry and kill it. But I guess I feel like I can often anticipate the moves people can make to try to fix things, if that's what they want to do.

    It's when the conflict's locus is on me that I fall to pieces trying to accommodate the other person's feelings, because I can't not deprioritize my own. If I've hurt someone, even if they hurt me first, my own feelings are just poison to everyone. And having Te put me on the spot is always especially extremely flustering, since I need time to sort out my thoughts before I can comprehensively and objectively respond and demands for me to process emotions faster than I am comfortable with (with often has more to do with envisioning ramifications) will almost always provoke a retreat or a defense until I can process my position/consolidate my feelings and judge that the strength of my feelings are not reasonable out of whack.
    5w4 sx/sp

  5. #5
    ReflecTcelfeR
    Guest

    Default

    I think that may be the exact answer I need. It's the possiblities that you see with the situation working out that I lack. I can defend logically, but to search for the two common threads is more difficult. I mean to say that knowing what is 'right' to do in a situation is difficult for me to find, though I could logically get their the intuitive answer would take me a day or so to arrive at, thank you! I appreciate that. Succinctly answered too!

  6. #6
    Senior Member Onceajoan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    1w2
    Posts
    242

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ReflecttcelfeR View Post
    I'm very interested in hearing how you first react to a conflict and then how you have stopped, or put an end to conflicts. This is mainly to see how I compare to how you diffuse conflicts. I'm questioning my INTP-ness. I feel like I have an exorbant amount of Fe. Please help.
    Hmm. I'm not sure how old you are... I think as a person gets older their relationship to conflict often changes.

    I'm also not sure how "T"ish you are... I think that makes a difference. Though I test INFJ now - I used to test INTJ through most of my young adult life. And I was very INTJ! I believe that developing my Feeling side I certainly helped me deal with conflict - or at least see it differently.

    BTW: I have two INTPs in my immediate family. They love to debate ideas and win arguments. It's all about the logic but no sympathy or understanding of the other person's perspective. I have some problem with this since developing more feeling. I used to love debating and arguing (I still do to some extent) but there's a time and place for everything. Debating your spouse and questioning the internal logic of their argument (whether I committed a logical fallacy or made a tautological argument) is really counterproductive to developing healthy and loving relationships. What could have been civil and meaningful discussion in my marriage turned into a logic game which was very invalidating. Pretty much destroyed my marriage.

    What I've learned about conflict (but I still am not very good in this arena):

    1) You really need to listen to what the other person is saying. This is extremely difficult when you are convinced by the strength of your logic or argument. There's a human and emotional component which may seem illogical , but is still relevant - sometimes difficult for INTJs and INTPs to accept or believe.

    2) Don't believe that because you are speaking louder, more forcefully or are dominating the conversation by interrupting that somehow you are "winning". The concept of "winning" needs to go out the window. Competitive types have difficulty with this notion. You need to listen....AND

    3) Be willing to compromise. It's not about winners and losers.

    4) If you aren't making headway with the conflict, revisit. Sometimes if you step back (NTs can do this well) and analyze the situation from all angles you can come up with new ways to look at the situation and resolve it.

    5)Don't try to talk about things when you're angry. This is difficult when things become emotional (even for NTs who think they're not being emotional when indeed they are). Step back and revisit. Anger will only serve to make the conflict worse.

    I have also observed that if the conflict has a great deal of emotional context, the INTPs in my family will run and hide. In this case:
    - I try to give them time to process their feelings (if they can, if they know what their feelings are)
    - I gently try to approach them to get some reading as to their feelings (not always effective)
    - If all else fails, I try to keep my discussions and logical and rational as I can. They will open up in that case (but not necessarily in the way I want them to). Hey, but at least we're talking.

    I think conflict is extremely complicated when you're dealing with an NF on one side and an NT on the other. Conflict takes on different connotations.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Onceajoan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    1w2
    Posts
    242

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Affably Evil View Post
    I never have any problem mediating a conflict or defending a friend/articulating their position. I find it easy to see other people's points of view, priorities, their goals, and how they might be complementary or where they might cause friction with each other. It almost always requires appealing to some compromise between parties and fleshing out where their ends and values are similar, or at the very least areas of agreement.

    While I try to use my powers for good, I almost always have a idea of which is the "best right choice" for mediating disputes, and have ideas about what other people "ought to" do to reach that "best right choice", though I don't offer that advice unless specifically asked for it by one of the parties involved. Because people deserve that respect for their autonomy and decision-making. But if someone asks me "How to I fix things with ____?" I'll have very specific ideas about how to go about doing that, while trying to examine the conflict and incorporate the relevant points of view and feelings/compromises that would be most optimal for both people involved.

    Yeah, appeals. Dealing with things privately. Trying to assess values and goals, trying to find that best right choice that'll work for everyone. Reasoning out the other person's position to each other party, trying to find compromise. Being gentle with hurt feelings. But at the same time, there have been conflicts where I haven't wanted the namby pamby positive resolution, where I just wanted to find whatever was making my friend cry and kill it. But I guess I feel like I can often anticipate the moves people can make to try to fix things, if that's what they want to do.

    It's when the conflict's locus is on me that I fall to pieces trying to accommodate the other person's feelings, because I can't not deprioritize my own. If I've hurt someone, even if they hurt me first, my own feelings are just poison to everyone. And having Te put me on the spot is always especially extremely flustering, since I need time to sort out my thoughts before I can comprehensively and objectively respond and demands for me to process emotions faster than I am comfortable with (with often has more to do with envisioning ramifications) will almost always provoke a retreat or a defense until I can process my position/consolidate my feelings and judge that the strength of my feelings are not reasonable out of whack.
    This is better than anything I could possibly come up with. It sounds like you handle conflicts extremely well. Wish I could.

  8. #8
    can't handcuff the wind Z Buck McFate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Posts
    3,683

    Default

    Everything Affably wrote applies remarkably well for me.

    One of my best friends is an INTP- my dad is as well- and we tend to deal with conflict in incredibly similar ways (I'm e5, so a lot of the similarity is because of that). I think the biggest difference would be- because I am bombarded with possibilities for why the conflict is there (as mentioned above), and they are not- I do a lot more 'looping' when it comes to resolving it. They tend to let go of things that don't make logical sense much faster than I am able to. I feel the need to go a step further and dissect motives until I can find some common ground to point out to everyone. It isn't that they never feel the need to do this themselves, it's just that they feel it significantly less frequently than I do- they don't ever feel the need to obsess/loop about it.
    Reality is a collective hunch. -Lily Tomlin

    5w4 sx/sp Johari / Nohari

  9. #9
    Member Affably Evil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    5w4
    Posts
    73

    Default

    ^ Yeah, I have a craving to understand people's motivations as well, and can get into the situational looping. Once I know someone well though, I seldom feel baffled by things they choose to do (beyond finding ways to incorporate it into my general mental framework of the person). Not to say I'm never surprised, because of course people can surprise you (and surprise themselves), but that people seem to act pretty consistently once you've got a handle on their base values and motivations.

    And yes, I think judging which would be the best outcome is key for deciding which is the most desirable because it helps you chart or adjust a course for settling the disagreement rather than just generating dozens and dozens of possibilities. But I think it requires careful consultation of and listening to both of the parties, and respecting everyone's feelings (as much as possible and/or "of the good"). Because the dark side of having an idea of what is the "best outcome" is the temptation to then bully the parties into following it, which can be adverse to or downright add damage to feelings of hurt/processing/healing.

    Which is why I try to have restraint with meddling tendencies if at all possible.
    5w4 sx/sp

  10. #10
    can't handcuff the wind Z Buck McFate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Posts
    3,683

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Affably Evil View Post
    And yes, I think judging which would be the best outcome is key for deciding which is the most desirable because it helps you chart or adjust a course for settling the disagreement rather than just generating dozens and dozens of possibilities. But I think it requires careful consultation of and listening to both of the parties, and respecting everyone's feelings (as much as possible and/or "of the good"). Because the dark side of having an idea of what is the "best outcome" is the temptation to then bully the parties into following it, which can be adverse to or downright add damage to feelings of hurt/processing/healing.
    Yeah, meddling tendencies are counter-productive. There’s a fine line between offering help and imposing it. If the ‘best outcome’ doesn’t feel respectful to everyone involved, then it isn’t the best outcome. Demonstrating respect for everyone’s position is the best way to get them to listen to you, imo. And when I say ‘demonstrating’- I mean actually having respect for them- because actual respect is pretty self-evident. I personally get willful and a bit resentful if I sense someone is imposing ‘help’ on me.

    It’s funny, whether or not I actually help diminish conflict around me isn’t as important to me as simply figuring out why the conflict is there. I thrive on figuring it out simply for the sake of figuring it out. If I think the parties involved might be interested in or benefit from whatever I have to say, then I’ll say something- which usually amounts to pointing out something about the other side’s point of view- but I always include “for what it’s worth” disclaimers. And I’m adamant about distinctly stating my opinion of ‘best outcome’ as opinion- which others are free to consider or dismiss. That approach, in itself, usually makes people more receptive to listening.

    Of course it feels even better when others benefit from what I have to say, but the thrill- for me- is in figuring it out.
    Reality is a collective hunch. -Lily Tomlin

    5w4 sx/sp Johari / Nohari

Similar Threads

  1. Words, meaning, acrimony and conflict
    By Survive & Stay Free in forum Politics, History, and Current Events
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-26-2011, 06:44 PM
  2. Awareness meditation and conflict with N's
    By Hermes in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 07-18-2010, 02:54 AM
  3. [SP] SP's and Conflict
    By KDude in forum The SP Arthouse (ESFP, ISFP, ESTP, ISTP)
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 02-11-2010, 08:24 PM
  4. [SJ] SJ's and conflict...
    By GirlFromMars in forum The SJ Guardhouse (ESFJ, ISFJ, ESTJ, ISTJ)
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 01-07-2010, 12:04 PM
  5. [NT] Berens' comments on NTs and conflict
    By rivercrow in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: 07-13-2007, 05:05 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO