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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    as for a look in the eye... this has nothing at all to do with NFs being special or anything... but there is a look that NFs have sometimes, which is like they are attentive to you in a friendly manner, but also like they're looking through you - like they're looking for more information than they're getting. i would venture to say it could be an actual NF/non-NF difference, present in specific movements of the eyes. i wouldn't be surprised to hear that Ns and Ss, and Fs and Ts, have differences in their eye movement patterns, since we tend to pay attention to different things. the "looking through" is probably an N thing and the close people-attention is probably a F thing. maybe it's just a natural reaction to realize when people are looking at and responding to the same things that we do. i also think it would seem a fair statistic that NFs in particular would pick up on an odd difference like this, not because we're better in any way than the other types, but because we're both pattern and people attuned.
    Good description. I would add that this same feeling can be there also without eye contact. I don't know how to describe it, though. Maybe it's a bit like absent-mindedness without actually being absent-minded. If that makes any sense.

  2. #42
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by copperfish17 View Post
    OMG WHY IS THE WORLD SO MEAN TO US? SOB. BEING A MINORITY AUTOMATICALLY MAKES OUR LIVES HARDER AND THUS ENTITLES US TO THE RIGHT TO WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, AND WHINE SUM MOAR. THE MAJORITY ANTAGONIZES US AS A RULE, CUZ WE'RE THE SPECIAL LITTLE SNOWFLAKES OF THIS WORLD THAT NO ONE UNDERSTANDS. BOOHOO. WE'RE DAMN SPECIAL AND NO ONE IS ALLOWED TO TELL US OTHERWISE CUZ THEY'RE NOT ONE OF US. LET'S STICK THROUGH THIS CRUEL WORLD TOGETHER CUZ WE HAVE EVERYTHING SO MUCH HARDER THAN OTHERS CRAI CRAI CRAI. EVERYONE ELSE'S LIFE IS ALWAYS EASIER THAN OURS.


    I'M A SPECIAL LITTLE SNOWFLAKE LOVE MEEEE.

    TBH I don't think this whole "kinship" thing has to do with being an NF/being NFs. Universal tr00th: People tend to be more empathetic to people who are similar to themselves. This goes across the board and does not pertain solely to NFs.
    absolutely.

    i do think that there will be certain ways in which an NF relating to another NF will be different than how NTs relate to each other, or any other type. it's interesting to explore that, regardless of whether NFs are actually a minority or not.

    I am convinced, however, that NFs are naturally more prone to cliquish behavior than are the other three temperaments.
    it wouldn't really surprise me. i'm not a fan of the emo whine, but, at the same time, i think that for someone who IRL has often been marked as "weird" and who is really sensitive to people's opinions, it's easy to see why they might suddenly become cliquish with other people they stumble across who not only understand, but appreciate, their weirdness and sensitivity. it feels "safe". Fs in general tend to cluster together, also - we tend to support and reassure one another, which might seem cliquish to people who care less about emotional support and reassurance. plus NFs have a high representation of enneagram 4s.

    not saying it's legitimate or good, just that i see reasons why it may be that way that other than NFs being full of themselves and/or having a martyr complex. which, no doubt, some NFs are and do.

    and i actually even feel this way about some INFPs within the NF group. it's frustrating and annoying, and i've had to come to terms with understanding the same sort of reasons behind that phenomenon.

    Quote Originally Posted by Z Buck McFate View Post
    Yeah, agreed. If anything, if I had to guess how NFs could recognize each other through eye contact it would be from lack of immediate presence. Even when there's eye contact, there's often a feeling like the person is thinking about something else.
    yeah!! they're kinda drifty. and when you're talking, sometimes they pause and look somewhere else, and then you get some bizarre out of the blue jump to a related subject. i feel like it's even more intense for me personally with Ni dom/aux. i've had to learn this with a Ni aux friend of mine. when we talk, she'll seem much more on a subject than me - my thoughts are more jumpy and scattered - but then suddenly she'll ask something out of the blue that seems to have nothing to do with anything. except its usually very related, and quite brilliant, and after she makes that initial statement or question, if i respond in an attentive/interested way, she'll explain it. but i notice that with some people who talk to her, they kind of interpret the jump as "wtf were you even listening to me?". but it's not that she's not listening, she just had some thought process running in the back of her mind the whole time, and it suddenly became relevant to mention for whatever reason. i think she's more obvious about it with me than with some other people - and i think that's the N part of the NF connection. we see that we can make these nutty seemingly unrelated jumps in conversation and the other person will easily follow, not because they're "smarter" or "quicker" or anything, but simply because they have a similar familiarity with thought in absentia.

    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    Good description. I would add that this same feeling can be there also without eye contact. I don't know how to describe it, though. Maybe it's a bit like absent-mindedness without actually being absent-minded. If that makes any sense.

  3. #43
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    To me it's just a language thing. I'll know I am dealing with NF/SF people simply by the choice of words they use to explain and express things.
    I know when I am dealing with an NF, when they can actually understand my thoughts and feelings. SFs are good at getting my feelings if not my thoughts. SF's when they don't understand my thoughts still respect them and enjoy the fact they may not be typical.

    So I feel the connection is Through F more than S and N .. The communication is more an N thing.. but that usually cant be determined until an actual exchange of information takes place.

    JMO

  4. #44
    Senior Member Vamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by copperfish17 View Post

    OMG WHY IS THE WORLD SO MEAN TO US? SOB. BEING A MINORITY AUTOMATICALLY MAKES OUR LIVES HARDER AND THUS ENTITLES US TO THE RIGHT TO WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, AND WHINE SUM MOAR. THE MAJORITY ANTAGONIZES US AS A RULE, CUZ WE'RE THE SPECIAL LITTLE SNOWFLAKES OF THIS WORLD THAT NO ONE UNDERSTANDS. BOOHOO. WE'RE DAMN SPECIAL AND NO ONE IS ALLOWED TO TELL US OTHERWISE CUZ THEY'RE NOT ONE OF US. LET'S STICK THROUGH THIS CRUEL WORLD TOGETHER CUZ WE HAVE EVERYTHING SO MUCH HARDER THAN OTHERS CRAI CRAI CRAI. EVERYONE ELSE'S LIFE IS ALWAYS EASIER THAN OURS.

    Lots of exaggerations there, but you get the idea.

    Disclaimer: I am not anti-NF in any way; I am only criticizing certain immature NFs here. ^
    That's where I am in my life right now. Let me work through it instead of throwing rocks (or trying to chide others into growing up RIGHT NOW because other people being at a different point in their lives somehow bothers you so much you have to snipe in a thread that has nothing to do with you). I'll be over it when I'm good and ready, thank you very much. Or I'll never be over it. You'll just have to look in another direction if "immaturity" bothers you. Or you know, wield your unhelpful hammer of truth and justice (mocking others) to all those you deem "immature" and beneath you (because you're never immature, hence the mocking all caps exaggeration of some peoples' genuine feelings of being left out).

    Eh, I see MBTI as a pointless hindrance when it comes to understanding relations (partly because of "you're so immature *pointless mocking*"). It's only good for the individual. And at that, itt will only make you believe that you are odd because of the way it "types" people. You may be odd but why bother finding out why? It's a lot like the zodiac etc., it only puts up walls and attracts people who superstitious. But because it's "psychology" it also attracts the type that wants to try and correct "immature" behavior by being immature in return.
    George Bernard Shaw in cartoon form.

  5. #45
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    I have a special ability to spot other SPs, it's not usually in the eyes though, it's usually in the trail of destruction and chaos in their wake.
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  6. #46
    Senior Member copperfish17's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post


    I'M A SPECIAL LITTLE SNOWFLAKE LOVE MEEEE.
    I LOVE YOUUUU.

    Something just died inside me.

    i do think that there will be certain ways in which an NF relating to another NF will be different than how NTs relate to each other, or any other type. it's interesting to explore that, regardless of whether NFs are actually a minority or not.
    Agreed...

    it wouldn't really surprise me. i'm not a fan of the emo whine, but, at the same time, i think that for someone who IRL has often been marked as "weird" and who is really sensitive to people's opinions, it's easy to see why they might suddenly become cliquish with other people they stumble across who not only understand, but appreciate, their weirdness and sensitivity. it feels "safe". Fs in general tend to cluster together, also - we tend to support and reassure one another, which might seem cliquish to people who care less about emotional support and reassurance. plus NFs have a high representation of enneagram 4s.

    not saying it's legitimate or good, just that i see reasons why it may be that way that other than NFs being full of themselves and/or having a martyr complex. which, no doubt, some NFs are and do...
    ...and understood.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vamp View Post
    That's where I am in my life right now. Let me work through it instead of throwing rocks (or trying to chide others into growing up RIGHT NOW because other people being at a different point in their lives somehow bothers you so much you have to snipe in a thread that has nothing to do with you). I'll be over it when I'm good and ready, thank you very much. Or I'll never be over it. You'll just have to look in another direction if "immaturity" bothers you. Or you know, wield your unhelpful hammer of truth and justice (mocking others) to all those you deem "immature" and beneath you (because you're never immature, hence the mocking all caps exaggeration of some peoples' genuine feelings of being left out).

    Eh, I see MBTI as a pointless hindrance when it comes to understanding relations (partly because of "you're so immature *pointless mocking*"). It's only good for the individual. And at that, it will only make you believe that you are odd because of the way it "types" people. You may be odd but why bother finding out why? It's a lot like the zodiac etc., it only puts up walls and attracts people who superstitious. But because it's "psychology" it also attracts the type that wants to try and correct "immature" behavior by being immature in return.
    Boo hiss kitty. If you haven't noticed yet, I'm just terribly fond of poking fun at people. My life is gonna be so depressing without all the idiots and immature people in this world to make fun of (note: I'm not trying to imply that you're an idiot/immature person here). In a sense, I can't help but turn everything into a joke - no matter how tragic or infuriating. I know I can be a bull in a China shop, but honestly I feel no remorse.

    As for "[sniping] in a thread that has nothing to do with [me]," I have all the rights to contribute to this thread, and I think that I have made several valid points in my post. The threads I am NOT allowed to contribute to are those in the temperament-exclusive Private Forums. I believe you know this.

    If you thought I would genuinely care about you/your life/your viewpoints/your "immaturity" then I would like to (in the politest way possible) ask you to think again. Your viewpoints do not bother or irritate me in the least. I do, however, find them interesting and somewhat funny in a dry sense.

    Well, the only thing I have left to say to you now is... you have contributed to my understanding of (at least a certain kind of) people. Kudos to you!

    As inclined as you may be to perceive next to everything I say as personal attacks, no sarcasm was intended in any part of this post.
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    The worst mistake people make in political arguments is assuming that the other side is not trying to do the right thing. This simple oversight makes productive conversation nearly impossible.

  7. #47
    Senior Member Vamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by copperfish17 View Post
    Boo hiss kitty. If you haven't noticed yet, I'm just terribly fond of poking fun at people.
    Yes, because it's my job to follow your every post on this board.


    My life is gonna be so depressing without all the idiots and immature people in this world to make fun of (note: I'm not trying to imply that you're an idiot/immature person here). In a sense, I can't help but turn everything into a joke - no matter how tragic or infuriating. I know I can be a bull in a China shop, but honestly I feel no remorse.

    As for "[sniping] in a thread that has nothing to do with [me]," I have all the rights to contribute to this thread, and I think that I have made several valid points in my post. The threads I am NOT allowed to contribute to are those in the temperament-exclusive Private Forums. I believe you know this.

    If you thought I would genuinely care about you/your life/your viewpoints/your "immaturity" then I would like to (in the politest way possible) ask you to think again. Your viewpoints do not bother or irritate me in the least. I do, however, find them interesting and somewhat funny in a dry sense.

    Well, the only thing I have left to say to you now is... you have contributed to my understanding of (at least a certain kind of) people. Kudos to you!

    As inclined as you may be to perceive next to everything I say as personal attacks, no sarcasm was intended in any part of this post.
    I turn everything into a joke when I know the person well. But I'm an introvert that way.
    George Bernard Shaw in cartoon form.

  8. #48
    Senior Member copperfish17's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vamp View Post
    Yes, because it's my job to follow your every post on this board.
    More like 'cause because we've butted heads in the past on this forum. I think it was on the one of the NT threads, but I'm not too sure.
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  9. #49
    Senior Member Vamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by copperfish17 View Post
    More like 'cause because we've butted heads in the past on this forum. I think it was on the one of the NT threads, but I'm not too sure.
    Yeah I think so but still . ...I may not have a life but I'm not that bored. But I get it "it's not my problem, you should just KNOW".
    George Bernard Shaw in cartoon form.

  10. #50
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    It would be an excellent moment for me to cause more trouble, but the cat gave me a stern look and told me that maybe I should stop.

    I think kitty is disappointed in me.

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