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  1. #51
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    From Helen Palmer's book:

    3s and 7s are similar. 7s have a lot of energy and work hard as long as they see an interest. At first glance they may look like 3s: they seek for competition, are interested with victory and concerned about the reflection of their excellence in the sight of others. Even if 7s and 3s look similars from an outside point of view, they are actually driven by very different worldviews.

    7s, sitting on the same bench at the forefront of Competition, are engaged in "one meaningful activity, one among many others." They also want to be highly esteemed by others, but not in a form of power over them. They do not like being labeled according to their profession. "To tell I'm physicist is limitating, I am very much more than that." Their idea is to excel in many activities. "I run, I cook, I write poems, I know everything." They are much less likely to reach the top, especially if it take too much time or force them to confront those who've not a good opinion about them. They want to know they have been selected to join the group of the best, but are not always willing to limit their other interests to reach the top rank. "I know I'm capable but I don't need to prove my value. " They work several days in a row to earn their money allowing them to escape, rather than to buy the car of their dreams. Proof of success is to have done a lot of fascinating things and having reached the summit without allowing himself to be trapped by commitments.

    The psychological difference between the workaholic 3 and the 7 very much more narcissistic lies in that, for 3s, their value is based on a deserved personal success. His true self may not exist, but his identity card exists. He's focused on the perfection of his work, because his value in the sight of others depends of the brilliant achievement of a task. As his reward lies not in the well-being, but the power to inspire respect from others, he works much harder than it would want.

    The 7, also eager that people to have a good opinion of him, consider their own self-esteem as an accurate reflection of his inner value. He do not need to constantly make efforts because "life is beautiful and I am happy to be who I am." if others do not recognize his merits, he turned himself to seek comfort in denial and rationalizing it by saying he is not responsible for this. His ego has as many dimensions as there are ways to play. Wrong time can be erased with a walk in the countryside, a good book, a large sun, a cup of hot tea. Somehow, the 7 suffers less than the 3 from the indifference of others, because they keep company with themselves and are convinced of their bright destiny.
    EsTP 6w7 Sx/Sp

    Chaotic Neutral

    E=60% S=55% T=70% P=80%

    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  2. #52
    Senior Member alcea rosea's Avatar
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    This is interesting (Petra Pan's previous post) because I've been there for my friends, the hard times, one of them lost her mother and another went through a rough divorce (and these are just few examples). And I'm the "lighter and the happier" 7w6 but I'm not so always. I can be serious and all that. I was able to reach them to stay by them and to help them with their anxiety and sadness and to comfort them and to listen. And I got the feedback that they appreciated it and it was good thing. Maybe it's maturity, maybe it's empathy, maybe it's both.

    Positivity isn't necessarily ignoring problems. In studies, positivity is attached to health. So, it must be good for you. But you are right, a person should be able to be serious when it's needed. But what your friends are lacking is empathy, because an empathic person sees when other person is down and will comfort him/her. And empathy "skill" isint' necessarily related to enneagram...

    I must say enneagram still doesn't make any sense to me... (a side comment...)

  3. #53
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    there's a lot of truth in what you all have said of 7's but i agree with alcea rosea...i have been there for friends as well...staying up all night listening to them talk...bringing soup and medicine to a friend who was sick...cleaning their house...going to the store...whatever...i will freely give of my time and take care of someone when needed...i will likely not bring up the emotional talk but i'll be there in every way and available to listen if they decide they want to....i'm very empathetic but emotionally sort of independent so i give people space in that way...maybe it comes off as uncaring but for me it's just one of those things...sometimes words aren't needed....sometimes you can just feel what the other is feeling and you're both aware of it.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  4. #54
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    "Positivity isn't necessarily ignoring problems. In studies, positivity is attached to health. So, it must be good for you."

    To a degree (and yes positivity tends to be ignoring problems), but when you are trying to help other people that might not understand or be able to use positivity , you have to adapt.

    And positivity gets in the way of learning. People who are just positive have no reason to learn from their mistakes or from circumstances, because things will always turn for the better in the end. Until they don't. Rinse and repeat.

  5. #55
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    And about 7s and helping others, I just wanted to say that "compassion" actually literally means "suffer with" in Latin.

  6. #56
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    When I try and take Ennergram tests online the results make no sense at all. However i read a big book filled with descriptions and identified most with the 4w5 even though they sounded totally emo.

    Someone once suggested type 2. Type 3 or 7 do not sound familiar to me at all.

  7. #57
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moiety View Post
    And about 7s and helping others, I just wanted to say that "compassion" actually literally means "suffer with" in Latin.
    right...and that's how i meant it in my post as well....if one feels the emotions of others and experiences it with them...they are being there with them emotionally.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  8. #58
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady X View Post
    right...and that's how i meant it in my post as well....if one feels the emotions of others and experiences it with them...they are being there with them emotionally.
    Was just letting it out there. But now that you mention it, in my opinion bringing the emotional talk up is part of my style and of letting one truly feel the emotions of others. I believe in sharing the load. And I think not talking about things, only creates the illusion of getting over problems. Emotional independence is all well and good, but I've had many friends that only got through problems after they stopped being stoic about it. And I know guys I never saw crying before, that kinda thanked me for being so nagging about talking about it in depth, because they felt so much better about it afterwards.

    And I think it brings people together. Not being ashamed of one's pain and sharing it as just another part of our personality.

  9. #59
    Senior Member Malkavia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    From Helen Palmer's book:

    3s and 7s are similar. 7s have a lot of energy and work hard as long as they see an interest. At first glance they may look like 3s: they seek for competition, are interested with victory and concerned about the reflection of their excellence in the sight of others. Even if 7s and 3s look similars from an outside point of view, they are actually driven by very different worldviews.

    7s, sitting on the same bench at the forefront of Competition, are engaged in "one meaningful activity, one among many others." They also want to be highly esteemed by others, but not in a form of power over them. They do not like being labeled according to their profession. "To tell I'm physicist is limitating, I am very much more than that." Their idea is to excel in many activities. "I run, I cook, I write poems, I know everything." They are much less likely to reach the top, especially if it take too much time or force them to confront those who've not a good opinion about them. They want to know they have been selected to join the group of the best, but are not always willing to limit their other interests to reach the top rank. "I know I'm capable but I don't need to prove my value. " They work several days in a row to earn their money allowing them to escape, rather than to buy the car of their dreams. Proof of success is to have done a lot of fascinating things and having reached the summit without allowing himself to be trapped by commitments.

    The psychological difference between the workaholic 3 and the 7 very much more narcissistic lies in that, for 3s, their value is based on a deserved personal success. His true self may not exist, but his identity card exists. He's focused on the perfection of his work, because his value in the sight of others depends of the brilliant achievement of a task. As his reward lies not in the well-being, but the power to inspire respect from others, he works much harder than it would want.

    The 7, also eager that people to have a good opinion of him, consider their own self-esteem as an accurate reflection of his inner value. He do not need to constantly make efforts because "life is beautiful and I am happy to be who I am." if others do not recognize his merits, he turned himself to seek comfort in denial and rationalizing it by saying he is not responsible for this. His ego has as many dimensions as there are ways to play. Wrong time can be erased with a walk in the countryside, a good book, a large sun, a cup of hot tea. Somehow, the 7 suffers less than the 3 from the indifference of others, because they keep company with themselves and are convinced of their bright destiny.
    Thank you!

    Good contribution and I feel like I understand 3s and 7s a lot more now.

  10. #60
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    MBTI is how to process information cognitively and make decisions. Enneagram is your core desires and fears and your emotional needs. I'm an E/INFP 4 with both wings (3 and 5)

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