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  1. #91
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallulah View Post
    I just know there's a big difference in maybe the way that the attachments are expressed. Maybe it's the feel of the presentation? There's always some level of having arrived at the decision through observation and detachment, even though the person might inwardly feel deeply about it?
    You tell me. You sounded so certain before. See what happens when we delve deeply. All definitions seem rather limp in their capacity to illuminate.

    Thinkers almost always have that layer of detachment, even when we're trying to be warm and fuzzy. It's like having to detach from the feeling to express the thought clearly, then maybe being conscious of adding the feeling back in.
    That feels right. Your description, I mean.

    I have deep feelings, too, though I'm not always walking around being aware of them. Sometimes I get that overwhelming feeling you were talking about, of like almost not being able to handle the idea of some injustice happening--stuff like animal abuse, intentional cruelty of any kind, people getting hurt as a result of other people's stupidity or reckless choices. And I sometimes think that I wouldn't be able to handle feeling like that all the time. I need the rationality to keep me sane. I need a step back. I have also noticed that unless something has happened that has stripped away my barriers (sometimes bouts with depression, etc), my strong feelings will come out as thoughts. I might feel something strongly, but I'll express it as a thought. I find with a lot of thinkers with feely tendencies, they are unaware just how much they're still coming across as thinkers. They'll always give themselves away in presentation. When I'm feeling more "raw," I can express my feelings more directly. But it's not my usual mode.
    Does your music help you connect more directly to your feeling center? I find that my feelings become more integrated when I am creating art and being honest about my more tender and fearful feelings. When I express them as feelings rather than detach from them.

    This is hard stuff to find words for!
    Yes! But fun, isn't it?
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  2. #92
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moiety View Post
    Values in general. And to what extent it is even important to uphold them and have others understand them. More specifically, values on love and how we show it to others and the meaning behind our actions in the first place. But lots of other stuff. I think out loud.
    Yes, but why do YOU want to sort this? Where does the conflict originate?

    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    Are you really going to pretend that you don't know what Te is, Ti user?
    I'm not pretending. I am a complete amateur when it comes to typology. Why don't you just explain it to me so we can move on?
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  3. #93
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Domino View Post
    Sugarpie, you can't "work" on being lovable. You just *are*. Understand? Love and being lovable are not linked. Love is something learned and learned about and applied. Being lovable is in the eye of the beholder. You have such eyes with you.
    Well then, perhaps I am trying to be better to myself then.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  4. #94
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    Yes, but why do YOU want to sort this? Where does the conflict originate?
    My moral perfectionism (pedantry?) and sense of self. I have a bit of a philosopher in me, and believe in being thorough in the search of the right answers and questions. I believe if I live my life while staying true to myself (and what am I, if not my values? does anything else but what we uphold and offer the world really matter?) and these values I try to distill and perfect ...I will be happy and have no regrets.

    If you want to go deeper there is nothing I hate worse than hypocrisy and someone you can't trust. So I want to be a good person that is consistent and trustworthy. Irrespective of context.

    And this is where the choir sings about inferior Si or some shit like that.

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    I'm not pretending. I am a complete amateur when it comes to typology. Why don't you just explain it to me so we can move on?
    From Lenore Thomson:

    From the Te perspective, anything for which you can't give an operational definition in terms of measurement (an "objective test") doesn't exist. The decision criteria are defined not exactly in terms of the things: they're defined in terms of observations of a sort that anyone can do and get the same result. You put the totality of the real-world situation onto your scales, so that all causal factors come into play--both known and unknown. What's accessible to you is the reading on the scale: that and only that is the basis for your decision.

    As a dominant function, Te typically leads one to pursue and collect reliable ways of making decisions to get predictable results. The repeatability of a process becomes one of the main criteria for finding it valuable. Repeatable processes are valuable from a Te perspective because they enable you to make agreements with other people, where there is no doubt as to whether each party has fulfilled its part of the agreement. Making and delivering on promises is often how a Te attitude leads one to understand ethics.

    The statue of the blind woman holding a balance scale, to symbolize justice, might be one of the clearest symbols of the Te attitude.

  6. #96
    shadow boxer strawberries's Avatar
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    i don’t give a sod what type you think you are. just please refrain from posting stuff like your brethren wonkavision did in his last thread. he messed himself and then burned out in a fit of enfp-emo. stuff like that makes my face hurt.

  7. #97
    Senior Member Xellotath's Avatar
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    Hm.

    I don't care.

    Oh no! Wait, the ENTP above also said that! Does that mean...does that mean I'm an NT too?

    OMG IDENTITY CRISIS! QUICK! LETS WRITE A COMING OUT THREAD IN THE NT SECTION!~~!!!

    OKAY! I've got to think this through! Need to make a good impression now...SO!! 1) let's keep the avatar with the flowers on, 2) lets keep the "Type: ENFP" tag on. Oh yeah! and 3) I'll just start the thread a serious-sounding "I'm an ENTP" and leave it at that!

    Hm.. 4) NTs... 4) NTs love cookies, right? Yes! Cookies, lemonade..and uh.. Hello kitty napkins.

    Yeah!

    Oh man, I'm gonna make some many friends!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    "Neurotic, ha!"
    I let out a scornful laugh.
    "If neurotic is wanting two mutually exclusive things at one and the same time, then I'm neurotic as hell.
    I'll be flying back and forth between one mutually exclusive thing and another for the rest of my days.
    "

    — Sylvia Plath, The Bell Jar.

  8. #98
    Senior Member Tiltyred's Avatar
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    I think your thoughts on love and relationships express a yearning to manifest the divine. I identify that with NF. And Buddhism as a philosophy of renuciation is a perfect vehicle to inhabit when your ideals let you down or you feel you let them down. Buddhism is a way to disengage. It's necessary to disengage so you don't keep gnawing on your heart. So the disengagement is not the thing, it's the after effect of the thing, which is a kind of Romanticism that I associate more with NF, because you want to see it played out interpersonally, where NT is happy enough to have it play out on paper.

  9. #99
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    You don't need to recite a million. But, perhaps you could alight long enough on the subject to cite a couple reasons. I am curious why you are so certain about someone's type. For example, maybe for most of my time here I was depressed. Could that not contribute to a more ENTP mentality?
    Ok, fine. I'll play along...

    I am not so certain about someone's type - I'm certain about YOURS.

    Depression has absolutely nothing to do with anything. Feelings can be on the surface or they can be hidden, but that is not what defines type.

    You are not convinced of your own type, supposedly. Fine, ok. But instead of listing the reasons why you feel you could be something else, you challenge others to prove you wrong or to state your case for you. Exhibit A:

    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    Muster an argument.
    You appear to be analyzing from a detached standpoint, which definitely shows more Ti than Fi. And that's just the beginning... I could go back and point you to multiple posts where Ti has been completely evident. But like I said, you already know that.


    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    I should also say that when I was younger (like 20-23) and less jaded I usually tested as ENFP. I concerned myself with issues of social justice (anti-death penalty rallies, etc.) and was vegetarian. But, I was like a raw nerve walking through the world and feeling paranoid and concerned with what I saw as the global perpetuation of misery and suffering. Everywhere I looked I saw misery and abuse and the roiling dog-eat-dog violence of victor and victim. I always felt that if I could somehow, I would die to end the suffering around me.

    Gradually, I realized that I was projecting pain onto the world. And that the misery and suffering I saw was just one aspect of a more complex story of reality. A world that is beautiful in its complexity. But, also I gave in more and more to the suffering.
    You were being pensive, backed by a strong Ne big picture world view. But that really has nothing to do with Ti or Fi. That's just being human. Everybody cares about something sometime.

    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    The ENTP's are just sad to lose an exemplary member of their jaded little cabal.
    Try again. I would never consider you to be exemplary. In fact, there have been many times that I literally cringe at the judgmental and unfortunate things you write. But just because we have different experiences and priorities doesn't mean that we don't rationalize, argue, pander, twist, play devil's advocate, bait and debate in exactly the same manner.

    My personal belief:
    You have an image of an ideal that you would like to be - possibly to impress someone, or maybe in order to handle the multitude of problems in your path - so you repeat this ideal over and over again to yourself (and anyone else who will listen) in the hopes that you will eventually brainwash yourself into becoming this ideal.

    I've done that before, many times. It's an ENTP thing.

  10. #100
    Senior Member LunarMoon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    I'm an ENFP.
    I assumed that this topic was about something very different...
    Surgeons replace one of your neurons with a microchip that duplicates its input-output functions. You feel and behave exactly as before. Then they replace a second one, and a third one, and so on, until more and more of your brain becomes silicon. Since each microchip does exactly what the neuron did, your behavior and memory never change. Do you even notice the difference? Does it feel like dying? Is some other conscious entity moving in with you?
    -Steven Pinker on the Ship of Theseus Paradox

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