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  1. #381
    lab rat extraordinaire CrystalViolet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    Thanks Firey. That was also useful. I'm wondering, on the boards here, should everyone push pause on the thread, especially if there's primarily one Fi user fielding the questions and they are getting visibly stressed? If not, what seems like a respectful way to proceed while the other person has time to collect themselves?
    It may be a good idea. I think it's also up to the Fi user to recognise when we get to that place too, which I admittedly don't always. Especially when I'm on the soap box. This would of course have to be handled with a great deal of care.
    What you kinda want to prevent is the the big old clamp down, where they storm off, and won't talk...which I think you addressed as a being source of distress....but it does boil down to breathing space.
    For me at least.
    Currently submerged under an avalanche of books and paper work. I may come back up for air from time to time.
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  2. #382
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    I didn't go to bed, but I have one more quick thought before I do:

    Sometimes it's not necessarily that I want my Fi heard, it's that I want non-Fe heard. Not because I don't respect it. But sort of like Te gets bulldozerish in an effort to accomplish, get to the goal, etc., Fe is always in action.

    And I'd like to hear where people are, in an ephemeral moment, just to touch base, check in, give space, breathe, etc. Sometimes great things come of it. I feel like Fe is so action-focused sometimes it misses opportunities for healthy relationship moments.
    Fi and Fe do overlap, though. The internal standard and external standard don't have to be completely different.

    An Fe reason to listen to other perspectives is that they're part of the environment, and therefore relevant to value-judgments. An Fi reason to listen to other perspectives is some internal standard-ey thing like "it's wrong to not listen". They look the same on the surface, though.

    I don't really think of Fe as having this problem honestly. Not any more than Fi...in fact it seems like Fi is the function less likely to care about other perspectives, because if they go against the internal standard, they're "wrong". Fe by definition cares, because they're part of the environment.

  3. #383
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    An Fi reason to listen to other perspectives is some internal standard-ey thing like "it's wrong to not listen". They look the same on the surface, though.
    I definitely believe that, but just hearing it makes me confused.

    I'm not too "active" in my Fe unless I see something going downhill sooner or later, and I wish to prevent it. I want relationships to develop a little more organically, like usehername is saying. Every once awhile though, if there are problems, I see that it might not be worth preventing, or that not a whole lot is at stake anyways, and I just step back and let things happen.

  4. #384
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallulah View Post
    Okay, somewhere in the past few pages I started having flashbacks about experiences I've had with a couple of Fi doms. I have had a few friendships go south because an Fi dom felt like I was suppressing emotions that they could "sense" that they felt like I was ignoring. Where I might have felt some basic frustration at some situation I couldn't control, the Fi dom read it as anger, and reacted as if it must go much deeper than I care to admit. On occasion, they would accuse me of having anger towards them, when 1) in my experience it wasn't anger, just frustration that would easily pass once I ranted a little and 2) it wasn't directed at them at all. And I gotta tell you, the more someone insists I'm feeling something I'm not and insisting I deal with it, the more I realize that person doesn't know me. And that we might have a problem in the friendship.
    oh! so i find that sometimes my INTP dad brother will express their frustration about something they're working on, and i don't understand why it's being expressed in their interactions with me as well as everything else, since i didn't really do anything. it's a mistake of Fi to try to interpret it personally, but i do because i'm kind of Fi stupid that way, and then i spend the rest of the day wondering why they hate me.

    i don't mean at all to suggest that your friends weren't being butts (wow my language is really sophisticated tonight lol) by trying to read way too deeply into your emotions, but maybe that's part of what they were feeling too - like that they took the anger personally, realized it didn't correlate with their behavior towards you, and thus tried to seek a reason for the anger being directed towards them. as in they searched themselves but they couldn't find any answer, so obviously it must be you. and that what they weren't seeing was that the assumption that your frustration was being directed at them, was totally off.

    also, i find that i tend to pick up on more emotion than most people, but being that emotion is a combination of body language and such, i don't deny that it's possible that sometimes i interpret as emotion details that are not, in fact, emotion. but i think that also many Ti users tend to pick up on less emotion than most people, and thus when it comes to Fi-Ti interactions, maybe since we're both on opposite ends of the spectrum we can end up seeing each other being kind of ridiculous.

    I think Fi doms think they want us to be straight and open, but an Fe user's version of straight and open will look quite different, and feel quite different. If we really never censored ourselves, Fi users would stay permanently hidden. We just don't seem to speak the same language. Y'all would really think we were mean, even though we'd see ourselves as just shooting straight. Because we would dispense with the need to affirm feelings or validate. We'd just tell you how we read the situation. And we wouldn't mean to be hurtful, but it would probably feel that way, because we've abandoned the agreed-upon niceties we generally try to employ. We generally don't do that with people until we've established a friendship and the friend knows that we would never attack them personally. Even though Fi thinks it would like everyone to be open and above board, it generally gets its feelings hurt when we do. I have been called "relentless" by a Fi-dom before, when that was certainly the last thing I was intending.
    yeah, that's a good point. we're still kind of squishy-fuzzy, aren't we?

    well and correspondingly, if it's all Fi talk, then it comes off as completely self-absorbed. i think that happened in a Fe/Fi thread a while ago. it felt like to the Fe users that the Fi were ganging up and only affirming one another while totally ignoring the Fe users. and the thought of a Fi gang is kind of hilarious. it's like a pack of wild kittens.

    though i think even with my own posts, they're a little bit self-absorbed. it's because i assume this is my space to talk about me - i wouldn't want to talk about you so much because i don't feel like i am in a position to talk about you because i am not you - and that if you see anything interesting that makes you think about you then you will talk about you. but actually Fe users seem to talk about others more than themselves unless asked about themselves. i just see everything as an open invitation to talk about myself, lol. i guess i expect everyone else will, too.

    anyway, i think i make this mistake with Te and Ti too. i don't check in with what Ti people think or validate their ideas. i need to work on that.

    skylights is a good example here of someone who's providing an Fi perspective AND trying to understand the Fe one.
    thanks tallulah, you too, from the opposite side. and feel more than welcome to let me know if i start not doing that too. it's so easy and comfortable to fall back into your own paradigm.

    Another point that occurred to me during the last two pages is this. Sometimes a Fe user has absolutely no problem with you at all, but then gets their hackles raised about the way you (general Fi you) phrase something or approach something. Something that would lead an Fe user to believe that you feel like you are taking some sort of moral high road, or that you feel like you are above using the usual social roads to get there. Or maybe that you feel like you actively want to stir up some stuff to get down to the "real" us. So then we get frustrated with you and try to tell you why. And then you accuse us of having some deep seated anger issue or some sort of underlying problem with you. And 99.9% of the time--trust me on this--we DON'T. But if you keep acting like we do, you can bet it will become a self-fulfilling prophecy. I didn't have a problem before--I only had a problem with a little piece of the conversation, or didn't understand your intent--but if you accuse me of feeling and suppressing something I'm not and attribute it to the wrong thing, hoo, boy, I will almost certainly get angry THEN.
    fuck that's a good point.

    i think this happens with my brother and i. (he's an INTP.) i'll say something about what should be happening, and he says it's self-righteous (it probably is). and then i think he's just pissed off at me because he doesn't like me in general for whatever reason (because to me it seems like i didn't do anything to merit that judgment). aaaand if what you say is true then he might not not like me in general, he might have just thought that whatever i was being moralistic about was stupid.

    sometimes it probably is.

    Quote Originally Posted by Caerulea View Post
    This is totally off topic for the way this thread has been going, but I really wanted to ask because Seymour's quote may go to the heart of something that has been confusing (and upsetting) me for years.

    My husband (INFP, but really close to E) and I (INFJ - and really I) once started to get to know someone from a community organization. We invited them over to dinner twice. The first time was fairly awkward, but we thought we'd try again. About halfway through the second dinner, the guest started telling us some very personal things, with a lot of anger. When the guest was done, they looked straight at me, not my husband, and, after a moment, got angry at me, but wouldn't say why. It seemed that they were expecting something from me, but I didn't know how to respond.

    "How to respond" - I guess that's a very Fe concept (I'm still learning about this). How does this person want me to respond? What do they need?
    haha. yeah. that is pretty Fe. "how to respond" to me typically has less to do with the other person and more to do with "say what you think." i mean, i'm interested in what they need too, but i figure what they need has more to do with what i communicate than how i communicate it.

    So, was this a case of an INFP's Fi reaching out? If so, why would this person expect an immediate response from me (they knew that I was a quiet person) rather than my husband, who is far more talkative and good with words than I am? They'd had numerous conversations with my husband and only one - ever - with me.
    yeah, probably, about the Fi. sounds like he was trying to really connect with you guys. (though seriously some people really push it overboard. i've had someone tell me about their entire history of abuse in a tutoring session.) it's possible that he wanted to hear from you because you'd been quiet. i dunno, maybe it's because i'm an E, but i always want to hear what the quiet person is thinking. maybe he kind of already thought he knew how your husband would respond. and maybe if it's looked at through the lens of connection, he was hoping for a response from you to indicate that he had made it through to you. if someone's really quiet around me and not giving me many signs of affirmation, i start to suspect i'm being displeasing to them, and i try harder.

    and that's really sweet about your cat. my cat can pick up on emotion too. he's kind of a jerk normally but when i'm feeling really horrible he'll come over to me and be sweet.

    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    So what I'm getting from people is that you don't have to make specific "thank you for your contribution" statements at every point, but rather when things start getting tenser in the conversation or it is obvious the person has spent a lot of effort working on what they said?
    yeah, exactly. to speak Fi, i mean. lol. fidelia would you mind talking about what seems to be more Fe style? from what you and talullah have said it would seem to be more of a direct and less affirming style. which is confusing to me, because IRL Fe seems more supportive than Fi.

    In theory I can see this. The place where that seems to usually break down is when I read the other person as being patronizing, usually after I've just told them where one of the hot buttons are that would be better avoided and they go there anyhow.
    yeah... i think that it kind of feels annoying to be told you shouldn't go somewhere. it makes me want to go there more, because it feels like something important is being hidden from me.

    i understand that the intent is protection and better results for both parties but the directive is inherently unappealing to me. Fe is naturally protective but it's frustrating to Fi because we suspect that what is really important is under the bubble. it's a hot button, after all, because it really gets to someone(s). and it gets to someone(s) because it resonates somewhere deeply with them. it's obviously an area of hurt, but to be metaphoric about it, Fe wants to put on a band-aid and Fi wants to expose it to the air. both are healing in different ways - i think what we need to figure out is which strategy is more useful at what time.

    However, I can't see that just saying "Thanks for all of the work you've put into this" and then going on to say what I normally would is going to go over a lot better.
    haha, actually, at least personally, i'm really easy to placate. tell me you like me and you can probably give me an enumerated list of things about me that suck and i won't really mind that much. for me it's so much about simply being validated in and of myself as a holistic being.

    but it's more than thanks for the work - it's thanks for opening yourself up like that, because there's something valuable inside. maybe that's what you meant in briefer language, but that's what we (or at least i) am looking for. and rarely will anyone actually ever say that, but i think that's what has to be communicated. it's an appreciation not of the contribution in and of itself, but the contribution as an extension of the person's identity.

    i guess in practical terms it would work out like (and tell me if these examples suck and are totally off. they're kind of cartoonized. exaggerated.):

    Quote Originally Posted by Fi
    i really suck and i hate everyone!!!!
    Fe being pretty nonjudgmental despite the obvious "i hate everyone" breach of harmony and attempting to gather more info:
    Quote Originally Posted by Fe
    why do you hate everyone?
    which reads to upset me as, "yup, you really suck. what's wrong with you? why would you hate everyone?" whereas speaking in Fi style you could be kind of a jackass about it and still come of well by saying:
    Quote Originally Posted by Fi #2
    okay, first of all, you don't suck. you're kind of a whiny emo sometimes but you're also smart and compassionate and we like having you on the boards. second of all, quit being overdramatic, you don't hate everyone.
    and all that silly language and the commanding tone would be okay because of the underlying sentiment of identity validation.

    all i'm really looking for is someone to tell me why i'm okay. it's the Fi need for objective affirmation, because our subjective judging function can't give that to us. i'm willing to bet that problem accounts for 99.8% of my personal crises. all i really want is for someone to tell me that i don't just suck. everything is too subjective inside for me to be able to believe it with certainty. i mean, at the deepest level i believe everyone is fundamentally good and valuable, so obviously that should apply to me too, but i just feel the need to check that sometimes. ._."

    huh. maybe this is why NFPs are so damn sensitive.

    I find myself having a hard time really believing that the Fi person in question can't see that they are using inflammatory language, especially after they've been informed that they have. That's usually the point at which I quit trying to make them feel comfortable because it seems like there's been no sense of trying to put themselves in my shoes (which I'm trying to do with them), yet they are giving me no direction for how to do better with them and they also are assuming that they know how I feel and are going to tell me.
    haha, aw, fidelia, you give us too much credit. some of us are kind of stupid sometimes when it comes to seeing outside our own perspective. it's the same thing tallulah was talking about, i think. you tell me i'm using inflammatory language, but i don't have any inflammatory intent, so obviously you're the one with a problem and i tell you that. which comes out inflammatorily. (now officially a word.) the problem is that we may well have tried to see ourselves through your shoes, but it was a Fi scan. it was based off subjective criteria, not your objective Fe criteria. so then we don't find anything out of order and it is only logical that if it's not a problem on my end, it must be one on yours. i suppose the way for us to try to fix this is to look at our language on the page - not our intention - and thereby engage Te to check it, which will give an objective read instead of a subjective one. which is, incidentally, why ENFPs say really contradictory things sometimes. we need to hear them outside of ourselves if we want to look at them objectively. i wonder how this works for INFPs? is it the same?

    how about on your end, though? i'm curious to hear more about the style Fe users would prefer.

    sorry it's frustrating to understand. it's hard to explain too, sometimes you ask questions and (obviously) i have to write a few paragraphs before i figure out what i'm getting to. i also have trouble understanding the Fe side of some things. but slowly and surely i think we're getting somewhere.

  5. #385
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    That reminds me, what if you do hurt someone though?

    A Fi-user said to me (I'm paraphrasing) that Fe-users disregard what is meant (intent) and focus on the tangible (form). I don't know if "form" is the right word, but I do think Fe-users focus on the results of emotional interaction and do think the intentions of others are secondary.

    Does intent really outweigh results for Fi-users?

    Example:
    I do dislike when I'm read wrong, aka assigned a motivation/intent I did not have, when I hurt someone's feelings. My response is to take back what I've said/written, because obviously there was a communication failure. But with Fi-users that doesn't seem to work very often, because the misidentified intent still remains and I'm unsure how to correct that. As a (weak) Fe-user it's like a damned-if-you-do-damned-if-you-don't-trap.
    Yeah, I mentioned in my massive post that Fe people can seem too results focused, so that they can come across as phony and impure in motive so as to achieve certain results. It is not that a Fi person has no concern for results, but Fi, as a function, is oriented inward. It does not focus on external results or standards - it holds concepts of what is ideal and what is unacceptably flawed, and these are only related to the external through perceiving. This lends a flexibility to Fi. Where Fe adapts to its environment, Ne sees various interpretations of it and Fi chooses what is closest to the ideal. This means we tend to accept a variety of ways to authentically express a feeling, to perceive the meaning behind the expression, rather than to judge what form is correct. In a simple form, it's called "giving the benefit of the doubt". It can also make some Fi-doms appear naive or unrealistic - the positive possibility is given too much focus.

    Before I digress...if someone has offended me and I misunderstood them, it is best that they clarify what they meant. A retraction can seem simply like an attempt to placate me, which seems like an invalidation of my feeling. It can seem akin to someone saying, "you're over-reacting", which seems dismissive. I can only know if I have over-reacted if I know the true intention of the statement. Plus, since no one may even know what basic value I am reacting from, they cannot gauge my reaction accurately. I find that most of the time, people have no idea what I am actually upset about.

    However, if their motive was genuinely harmless and the person offers a brief explanation, then I'll probably accept that. I'm not one who usually wants to squabble over every word choice....for instance, the back & forth of a thread like this exhausts me quickly (even just reading other people's back & forth).

    Let's be real though; some people claim they had no negative intent, but they did. Then they backtrack and try and make it seem like you're overreacting so as not to take responsibility for their words. At a certain point, phrasing and form does matter, or else it is too far removed from any possible positive intent to insist that there is one.

    Generally, I find myself far less perturbed by Fe people than vice versa because even if they seem a bit "fake" to me at times, I tend to give the benefit of the doubt, and as I get to know a person I will more accurately perceive what is authentic for them as an individual. It can also be a Pe thing to reserve judgment until more info is taken in.

    I feel Fe confining at times when it insists on one or two appropriate ways, especially when those ways don't suit my feeling. I feel unfairly criticized when Fe people jump to conclusions regarding my feeling based on whether or not these standards are met. I think as a Fi person, you learn to withdraw and shrink back your feeling as few external means that are deemed appropriate are also accurate to the feeling. This is why Jung says when Fi appears positively, it is often in an indirect way (ie. through a "cause", art, leading by example, etc.).

    The brackets are added by me, just to give very simplified interpretations to relate it back to the conversation at hand....

    Quote Originally Posted by Jung on Fi
    The existence of positive feeling can be inferred only indirectly. Its aim is not to adjust itself to the object [not to judge good/bad based on externalities, such as "results"), but to subordinate it [results are secondary to underlying values] in an unconscious effort to realize the underlying images [to uphold basic ideals which form the values].
    Conversely, even when Fe seems to disagree with the consensus, it is often on the grounds of a greater value which has basis in consensus. Their perceiving function particularly allows them to see outside of a current context to judge, so that they do not sway with the breeze; for instance, they can see more important results outside of immediate peace. Just with Fi, there is a hierarchy of values. This is why Fe people will agree that bad things can produce good results, so not everything appears to be judged by its results. However, if you probe further, this can be with a view to what is not immediately apparent, to the long-term results which go beyond the current context. Basically, Ni foretells these possible bad results, and Si recalls them. This also makes Fe seem very adaptable, for as long as no foreseeable negative outcome looms ahead, the Fe person is happy to adjust to the external, which allows them to meet the needs of other people or reflect their feeling. This is why Fe is generally viewed much more positively than Fi, but also why they can seem to accommodate others to their own detriment (ie. doormat syndrome) or to become annoyed/confused when an individual goes against the externally accepted ways because they don't know how to reflect it accurately (ie. seems overly judgemental, projects negative feeling where there is none).

    Quote Originally Posted by Jung on Fe
    Even where it seems to show a certain independence of the quality of the concrete object [seems to be independent of consensus/the external], it is none the less under the spell of traditional or generally valid standards of some sort. [in some way it is judging by external standards].

    ....Such feelings are governed by the standard of the objective determinants [ie. such as results, an external way to gauge good/bad]. As such they are genuine, and represent the total visible feeling-function.

    The valuations resulting from the act of feeling either correspond directly with objective values or at least chime in with certain traditional and generally known standards of value. [again, in some way Fe is connecting to external standards, even if not in an obvious, direct way]
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  6. #386
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Two great posts! Now I have a whole pile more things to write and think about and it shouldn't be tonight, but I'm scared these posts will be buried by morning!

  7. #387
    Emerging Tallulah's Avatar
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    Definitely awesome posts. I will need to digest and think a bit, I think. But I will say a couple of things...

    Sky--your brother doesn't hate you. We (INTPs) have no problem finding fault with an idea, but we almost never attach the idea to the person. People are separate from ideas. Ideas are important, but they're also always open for debate, dissection, or new information.

    Also, I don't think it would ever occur to an Fe user that someone might feel like we were thinking they were a terrible person, so it wouldn't ever occur to us to affirm them as a person. We'd assume they knew our opinion of them as our friend hadn't changed just because they were frustrated or emo about something. And I personally would probably feel like I was blowing smoke up their posteriors if I just busted out with an affirmation of them as a good person if they hadn't specifically expressed doubt about that. But maybe I will start, if I know the person is an Fi user! I didn't know that's part of what needed affirming. I think the Fe person, by asking why you might hate everyone, is trying to affirm your right to think someone's a douchebag, and wants to know why specifically, so they can help you hate them temporarily. :-P
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  8. #388
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    all i'm really looking for is someone to tell me why i'm okay. it's the Fi need for objective affirmation, because our subjective judging function can't give that to us. i'm willing to bet that problem accounts for 99.8% of my personal crises. all i really want is for someone to tell me that i don't just suck. everything is too subjective inside for me to be able to believe it with certainty. i mean, at the deepest level i believe everyone is fundamentally good and valuable, so obviously that should apply to me too, but i just feel the need to check that sometimes. ._."

    huh. maybe this is why NFPs are so damn sensitive.
    It's not just an NFP problem. It's lack of Se. I think it covers this area in some odd way. This actually reminds me of something I read in Thomson's book awhile back. Ni doms have the same problem (possibly not to the same extent):

    Although Extraverted Sensation is the INJ's inferior function, it should not be supposed that INJs are entirely in their heads or never leave their journals and computer terminals. They're bona fide Percievers, and their senses may be very keen. INJs follow sports, enjoy outdoor activities, take up Tai Chi, drive fast cars, cook gourmet meals, make art---all sorts of things that involve sensory engagement with life. Their Extraverted Sensate skills are undeveloped in the sense that INJs have a hard time seeing themselves objectively.

    edit: Just to add, SJs probably come in second in their sense of "objectivity of themselves". They find a lot of confirmation/identity/encouragement in Si. Why you do think they get pissed if you screw it up? :P (that and they often crack jokes on what isn't "normal".. what they're doing there is thinking they're objective. They're fairly confident of who they are in relation to things/people around them). That, or take an SJ out of their element and they won't feel safe and start venting about it..they don't know themselves in something too new and need time to adjust. SPs are fluid and grounded on where they stand and how they can express themselves in many situations. Ne and Ni OTOH are in a different boat (ENJs less than other N's probably).

  9. #389
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights
    i guess in practical terms it would work out like (and tell me if these examples suck and are totally off. they're kind of cartoonized. exaggerated.):

    Quote Originally Posted by Originally Posted by Fi
    i really suck and i hate everyone!!!!
    Fe being pretty nonjudgmental despite the obvious "i hate everyone" breach of harmony and attempting to gather more info:

    Quote Originally Posted by Originally Posted by Fe
    why do you hate everyone?
    which reads to upset me as, "yup, you really suck. what's wrong with you? why would you hate everyone?" whereas speaking in Fi style you could be kind of a jackass about it and still come of well by saying:

    Quote Originally Posted by Originally Posted by Fi #2 [/quote
    okay, first of all, you don't suck. you're kind of a whiny emo sometimes but you're also smart and compassionate and we like having you on the boards. second of all, quit being overdramatic, you don't hate everyone.
    and all that silly language and the commanding tone would be okay because of the underlying sentiment of identity validation.
    Oh geez... no wonder Fe/Fi conversations are a train-wreck sometimes.

    EDIT (my skimming sucks lately):
    I mean, my response to the Fi #1 line would be, "Why do you think you suck? I don't think you suck. And why do you hate everyone?"

    Would that be good enough to feel like you were heard? My response (from my end) is saying, "I care, so I want to take your comment at face value and then try to understand why you feel this way, so you will know I 'get it' and want to 'get it'."

    Sometimes Fi seems very inscrutable... like one thing gets said but something else is being asked for.

    I guess Fe can seem the same way. The difference I think is where the obfuscation happens; for Fe, it's in the preordained format of the language used (a lot of stuff might be covered by the same comment), whereas for Fi it occurs in the barrier that exists between the exterior world and the interior self into which people on the outside cannot really see into.

    all i'm really looking for is someone to tell me why i'm okay. it's the Fi need for objective affirmation, because our subjective judging function can't give that to us. i'm willing to bet that problem accounts for 99.8% of my personal crises. all i really want is for someone to tell me that i don't just suck. everything is too subjective inside for me to be able to believe it with certainty. i mean, at the deepest level i believe everyone is fundamentally good and valuable, so obviously that should apply to me too, but i just feel the need to check that sometimes. ._."

    huh. maybe this is why NFPs are so damn sensitive.
    Thank you for this, it is resonating for me and I can actually identify with it somewhat as well.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  10. #390
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    I would tell my Fi-dom daughter "You don't suck they suck! Who do I need to kill??? What did they do to my baby girl???"
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

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