[ENFJ] Common ENFJ Issues

[Moiety]

Then a factor of trust is missing (not blaming anyone here, just saying). Either she has a history of having something to defend or perhaps she needs a primer in how to interpret and respond to your "opening up" questions? What is it exactly that you wish to deeply connect on?

I just wanted to be her friend. Wanted to show her how I really am with people outside the family. She has no idea I have a sense of humor, am very relaxed and a bunch of other things. She just judges everything I do or say, so it's hard for me to put aside my Fi and just connect with her (specially since she places value on appearances so much). And she is 40 years older than me too...from a very different time and context...whatever lol

 

[Arclight]

The day I can convince my ENFJ that I'm ever right is the day I die happy.

hahhaa, good luck with that, Moiety.

Ha ha!!.. My sentiments exactly.

 

[Domino]

I just wanted to be her friend. Wanted to show her how I really am with people outside the family. She has no idea I have a sense of humor, am very relaxed and a bunch of other things. She just judges everything I do or say, so it's hard for me to put aside my Fi and just connect with her (specially since she places value on appearances so much). And she is 40 years older than me too...from a very different time and context...whatever lol

Is this woman a mother figure or are you dating? Yes, I HAD to ask.

 

[Moiety]

Is this woman a mother figure or are you dating? Yes, I HAD to ask.

lol She's more like a Judge Dredd figure.

 

[Domino]

lol She's more like a Judge Dredd figure.

LOL!!! I.... have no response.

 

[Glycerine]

Then a factor of trust is missing (not blaming anyone here, just saying). Either she has a history of having something to defend or perhaps she needs a primer in how to interpret and respond to your "opening up" questions? What is it exactly that you wish to deeply connect on?

Sometimes my ENFP sister will shell me with questions (out of concern) and I'll automatically back up and ball up. Sometimes she'll say "XYZ needs to get done" and I respond "not this second/minute" for whatever reason (time constraints, late hour, present occupation, etc), and she'll say (mistified) "I didn't mean right NOW". I can't tell you how many of those little exchanges we've had and I've known her for 33 years. lol Sometimes she pushes me to open up, and I have a visceral repulsion to it - not because it's her, because I trust her with my life and would talk to her about most anything, but because I'm not ready.

It's difficult to get us to talk when we absolutely do NOT want to talk. The only other intuitive type I've met who's THAT evasive are INFJs. NFPS, even the introverted ones, might be amazed by just how on the surface they can live while much NFJs CANNOT. I'm submerged 98% of the time. I can't survive on the surface, not without a lot of help.

People have accused of not forming my own opinions SO MANY TIMES. It's because I don't want you to figure me out or analyze me, fish buckets. As a result, I hide behind other people's perceptions until I'm ready. I was always the student who passive-aggressively rebelled against the teacher when we had to write our opinions on something somewhat personal or a personal narrative by writing I don't know, use someone else's opinion or bullshitting my way through. I am weary of people who try to pry information out of me.

 

[Domino]

People have accused of not forming my own opinions SO MANY TIMES. It's because I don't want you to figure me out or analyze me, fish buckets. As a result, I hide behind other people's perceptions until I'm ready. I was always the student who passive-aggressively rebelled against the teacher when we had to write our opinions on something somewhat personal or a personal narrative by writing I don't know, use someone else's opinion or bullshitting my way through. I am weary of people who try to pry information out of me.

I was the person who sweated, shook and felt ill voicing an opinion in front of others, especially a class situation. I couldn't understand why I always felt like I was exposing myself. I got a lot of persecution for standing my ground when I *had* to take an angle, and I withstood even the most general pushing and punishing (not teasing or joking) with a level of discomfort that I hated and that puzzled me. The very sound of my voice raised above silence and listening ears made me want to melt into the floor.

Once my ESTP foreman was in a mood, and he asked me a really difficult grey-area question in front of everyone, put me on the spot, and I tried answering calmly but he kept pushing me and pushing me past one answer into the next, and I felt my temper rising until I finally bit his head off. I drew up short, feeling deeply troubled at having lost my cool (stupid Fe caring about what I've done to someone else all the time), but he only smiled broadly, toothpick in teeth, slowly turned to the rest of the men around me and said "She got smarts and fire, don' she?" I know he put that question to me because I could answer it and because I resisted this sort of thing and probably because he knew the way to push at me until I lit off.

I have no idea why I freak out so much, resist so hard against speaking my opinion (unless something truly bad is happening and I've got to go to war). If I'm in a combat situation, I'm going for it, but later, I know I'll process it over and over and over trying to determine if I was right or wrong or if I hurt the other person. I'm always afraid of overstepping my bounds. I'm always concerned that I've said too much.

lol @ fish buckets

 

[Domino]

I hate/resent anything that makes me want it.

You won't own me. Forget you. I don't have to want you if I don't need you. I'm not staring. I don't want you in three different colors and I don't care if you're on sale.

 

[Glycerine]

haha a little extension of that, I CANNOT STAND being prodded to do anything. If I can sense some "behind the scenes" ploy to control or to persuade me to do something, I will fight hard and will go adamantly against you... I did this even as a 4 year old.

 

[Arclight]

The more something is hyped.. the more I am likely to avoid it. It's funny how the more I read about,interact and understand ENFJs the more it becomes obvious we don't like being ENFJ'd .. That is to say.. If someone uses Fe and Ni against us, we resist.

I love it when someone actually gets me. I do not like it all when someones uses that understanding to handle me.

And just by writing that last sentence, it suddenly makes sense why ENFJs are accused of manipulation time and time again.

 

[Domino]

haha a little extension of that, I CANNOT STAND being prodded to do anything. If I can sense some "behind the scenes" ploy to control or to persuade me to do something, I will fight hard and will go adamantly against you... I did this even as a 4 year old.

hahahah!! I do that too!! Even over little things! I dig in and start growling and I have to be dragged! It's really comical! I start hearing that song... "You're not the boss of ME!"... playing in my head. hahaha, good grief.

The more something is hyped.. the more I am likely to avoid it. It's funny how the more I read about,interact and understand ENFJs the more it becomes obvious we don't like being ENFJ'd .. That is to say.. If someone uses Fe and Ni against us, we resist.

I love it when someone actually gets me. I do not like it all when someones uses that understanding to handle me.

And just by writing that last sentence, it suddenly makes sense why ENFJs are accused of manipulation time and time again.

That's one for the books. I like it. Says it all, really.

 

[Ulaes]

Here's a video of an ENFJ. She gets into her issues about 3 minutes in.
[YOUTUBE="S0hb285pl1k"]ENFJ: if you knew me[/YOUTUBE]

 

[Domino]

That was very interesting. I related to many things she said, especially the part about losing herself in other people, and not feeling pretty.

 

[Ulaes]

That was very interesting.

Well she's part of a youtube channel that's aimed at the young gay community called the beaverbunch. http://www.youtube.com/user/beaverbunch#p/u/31/Y0EAWVaC7Gw Check it out if you want to see more of her videos, they have a few members who post once a week about questions the viewers ask. That girl is 120% ENFJ, it's awesome. There's an INFJ on the channel too (the monday girl, Jess.) i linked to her 'if you knew me' video above. you might relate to her as well. It's amazing to see types in action like that, you can really tell the ENFJ and INFJ eyes. I started paying attention to it because i want to understand the homosexual community more and to her espeically, because i find the ENFJ type so fascinating.

I related to many things she said, especially the part about losing herself in other people, and not feeling pretty.

I'm know about the ENFJ issue about always being tied to other people because I'm so familiar with the type but what's the deal about not feeling pretty? I'm sure it's a need that's in everyone to an extent but i see it being a real issue with NFs, likely all Fs. This girl is obviously very pretty and has ENFJ eyes to boot, so it kind fo goes to show that how they actually look is kind of irrelevent. My ENFP sister is like this also, which is ironic because she could stop traffic and not just by wandering in front of it which she is also apt to do. She can't go out unless she's spent hours grooming herself until she can rival a model. Is it a need to be reassured of your ability to be loved and cherished? Fs have a stronger need than Ts to feel wanted. I'd be suprised if Fs weren't much more likely to have body issues like anorexia than Ts. Could you, or any other NFs, elaborate on this at all? I'm interested in the inside perspective and how you deal with it.

 

[Saslou]

Issues I am trying to work on currently:

-Being so loyal to someone to the point of feeling used by them :|

-Making excuses for people who are really in the wrong

-Not taking a time out for myself...Im finally doing that for the first time in a while, got in to a huge fight about it with the old ball n chain. But here I am alone, it feels great ....it was much needed.

-Taking things way to personally all the time & needing validation from others

-Obsessing over problems to the point of insomnia

-Letting other peoples feelings & problems take over my own

-Not knowing boundaries...being nice to everyone can be dangerous

-Letting things build up inside to the point of exploding anger

Lol .. You just pretty much summed me up there .. One letter off but so similar in ways

I have a question for you .. In relationships do you ever feel like you give so much of yourself that there comes a point where you clue in that you've misplaced your very being?

 

[Sparrow]

Lol .. You just pretty much summed me up there .. One letter off but so similar in ways

I have a question for you .. In relationships do you ever feel like you give so much of yourself that there comes a point where you clue in that you've misplaced your very being?

Yes totally, its like I get brainwashed or something. I dont know what it is...I care so much about the other person that it takes me over almost completely (I keep getting in to relationships with people who have a lot of issues and emotional baggage, that's definitely part of the problem). Its probably why I have been having creativity block for so long. My mind is somewhere else...

 

[Saslou]

Thank you .. And yes, it's not like i am consciously aware of what i'm doing or dropping who i am but i get so engrossed with being with the other person that at some point, i realise i misplaced me in the process .. Least we are both aware of it so should another relationship arise at a future point, we won't (hopefully) go back down that road.

Woooharrr to healthy relationships

 

[Malkavia]

Thanks for the thread guys!

I feel like I always learn from certain ENFJs on this forum (I assume you know who you are). You know yourself, your type, but at the same time you don't get caught up in BS. You're forward, direct, you listen, and you help people.

 

[Sparrow]

Thank you .. And yes, it's not like i am consciously aware of what i'm doing or dropping who i am but i get so engrossed with being with the other person that at some point, i realise i misplaced me in the process .. Least we are both aware of it so should another relationship arise at a future point, we won't (hopefully) go back down that road.

Woooharrr to healthy relationships

Honestly, I do know what the main issue is. Codependency. I grew up in a dysfunctional house hold...my Dad was addicted to gambling, and my mom became very codependent, always trying to rescue him or save him some how...she has became very resentful and now has the if you can beat him join him mentality. As a child I was thrown in to the Hero role tending to both of my parents emotional needs (I was a codependent in training), and now the cycle has continued. I am caught up in being in unhealthy dysfunctional / co dependent relationships. This my 2nd one! It really needs to stop, I need to break this shitty cycle.

I have read a couple books years ago and have even talked to a few counselors, but Im still stuck. Last night I watched an informational movie online on netflix which reminded me of what my real issues are. If any one is interested you should check it out , its called: "Codependency: Overcome Codependence and Develop Healthy Relationships". The movie is old and is very poor quality, but the information given is very good.

I wonder if ENFJ's prone to codependency?

 

[Domino]

Edge - first of all, props to you for being a scholar of the human condition.

As to the not feeling pretty thing, I've often wondered if being an Idealist is what hoists us on our own petard as pertains to our appearance. Speaking for myself, being a borderline E/I, I have all of the receeding qualities of introversion coupled with a bass-driven externalized focus/immersion in my human environment. At times, it can feel like a vivisection. Having a background of violence and abuse, I began to apply the ugliness and shame to my personal appearance, having determined that my face or body or whatever was the magnet for this bad energy and brutality, and that I must, in essence, be bad or tainted somehow.

I have also experienced the very eerie NFJ perception of being invisible to other eyes. Honestly, even as a child, I felt invisible unless something awful was happening to me. I think NFs twist up into knots when their idealism has the stuffing kicked out of it. We have to balance a kneejerk need to see the best in every person and situation with a strongly critical nature. At least, that's the way it is for me. My ENFP twin is "glass half full". I'm "glass half empty, and who the heck has been touching and drinking out of this glass?!"