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  1. #171
    Member unsomething's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sultan of Beans View Post
    She doesn't full understand the mind of an INFP.
    Awwwe, there are definitely NFJs who do though!

    I swear, sometimes I think I am an INFP because I get Fi so much. But, yeah. I get everyone, or at least according to me I do. Hah. Fi feels better to get though.
    Last edited by unsomething; 09-14-2014 at 06:18 AM.

  2. #172
    across the universe Olm the Water King's Avatar
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    Fi feels better to get though.
    What do you mean by that?

  3. #173
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    At the moment, I can't be arsed to read through the entire thread for inspiration or w/e. Here are two though that I see as common that I have something to write about:

    - Manipulating.

    This is something Fe does a lot, and for ENFJ's in particular I find it to be a near constant thing that never turns off. I honestly can't even tell half the time if I am doing it or not until I take a step back to think of it. When I mean constant, I literally mean it. I am back-processing and planning how to word and state every word and sentence I make so it gets towards the meaning or goal that I want. It could be small, it could be big. Ultimately though, it's carefully crafted for a reason, and it could very well be subvertive. I actually had quite a bad lying problem when I was a child. It's a long story, but after a period of truth-telling completely blowing up in my face multiple times I stopped with that. I also figured out that I was really good at lying, manipulating, and getting what I wanted. This went on for years and at several points got so convoluted that at one point I wound up falsely in a hospital and no one caught on. When you realize you can do this, no casualties can be caused in the process sometimes, and it ultimately gives benefit it can be perilously easy to slip into a pattern of manipulating and not even notice your doing it. The thing is though, most people will sense it when you do it, but you won't know.

    It's just so, easy. Fe implicitly understands social dynamics and exchanged between people and doesn't need to put much thought into it either. It's automatic. combined with Ni having long-term planning and Se's snappy execution, it can organize things very well. It knows the paths things could take, and if things go amiss things can be edited in real time. I almost never get caught for 2 major reasons: The first is I self-disclose a lot, and give up as much information to "validate" things as I can. Hell, sometimes I'll overtly state what I am trying to do. The second is I don't take risks.


    - Not knowing yourself.

    This is somewhat paradoxical actually. ENFJ's generally don't really know their true self despite what they might think, and it can be a huge problem and lead them WAY off course. Considering that their INFJ cousins often have a "rep" for knowing oneself very well (thought the validity of that could easily be contested I'm sure), it's somewhat odd to see that ENFJ's wouldn't. Part of this is ENFJ's ware all kinds of masks. They have to; this is how they navigate the world around them. Every person they meet requires a slightly different persona, way of acting, etc. and we'll automatically shift into that. Fe's also somewhat of a slave to what's common/popular around them, and find themselves merging into this against their will (it happens to me sometimes). This constant changing begs the question "who am I really?". But not all ENFJ's are like this. A good number think they know themselves, but really, they don't. What often happens is they'll tell themselves "I am expected to be this way, so I will make myself this way." and take it on and become it. Over time, this becomes them. This is really Fe's doing, so ESFJ's do this as well, but their levels of "not knowing onesself" is different from ENFJ. The problem is this happens so frequently that they don't always take the time to assess their reasoning's behind doing this. We all create our identity, but ENFJ's don't always question why they're doing it because it's so automatic and relatively easy. So they lose touch with the purpose of it in the first place and "forget" that it isn't really "them". Mix in Ni's amazing ability to create something out of nothing, it can convince the ENFJ they are something they really aren't and they lose touch with their core.

    One way around this is to try not to base the self off the external world around them, but this is really hard to do, and in many ways not how to do it. A better way is to assess why they have become who and what they are, and determine if it's actually something they like and are, or something they "should" be.
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
    Functions: Fe > Te > Ni > Se > Si > Ti > Fi > Ne
    Enneagram: 1w2 - 3w4 - 6w5 (The Taskmaster) | sp/so
    Socionics: β-E dimer | -
    Big 5: slOaI
    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari

    Likes BluRoses, IDreamtIWasABee liked this post

  4. #174
    Member unsomething's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sultan of Beans View Post




    What do you mean by that?
    Fi is like a reese's peanut butter cup. On the outside it's just a hunk of chocolate, but taking a bite out of it, you get the perfect mix of something very especially yummy. Fi is just very refreshing to someone like me who is weary from always bending themselves to fit something or another. c:

  5. #175
    Senior Member oneandonly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unsomething View Post
    Fi is like a reese's peanut butter cup. On the outside it's just a hunk of chocolate, but taking a bite out of it, you get the perfect mix of something very especially yummy. Fi is just very refreshing to someone like me who is weary from always bending themselves to fit something or another. c:
    So Im trying to understand this although the reeses metaphor is abstract.. but basically, pleasantly surprised without having to navigate and flex through situations and people?

    I use Fe and Fi.. for instance I'm very Fe until recently when I fell in love.. the person themselves became an internal value I wasnt necessarily forthcoming about the gravity of my feelings. but then of course in moments where i could have revealed this depth I froze like an infj would, is what i hear.

    I appreciate all kinds of people but I only have close relationships with a rare few.

  6. #176
    Member unsomething's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oneandonly View Post
    So Im trying to understand this although the reeses metaphor is abstract.. but basically, pleasantly surprised without having to navigate and flex through situations and people?

    I use Fe and Fi.. for instance I'm very Fe until recently when I fell in love.. the person themselves became an internal value I wasnt necessarily forthcoming about the gravity of my feelings. but then of course in moments where i could have revealed this depth I froze like an infj would, is what i hear.

    I appreciate all kinds of people but I only have close relationships with a rare few.
    Well, I was describing how I particularly feel about Fi in other people... it's this gooey, rich inside layer that you just wouldn't expect from the outside. I really feel happy when I can see the richness of someone's Fi. I find it really stimulating and refreshing.

    And yes, INFJs would certainly freeze if it seemed inappropriate to reveal their feelings or the possibility of them being accepted was very tenuous. Us NFJs are very uncomfortable with vulnerability, IE uncertainty. Fortunately they probably already know to some extent if their feelings will be reciprocated and when the time is right will have no problems saying it.

    And i sometimes wonder if a Fe user is even capable of truly loving someone without the possibility of reciprocation.

    Whereas with Fi users, bless their hearts, yeah, would just be so afraid of getting hurt. So afraid of letting someone in. And unfortunately they DO have a much higher chance of falling for someone one-sidedly. I'm sorry, NFPs out there must hate being treated like this but I always want to hug them and say it's gonna be okay. :3
    Likes BluRoses liked this post

  7. #177

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    I find that I hate when my guy flirts. Not so much if I truly trust him. But when he has been known to be a hound it can be a bit inferiating. Then resenting the fact that cause me to be jealous/embarrassed followed by the" the trust is just not there goodbye"! Always in that order too. Nutz
    Last edited by Miss Understood1; 09-30-2014 at 01:37 PM. Reason: edit

  8. #178
    Senior Member BluRoses's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miss Understood1 View Post
    I find that I hate when my guy flirts. Not so much if I truly trust him. But when he has been known to be a hound it can be a bit inferiating. Then resenting the fact that cause me to be jealous/embarrassed followed by the" the trust is just not there goodbye"! Always in that order too. Nutz
    I understand this cycle. Hugs!

    I have a long history of getting jealous when my SO flirts. I feel a flash of insecurity and then I am angry. Luckily I have learned to THINK about this feeling before I react to it (90% of the time...I'm not perfect) and to evaluate the whole situation. I think trust is vital to any relationship, but especially for ENFJ's and their SO's. I have found that if I communicate to my partner in an appropriate way (not by stomping away from him talking to a woman completely innocently and then yelling at him about what an insensitive jerk he is...not that I have EVER done this.) that I feel jealous and ask him for some reassurance. If he then listens to me and gives me the reassurance, then I completely cool down in like 1 min.

    The nuts thing for me is that with a previous person I was in love with it ended up that I would go through the cycle you describe and get to the last stage, "goodbye!" but not actually say goodbye. I would just stew in my hurt feelings after talking to him about it and blame myself for being jealous. So unhealthy of me. I think that communication is so important and knowing your personal limits are as well. I have a personal boundary that if someone lies to me repeatedly that I do not trust them any more. THEN they get the "goodbye!"

    As a side note, pretty much all of the jealousy I have ever experienced was when I was with an ENFP...I have very rarely had that problem with my INTP.

    ANYWAYS, communication.

  9. #179
    Lungs & Lips Locked Unkindloving's Avatar
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    I'm part of ENFJ facebook groups and sometimes they drive me absolutely batty with this misconception that we ENFJ folks have to be these Ghetto-Oprah-Mother Theresa, Unicorn-feely prancy fairies.
    As if we are only allowed to do no wrong, and by doing wrong or not being over-extensively-compassionate it is the ultimate definition of "unhealthy ENFJ". By this sentiment, the majority of ENFJs have tended to be all touchy-feely "a huggle and a cookie can solve all the problems, and we dare not have a healthy and civil dispute as that is even far to violent- Oh My!"

    I am unapologetic about my abrasive ENFJ tendencies, my lack of desire to fully extend and deplete myself for others, and my uncanny ability and desire to not just cater to everyone else's delicate sensibilities if it won't do anything but keep them safely ignorant. I'm all for the harmony-hands, but I shudder at the thought of kitten-cuddles just for the sake of it.

    Are we valued for such doormatting?
    Hang on traveling woman - Don't sacrifice your plan
    Cause it will come back to you - Before you lose it on the man


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  10. #180
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unkindloving View Post
    I'm part of ENFJ facebook groups and sometimes they drive me absolutely batty with this misconception that we ENFJ folks have to be these Ghetto-Oprah-Mother Theresa, Unicorn-feely prancy fairies.
    As if we are only allowed to do no wrong, and by doing wrong or not being over-extensively-compassionate it is the ultimate definition of "unhealthy ENFJ". By this sentiment, the majority of ENFJs have tended to be all touchy-feely "a huggle and a cookie can solve all the problems, and we dare not have a healthy and civil dispute as that is even far to violent- Oh My!"

    I am unapologetic about my abrasive ENFJ tendencies, my lack of desire to fully extend and deplete myself for others, and my uncanny ability and desire to not just cater to everyone else's delicate sensibilities if it won't do anything but keep them safely ignorant. I'm all for the harmony-hands, but I shudder at the thought of kitten-cuddles just for the sake of it.

    Are we valued for such doormatting?
    I have heard nothing but bad things about MBTI facebook groups. I wouldn't touch them with a 10ft poll and I don't use groups on facebook for that sort of thing anyway. It's probably best if you find a different location browse.

    I'm certainly not the cuddle-bunny stereotype of an ENFJ, and I know several IRL that aren't. It just seems common because the descriptions are often geared that way and it draws those individuals in since it fits well.
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
    Functions: Fe > Te > Ni > Se > Si > Ti > Fi > Ne
    Enneagram: 1w2 - 3w4 - 6w5 (The Taskmaster) | sp/so
    Socionics: β-E dimer | -
    Big 5: slOaI
    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari


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