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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dyoni View Post
    He's 26, I'm 25. I guess where I live, that's viewed as a bit old to not be married yet. I really want to be married before I'm 30... it's a source of constant stress for me. I feel like that's one of the things I need to do to feel like an accomplished adult.
    Could you explain how it works like that? It might be due to different culture, but I don't see how being married has anything to do with being seen as an adult.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dyoni View Post
    And if it comes about that he and I don't get married, then the pool of unmarried men will be so much smaller by the time we break up, that maybe I would have to settle with someone that wasn't the best match for me.
    Tell me if I'm wrong but this sounds like you think there would be less of a chance breaking up if you were married. (I also think you shouldn't mention this to him, as it might seem very calculating)

    Quote Originally Posted by Dyoni View Post
    I suppose that could be it, too. But I think he needs to realize that I don't want to be someone's girlfriend for the rest of my life either.
    Why not? I get the feeling this is about outward appearances. Usually INFPs are hard to make do anything just for the sake of pleasing "the crowd".

    Quote Originally Posted by Dyoni View Post
    Yeah, maybe I'm weird or something. I guess I just see a relationship as a sort of life-project that I want to keep working on and perfecting, where he seems to see it as a 'wherever life takes us' sort of thing.
    The wherever-life-takes-us is what to me is the whole beauty of it. It would be difficult to convince me that marriage can effect the quality of the relationship and make it more "perfect".

    BTW, I kinda feel like an asshole now, since I am basically opposing everything you see important, but maybe it is better that you get a very marriage-critical point of view here from some anonymous jerk, than from your boyfriend..? At least you'll know what to expect... maybe...

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    BTW, I kinda feel like an asshole now, since I am basically opposing everything you see important, but maybe it is better that you get a very marriage-critical point of view here from some anonymous jerk, than from your boyfriend..? At least you'll know what to expect... maybe...
    not that i disagree with you (i'm actually in the same boat), but if it's important to her, it's important to her. I agree examining such feelings is a good idea especially if you really love someone, and it's good to get an understanding of why someone can value issues so differently. but just as the INFP shouldn't compromise his values, neither should she or anyone else if it would truly upset them to do so.

    If the issue is, in fact, a difference in values and a compromise can't be reached i don't think either party should have to cater to the other's whim.
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dyoni View Post
    A few conversations I've had with him have came to 'why do you want to get married at all?' or things like 'I love you and I'm not going to leave you, so why do we need to get married?' I guess in my mind, if he wants a lifetime relationship, why NOT get married?
    I bet he would get married if there wasn't something in the way. I mean, I would try to please someone I loved unless there is something important value I would have to sacrifice in the process.

    Quote Originally Posted by stringstheory View Post
    I wish he would just tell me 'when this happens and this, then I would feel comfortable getting married.' Then we could work towards those things.
    This is something an INFP won't do. We don't like schedules nor giving orders.

    Quote Originally Posted by stringstheory View Post
    Make it known that you don't feel like he's been clear and the open-endedness of a situation that is actually very important to you is giving you a hard time. Ask him to elaborate about why he feels the way he does about marriage; i'm inclined to think he won't have a problem articulating that if you just ask. if he is not aware that marriage is something that means a lot to you, then make sure he knows.
    Quote Originally Posted by stringstheory View Post
    Is he just staying with me until he finds someone better? Is there a trait in me he's already decided that isn't acceptable, and plans on moving on eventually?
    I think these two points are excellent to start with. You should definitely try to make him see how it is making you feel and then try to get his point of view. If there is something he fiercely opposes in marriage, I am sure there is a way to get around it and kinda turn the ceremony into something you both can agree with.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    This is something an INFP won't do. We don't like schedules nor giving orders.
    just 'cause i'm a little obsessive.....i didn't actually say this
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by stringstheory View Post
    Ah, that answers that then....

    Make it known that you don't feel like he's been clear and the open-endedness of a situation that is actually very important to you is giving you a hard time. Ask him to elaborate about why he feels the way he does about marriage; i'm inclined to think he won't have a problem articulating that if you just ask. if he is not aware that marriage is something that means a lot to you, then make sure he knows. make this point right here really clear.
    Yeah, I think I just need to bring it up again and try to get more exact answers. He definitely knows that it's important to me, though... I'm not very good at being subtle >.<

    So what do you think would make marriage an attractive prospect to an INFP? Maybe I can try to bring up things that he would think were important that I haven't thought of.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dyoni View Post
    So what do you think would make marriage an attractive prospect to an INFP? Maybe I can try to bring up things that he would think were important that I haven't thought of.
    It should be enough if he knows how much it means to you, and if it is fairly easy for him to just come along.

    I don't think there is anything you can do or say to make the marriage itself seem more important, but you can make it as stress-free for him as possible. Then he would probably do it for you, not for the marriage.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    Could you explain how it works like that? It might be due to different culture, but I don't see how being married has anything to do with being seen as an adult.
    It might be due to growing up in Utah in a family that was partially Mormon. Even though I don't belong to a religion, I think of it as an accomplishment that I would like to work toward.

    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    Tell me if I'm wrong but this sounds like you think there would be less of a chance breaking up if you were married. (I also think you shouldn't mention this to him, as it might seem very calculating)
    I know that divorce is very common, but I still think marriage is a higher level of commitment that just being boyfriend/girlfriend. Also, I actually did bring that up, and he seemed put off. It was awkward. : /

    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    Why not? I get the feeling this is about outward appearances. Usually INFPs are hard to make do anything just for the sake of pleasing "the crowd".
    It is to a small extent, but more about how I see myself.

    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    The wherever-life-takes-us is what to me is the whole beauty of it. It would be difficult to convince me that marriage can effect the quality of the relationship and make it more "perfect".
    That's okay with me - I think his romanticism is endearing. I just want that 'road of life' to come to marriage eventually. The uncertainty makes me feel insecure.

    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    BTW, I kinda feel like an asshole now, since I am basically opposing everything you see important, but maybe it is better that you get a very marriage-critical point of view here from some anonymous jerk, than from your boyfriend..? At least you'll know what to expect... maybe...
    LOL! Don't worry, I like people being blunt with me. I don't think you need to walk on eggshells with many NTs

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dyoni View Post
    Yeah, I think I just need to bring it up again and try to get more exact answers. He definitely knows that it's important to me, though... I'm not very good at being subtle >.<

    So what do you think would make marriage an attractive prospect to an INFP? Maybe I can try to bring up things that he would think were important that I haven't thought of.
    like i said, the point you made about taking his "yeah, nothing really WOULD change" point and making it into, "but it means a lot to me and so it would be something simple that wouldn't change anything except make me feel more secure" is something that would convince me personally. Be prepared to explain, though, why you are not secure otherwise. It's possible it might make him suspicious.

    To us, values can equal identity. We can get very irritable and upset if we feel someone is trying to change our values, and therefore our identity. now, approaching it with this in mind, but from YOUR point of view will give you some common ground and that may help the both of you. Here's the rub though....if his values are very much set against it, then there isn't much you can do. You do NOT, by any means, want to push an NFP too far in terms of changing his mind about his values (especially if they are strongly held). Keep this in mind and be aware that if it's a big enough issue for both of you, it may be a big indicator that neither of you will get what you want out of the relationship.
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  9. #29
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    What does it take for an INFP to change his/her values? You should be rather steadfast in your ways as Fi is at the forefront, but you seem to accept others freely. What experiences have shown you that you need to adjust your values, if this has ever happened at all?

  10. #30
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    Hmmm... changing values? This is turning into a drama now...

    For me these values that I hold to are about the only thing that's constant about me. Think of an INFP as a rock covered with jelly. Lots of jelly. From afar it looks like a planet made of jelly, and you can poke all you want and even mold it into something. But then you find the rock and it won't move. At all.

    Well, these values do change from time to time, but for me that has only happened by some dramatic change in circumstances or through prolonged periods of self-reflection. Even then, it can take months or years, and it doesn't happen without me being very active in doing it. So, in my opinion

    1) there is no way anyone can make an INFP change the core values in the direction they want. It could be possible to prod me into self-reflection (through some questionable methods) but I think it will be very hard to predict which way I go with my thoughts. So it is not worth it.

    2) it will be too slow.

    Because of the unpredictability of the value changing, I would suggest a little tweaking on the marriage. If all that matters is that you get married, then why not take anything away from the wedding that he disagrees with? Does it need to be in a church? Do you need many quests? Does the promise have to be "until death do us apart" or can it be "until I don't feel the love anymore"?

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