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Thread: Common INFJ issues

  1. #201
    Iron Maiden Array fidelia's Avatar
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    That is true. But I think that if we expand this to how do INFJs best learn to communicate with every type, it is also going to cover too vast a range of stuff to follow. Therefore, my proposal is that we start a separate thread for that (which I think would be equally valuable). My intent in starting this thread was for INFJs to compare their experiences and most common issues that come up or for those coming in to figure out where the differences lie when they are communicating with them. I think this thread even illustrates the usefulness of learning about the other half of communication, but deserves enough room to properly discuss it!

  2. #202
    Senior Member Array Keps Mnemnosyne's Avatar
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    I have to agree with Peguy; I have a saying if you come into my room uninvited without crying, you'll leave crying. Overly dramatic and not done, but it does symbolize my intense need for privacy unless someone is having an emergency and needs my help. Saying "I just wanted to say hello" does not count as an emergency. I tend to be very disgruntled if people come uninvited, and will quickly usher (without trying to hurt feelings) them out to a more public area where I can deal with them. When I'm being private, I'm in an off mode of dealing with people and in an on mode of enjoying myself as well as thinking. I will tend not to answer phone calls and just listen to messages and judge whether I need to break silence and call them back immediately or if they can wait till the next day.

    To Fidelia: A good point.
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  3. #203
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    What's worse is when it continously hinders your abilities to work. And I just mention about the irregularity of work habits, so when your mind is in the perfect state for it - you can't do it.

    To help give a clearer idea of what I talking about, here's video of one INFJ at work in his study:
    [youtube="MvEUfkavvSI"]Warning: INFJ at work![/youtube]
    You can literally hear a pin drop. You can also see how things are haphazardly organized "in the right place". This is the kind of enviroment I'd thrive in!

  4. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    You can only let it all hang out once you have some positive history and some time spent with the people you are discussing things with (at least in my experience, and I suspect, other INFJs' as well). In real life you don't start making over your acquaintances (who already have a poor first impression) and telling them how to behave. I am almost never this direct with someone, but there were already previous discussion about these issues and they were completely ignored and left unaddressed. That's a sure way to raise hackles.
    Like I indicated - I have read the Wench's posts. I have read your responses (in more than one thread...some even started by ENFPs).

    I am only sharing my opinion here - but it does seem like you are accusing the Wench of 'doing'...what you are actually 'doing'.

    When I read her posts I see an individual that is making broad, generalized statements. Perhaps she doesn't present her ideas in a way that you or maybe anyone would find appealing...but being a forceful communicator does not automatically make the message a judgemental one.

    What I get from you, however, are very specific statements directed at her and her character. In your last response, you really let her have it...basically telling the Wench what you and apparently every other INFJ on the face of the planet (you may have even spoken on behalf of her INFJ friend as well - or at least that is how it came across in my mind) 'think of her'.

    It just really effected me. I had been on vacation and catching up...and was so inspired by this thread and all the profound insights. And then it seemed like things went off-track here (for me). But...I'm just one of those clueless ENFPs so what do I know...right? Heck - I don't even have enough positive history to even matter.

  5. #205
    Iron Maiden Array fidelia's Avatar
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    Welcome here, Starry Knights. I'm sorry to have alarmed you. I like ENFPs. I have no interest in devastating or attacking anyone. I don't have anything personal against Esoteric Wench. If the tables were turned, I would be the one that would have to change my style of communication.

    In this context, I don't think that is what is called for. This didn't come out of nowhere. If you are told that there are bears ahead, you don't keep going down the same path unless you want to deal with the possibly negative consequences. Just repeating that there shouldn't be bears won't change things.

    Again, I think this is an issue of the medium mattering just as much as the message (in this case a forceful presentation, even if some points are valid), as well as Fe/Fi (fitting in, and looking for common ground are generally the starting points for a productive discussion with a Fe user. They are not in the same starting points as a Fi user would pursue). So if I were approaching a Fi user, I would need to communicate differently than I do here.)

    I would greatly appreciate an ENFP starting a similar kind of thread, because I would like to understand where our misunderstandings arise from that perspective. I normally would not pursue this kind of conflict, but I see it happen on a regular basis throughout the forum and think it is worth investigating, as long as it is not done in a non-solution oriented way. I have tried to make it very clear where I think things have gone off the rails from an INFJ or Fe perspective. I also have tried to be specific about what could be done differently that could avoid that happening. If someone else cares to start a thread for ENFPs, I think it would be extremely helpful to know what I/we do that is equally problematic coming from the opposite direction.

  6. #206
    Iron Maiden Array fidelia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    What's worse is when it continously hinders your abilities to work. And I just mention about the irregularity of work habits, so when your mind is in the perfect state for it - you can't do it.

    To help give a clearer idea of what I talking about, here's video of one INFJ at work in his study:
    [youtube="MvEUfkavvSI"]Warning: INFJ at work![/youtube]
    You can literally hear a pin drop. You can also see how things are haphazardly organized "in the right place". This is the kind of enviroment I'd thrive in!
    The desk looks familiar to me - orderly mess. The quietness thing though is something else. I find I like a little noise around me to keep me productive! Interesting how many different types within our main type there are!

  7. #207
    Senior Member Array cafe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runvardh View Post
    Why is it always you making me quesition my P...
    I'm not a very J-ish J.
    Quote Originally Posted by StarryKnights View Post
    Like I indicated - I have read the Wench's posts. I have read your responses (in more than one thread...some even started by ENFPs).

    I am only sharing my opinion here - but it does seem like you are accusing the Wench of 'doing'...what you are actually 'doing'.

    When I read her posts I see an individual that is making broad, generalized statements. Perhaps she doesn't present her ideas in a way that you or maybe anyone would find appealing...but being a forceful communicator does not automatically make the message a judgemental one.

    What I get from you, however, are very specific statements directed at her and her character. In your last response, you really let her have it...basically telling the Wench what you and apparently every other INFJ on the face of the planet (you may have even spoken on behalf of her INFJ friend as well - or at least that is how it came across in my mind) 'think of her'.

    It just really effected me. I had been on vacation and catching up...and was so inspired by this thread and all the profound insights. And then it seemed like things went off-track here (for me). But...I'm just one of those clueless ENFPs so what do I know...right? Heck - I don't even have enough positive history to even matter.
    In Fidilia's defense, I find that EW's posting style almost universally and consistently rubs me the wrong way in an extreme way and has since she started posting here. It feels extremely condescending and overbearing -- like someone trying to fix you without actually trying to understand what the problem is and when you didn't ask to be fixed. I honestly don't know anyone IRL or online that doesn't find the pushy offering of unsolicited advice obnoxious and that is generally how EW comes across.

    It feels like a stranger knocking on your door when you weren't expecting company, pushing their way past you into your living room, plopping down on your sofa, putting their feet on the coffee table with their shoes on, picking up the remote and changing the channel, demanding that you get them something to drink then complaining about the color of your curtains, telling you that your sofa is uncomfortable, and that the lemonade you brought them isn't any good, telling you to pipe down because they are trying to hear Doctor Phil, and getting really indignant and offended when you say you don't like it.

    I don't find all Fi communicators abrasive -- only a handful, really, so I'm not sure how the problem is best addressed. I don't think this is the thread in which to do it, however. I like the idea of a new thread if this is going to be a big topic of discussion.
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  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    The desk looks familiar to me - orderly mess. The quietness thing though is something else. I find I like a little noise around me to keep me productive! Interesting how many different types within our main type there are!
    Well I often like music too, Classical usually, or soft relaxing stuff in the background. Although if that's not possible, complete silence would be just as good for me. I love it when I can find that at the library - IF I can find it. :rolli:

  9. #209
    Iron Maiden Array fidelia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    I'm not a very J-ish J.

    In Fidilia's defense, I find that EW's posting style almost universally and consistently rubs me the wrong way in an extreme way and has since she started posting here. It feels extremely condescending and overbearing -- like someone trying to fix you without actually trying to understand what the problem is and when you didn't ask to be fixed. I honestly don't know anyone IRL or online that doesn't find the pushy offering of unsolicited advice obnoxious and that is generally how EW comes across.

    It feels like a stranger knocking on your door when you weren't expecting company, pushing their way past you into your living room, plopping down on your sofa, putting their feet on the coffee table with their shoes on, picking up the remote and changing the channel, demanding that you get them something to drink then complaining about the color of your curtains, telling you that your sofa is uncomfortable, and that the lemonade you brought them isn't any good, telling you to pipe down because they are trying to hear Doctor Phil, and getting really indignant and offended when you say you don't like it.

    I don't find all Fi communicators abrasive -- only a handful, really, so I'm not sure how the problem is best addressed. I don't think this is the thread in which to do it, however. I like the idea of a new thread if this is going to be a big topic of discussion.
    I agree. While I am more likely to have problems communicating with Fi users than Fe users, it certainly isn't most of them.

  10. #210
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    What's worse is when it continously hinders your abilities to work. And I just mention about the irregularity of work habits, so when your mind is in the perfect state for it - you can't do it.

    To help give a clearer idea of what I talking about, here's video of one INFJ at work in his study:
    [youtube="MvEUfkavvSI"]Warning: INFJ at work![/youtube]
    You can literally hear a pin drop. You can also see how things are haphazardly organized "in the right place". This is the kind of enviroment I'd thrive in!
    I would need the music on, off, on, off, on, off. And not to mention garbage around me. Lots of good beverages and food. Being organized won't help me do much good, in fact being organized seems quite messy to me. I don't like it dirty, but messy yes.

    My apartment is plain blank white boring with no pictures on the walls no nothing,, to say I was to live in house with multiple colors, pictures and paintings on the walls, lots of weird shit everywhere, I'd feel as if I was high on something. And that's the best working area for me.

    Ps. I do not have A.D.D. or A.D.H.D. but it's pretty darn close.

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