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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoSunshine View Post
    TIRES SQUEELING...CRASH! Yeah, I've hit aforementioned wall with my INFP guy.

    It's so odd to me. We really hit it off and seemed to connect on a deep level. But lately it seems like we are further apart 4 months into it than we were 2 weeks in

    I have backed off (as a matter-of-fact I suggested we keep things casual rather than do the BF-GF thing) becuase I felt like I was banging my head against the wall getting him to open up or even just spend time together doing nothing (he thinks I'll be bored unless he is engaging me somehow, so not true). There are some other issues as well, but we won't get into all of that as they aren't related to the "wall".

    Just today he had his job review and I gather that it didn't go so well from his short responses. He shut down the convo and is out getting hammered with his buddies now. I know he wants to talk about it, but he just won't at least not with me. I'M GOOD AT LISTENING DAMN IT! Seems like everyone talks to me good or bad except him

    All that aside, I still think there is something very special there. I think this relationship just might take longer to perculate than I am used to. I'm going to keep giving it the old college try and see if we can't bust down this wall becuase I think there may be greatness on the other side
    I can relate to your boyfriend somewhat I suppose.

    This list is how I am, not how he is. So take it with a pinch of salt.

    (1) Backing off means you're not interested, in doubt, or bored of me, causing a reason to fear that you'll leave. I wouldn't tell you about this because it is the same as not trusting you and I feel as if not trusting you is immoral/not appropriate behaviour in a relationship. My mother nailed "relationship is all about trust" into my head, and my values are to be honest at all times. So I've created my own little loophole when it comes to lying, that not saying what I feel is not the same as lying. If you were to ask "do you not trust me?" then you would provoke me to lie about it, which makes me feel bad about lying to you. I mean, this is not the same as being unfaithful; if a girl ever kissed me on the lips while I was in a relationship, I would have to call my girlfriend up on the phone immediately and go "Honey! This girl just jumped me, I'm coming home!" At least that's how honest I am about it because I would be TERRIFIED that it would come back and bite me in the ass later.

    (2) If you opened up first, then sure, I would somewhat be able to open up, but I would still hold my true feelings inside because they feel as if too intense. It is ultimately confusing. I know deep inside that I "feel" way too much, but I'm reluctant to talk about it because my feelings seems to be... inappropriate. I do think way too much about myself, in a negative way, but in order for me to do so I have to practice "Everyone has experienced something dramatic in their lifes, I'm not special," and that's why I will never share the true power of my feelings. I can let a little bit out, but not its true form. For instance, feeling love; I feel love very, very intensely-- too intensely, and too prematurely in fact. I would also not want to talk about it because I don't want to seem like I'm whining about it, and if I first start to talk about it, I'll whine. Yap yap yap, continuesly. So I prefer not to say anything. Back in the days it could make me explode at one point (if you two cannot communicate with eachother well, then you'll have to watch out for that).

    (3) I feel worthless if rejected (I feel like a loser, as if there is no reason to continue or move on. I will rather ignore it, and let it be). I don't like peptalks (I don't know why. The "you'll do better next time! *smile and pat on the back*," annoys me). I won't talk about it (because there's nothing to talk about). I want to feel loved and appreciated (I won't say it, because it seems girly, and I'm a "manly man").

    (4) If I want space, I will find myself an activity and go at it. And I would respond questions with "in a while," or "later" quite often.

    (5) Say stuff like "you know it's ok if," and "because it's only natural" and "I do too" when you want to fish something out of me. (I think)


    And all of this varies with me of course. I just happened to grab this from the top of my head. Didn't polish it. Number four and five are just.. I don't know about them at all.

    If he can relate to what I said above, then sure, you two need to talk more; communicate in the right sort of way.

  2. #22
    man-made neptunesnet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by angell_m View Post
    (1) Backing off means you're not interested, in doubt, or bored of me, causing a reason to fear that you'll leave. I wouldn't tell you about this because it is the same as not trusting you and I feel as if not trusting you is immoral/not appropriate behaviour in a relationship. My mother nailed "relationship is all about trust" into my head, and my values are to be honest at all times. So I've created my own little loophole when it comes to lying, that not saying what I feel is not the same as lying. If you were to ask "do you not trust me?" then you would provoke me to lie about it, which makes me feel bad about lying to you. I mean, this is not the same as being unfaithful; if a girl ever kissed me on the lips while I was in a relationship, I would have to call my girlfriend up on the phone immediately and go "Honey! This girl just jumped me, I'm coming home!" At least that's how honest I am about it because I would be TERRIFIED that it would come back and bite me in the ass later.
    Perhaps I'm just a very difficult INFP (which is something I wouldn't at all doubt), but I don't see anything wrong with being cautious in the very beginning of a relationship. I don't trust people I don't know. Bottom line. When I'm dating someone, I'm feeling him out, getting to know him, making sure through his actions & behavior he's someone I can rely & depend on in the future, but at the moment I don't know him. At this stage, nothing will surprise me & I'm prepared for the worst, most vile person to eventually surface over time while at the same time hoping for the very best from him. I want him to be as wonderful as he seems to be. I want to trust him. He just needs to give me a reason to.

    Now, I do realize I'll never be able to fully know a person and his motives & intentions, but I'd like to get pretty close.

    (2) If you opened up first, then sure, I would somewhat be able to open up, but I would still hold my true feelings inside because they feel as if too intense. It is ultimately confusing. I know deep inside that I "feel" way too much, but I'm reluctant to talk about it because my feelings seems to be... inappropriate. I do think way too much about myself, in a negative way, but in order for me to do so I have to practice "Everyone has experienced something dramatic in their lifes, I'm not special," and that's why I will never share the true power of my feelings. I can let a little bit out, but not its true form. For instance, feeling love; I feel love very, very intensely-- too intensely, and too prematurely in fact. I would also not want to talk about it because I don't want to seem like I'm whining about it, and if I first start to talk about it, I'll whine. Yap yap yap, continuesly. So I prefer not to say anything. Back in the days it could make me explode at one point (if you two cannot communicate with eachother well, then you'll have to watch out for that).

    (3) I feel worthless if rejected (I feel like a loser, as if there is no reason to continue or move on. I will rather ignore it, and let it be). I don't like peptalks (I don't know why. The "you'll do better next time! *smile and pat on the back*," annoys me). I won't talk about it (because there's nothing to talk about). I want to feel loved and appreciated (I won't say it, because it seems girly, and I'm a "manly man").
    I can definitely relate to much of this, esp (2).

    (4) If I want space, I will find myself an activity and go at it. And I would respond questions with "in a while," or "later" quite often.

    (5) Say stuff like "you know it's ok if," and "because it's only natural" and "I do too" when you want to fish something out of me. (I think)

  3. #23
    That's my name biotch! JoSunshine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runvardh View Post
    Mess up #1 was dialing it back from SO to friends. I don't know about other people, but I take that very seriously and it does put you in a circle around that is emotionally further away. Past that I even tried to keep up communications with the ENFJ I was dating, who also said we should back it off, only to be stonewalled more and more till she moved away and then had the gall to call me cold to her friends.
    I would say this would be exactly what would happen to us except for my stellar communication skills

    Seriously though...I was really scared of alienating him altogether by backing up however, I was going nuts and things felt very push-pull (me pushing him and him pulling away). I felt like I had to roll things back for my sanity. I was very communicative with him and explained that I don't feel any different about him and that I am hopeful for and desire a long-term, stable relationship with him and that I didn't want to see him less, talk to him less or get to know him less. I explained that I just seem to move faster and want more sooner than he is comfy with so I was going to pare back my expectations (for now). It took several conversations and a lot of reassurance from me that I'm not going anywhere, just slowing my pace to be more in line with something he can keep up with. I feel pretty sure that he knows how much I care about him...mostly becuase he tells me that he's not used to someone caring so much about him

    Quote Originally Posted by angell_m View Post
    I can relate to your boyfriend somewhat I suppose.

    This list is how I am, not how he is. So take it with a pinch of salt.

    (1) Backing off means you're not interested, in doubt, or bored of me, causing a reason to fear that you'll leave. I wouldn't tell you about this because it is the same as not trusting you and I feel as if not trusting you is immoral/not appropriate behaviour in a relationship. My mother nailed "relationship is all about trust" into my head, and my values are to be honest at all times. So I've created my own little loophole when it comes to lying, that not saying what I feel is not the same as lying. If you were to ask "do you not trust me?" then you would provoke me to lie about it, which makes me feel bad about lying to you. I mean, this is not the same as being unfaithful; if a girl ever kissed me on the lips while I was in a relationship, I would have to call my girlfriend up on the phone immediately and go "Honey! This girl just jumped me, I'm coming home!" At least that's how honest I am about it because I would be TERRIFIED that it would come back and bite me in the ass later.
    I would say that this would be similar to him. The thing is, I'm scared too. I feel like he is not interested, in doubt, or bored of me, causing a reason to fear that he'll leave becuase I have such difficultly getting him to engage to the extent that I desire. However I think this is not the case. I tell him this so he knows that I am just as afraid as he is...I think this helps, but it's hard to say.

    Quote Originally Posted by angell_m View Post
    (2) If you opened up first, then sure, I would somewhat be able to open up, but I would still hold my true feelings inside because they feel as if too intense. It is ultimately confusing. I know deep inside that I "feel" way too much, but I'm reluctant to talk about it because my feelings seems to be... inappropriate. I do think way too much about myself, in a negative way, but in order for me to do so I have to practice "Everyone has experienced something dramatic in their lifes, I'm not special," and that's why I will never share the true power of my feelings. I can let a little bit out, but not its true form. For instance, feeling love; I feel love very, very intensely-- too intensely, and too prematurely in fact. I would also not want to talk about it because I don't want to seem like I'm whining about it, and if I first start to talk about it, I'll whine. Yap yap yap, continuesly. So I prefer not to say anything. Back in the days it could make me explode at one point (if you two cannot communicate with eachother well, then you'll have to watch out for that).
    Yes again...he told me he feels silly talking about his feelings becuase he feels dramatic, but I know that he feels things deeply and is very sensitive. I try to reassure him that I don't think he is silly. I could probably do a better job of letting him in on the drama that goes on in my head so that he will feel better about opening up to me, but I'm used to opening up to people AFTER they open up to me...I'm probably going to need to take the lead on this one even though it's every bit as scary for me as it is for him. And no doubt our communication needs work. Maybe this is would be a good start?

    Quote Originally Posted by angell_m View Post
    (3) I feel worthless if rejected (I feel like a loser, as if there is no reason to continue or move on. I will rather ignore it, and let it be). I don't like peptalks (I don't know why. The "you'll do better next time! *smile and pat on the back*," annoys me). I won't talk about it (because there's nothing to talk about). I want to feel loved and appreciated (I won't say it, because it seems girly, and I'm a "manly man").
    I have no idea how to handle any of this! What is a woman to do?


    Quote Originally Posted by angell_m View Post
    (5) Say stuff like "you know it's ok if," and "because it's only natural" and "I do too" when you want to fish something out of me. (I think)[/I][/SIZE]
    I do do this quite a bit although sometimes it makes me a bit uncomfortable becuase I have to guess at what is bothering him and I'm never quite sure if I am getting it right. It would be so much easier if I could ask "what's bothering you?" and get a straight answer, but I'm pretty sure that's wishful thinking
    "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. " - Dr. Seuss
    I can't spell...get over it

    Slightly ENFJ, totally JoSunshine
    Extroverted (E) 52.5%........Introverted (I) 47.5%
    Intuitive (N) 65.63%..........Sensing (S) 34.38%
    Feeling (F) 55.56%............Thinking (T) 44.44%
    Judging (J) 51.43%............Perceiving (P) 48.57%

  4. #24
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    It is sometimes easier - and better - to communicate through art. Otherwise
    we wouldn't have had art today; paintings, music, sculptures, books, and
    so forth. A song can sometimes explain so much more than a paragaph ever
    would, and a paragraph can sometimes explain so much more than an oral
    conversation ever would. I want to suggest that you show your boyfriend our
    written conversation, not keep it in your head, to yourself; to wonder; to
    puzzle; to figure out. It is trivial, and you will most likely not be able to figure
    it out on your own. It will most likely break you before you ever get a chance
    to fix it if you do.

    I'm still young however, mid twenties. I've had few relationships in my short
    time on this planet. So I might not be the best one to exert my confidence on
    this matter. But this is as close to real as it gets, to me anyway.

    Hope you two get to work it out somehow.

  5. #25
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoSunshine View Post
    Seriously though...I was really scared of alienating him altogether by backing up however, I was going nuts and things felt very push-pull (me pushing him and him pulling away). I felt like I had to roll things back for my sanity. I was very communicative with him and explained that I don't feel any different about him and that I am hopeful for and desire a long-term, stable relationship with him and that I didn't want to see him less, talk to him less or get to know him less. I explained that I just seem to move faster and want more sooner than he is comfy with so I was going to pare back my expectations (for now). It took several conversations and a lot of reassurance from me that I'm not going anywhere, just slowing my pace to be more in line with something he can keep up with. I feel pretty sure that he knows how much I care about him...mostly becuase he tells me that he's not used to someone caring so much about him
    Wow, if he hasn't fully detached from you he will soon. Want to go faster than he does? Yeah, this won't go anywhere.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

    INFP, 6w7, IEI

    I accept no responsibility, what so ever, for the fact that I exist; I do, however, accept full responsibility for what I do while I exist.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  6. #26
    That's my name biotch! JoSunshine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runvardh View Post
    Wow, if he hasn't fully detached from you he will soon. Want to go faster than he does? Yeah, this won't go anywhere.
    So positive! What lead you to that conclusion?
    "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. " - Dr. Seuss
    I can't spell...get over it

    Slightly ENFJ, totally JoSunshine
    Extroverted (E) 52.5%........Introverted (I) 47.5%
    Intuitive (N) 65.63%..........Sensing (S) 34.38%
    Feeling (F) 55.56%............Thinking (T) 44.44%
    Judging (J) 51.43%............Perceiving (P) 48.57%

  7. #27
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoSunshine View Post
    So positive! What lead you to that conclusion?
    You told him you were backing off because it looked like you wanted to go faster than he did. That's invalidation right there and with that it doesn't surprise me that he won't divulge his hurts and pains.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

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    I accept no responsibility, what so ever, for the fact that I exist; I do, however, accept full responsibility for what I do while I exist.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  8. #28
    That's my name biotch! JoSunshine's Avatar
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    I'm still not really following your logic
    "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. " - Dr. Seuss
    I can't spell...get over it

    Slightly ENFJ, totally JoSunshine
    Extroverted (E) 52.5%........Introverted (I) 47.5%
    Intuitive (N) 65.63%..........Sensing (S) 34.38%
    Feeling (F) 55.56%............Thinking (T) 44.44%
    Judging (J) 51.43%............Perceiving (P) 48.57%

  9. #29
    ✿ڿڰۣஇღ♥ wut ♥ღஇڿڰۣ✿ digesthisickness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by angell_m View Post
    I can relate to your boyfriend somewhat I suppose.

    This list is how I am, not how he is. So take it with a pinch of salt.

    (1) Backing off means you're not interested, in doubt, or bored of me, causing a reason to fear that you'll leave. I wouldn't tell you about this because it is the same as not trusting you and I feel as if not trusting you is immoral/not appropriate behaviour in a relationship. My mother nailed "relationship is all about trust" into my head, and my values are to be honest at all times. So I've created my own little loophole when it comes to lying, that not saying what I feel is not the same as lying. If you were to ask "do you not trust me?" then you would provoke me to lie about it, which makes me feel bad about lying to you. I mean, this is not the same as being unfaithful; if a girl ever kissed me on the lips while I was in a relationship, I would have to call my girlfriend up on the phone immediately and go "Honey! This girl just jumped me, I'm coming home!" At least that's how honest I am about it because I would be TERRIFIED that it would come back and bite me in the ass later.

    (2) If you opened up first, then sure, I would somewhat be able to open up, but I would still hold my true feelings inside because they feel as if too intense. It is ultimately confusing. I know deep inside that I "feel" way too much, but I'm reluctant to talk about it because my feelings seems to be... inappropriate. I do think way too much about myself, in a negative way, but in order for me to do so I have to practice "Everyone has experienced something dramatic in their lifes, I'm not special," and that's why I will never share the true power of my feelings. I can let a little bit out, but not its true form. For instance, feeling love; I feel love very, very intensely-- too intensely, and too prematurely in fact. I would also not want to talk about it because I don't want to seem like I'm whining about it, and if I first start to talk about it, I'll whine. Yap yap yap, continuesly. So I prefer not to say anything. Back in the days it could make me explode at one point (if you two cannot communicate with eachother well, then you'll have to watch out for that).

    (3) I feel worthless if rejected (I feel like a loser, as if there is no reason to continue or move on. I will rather ignore it, and let it be). I don't like peptalks (I don't know why. The "you'll do better next time! *smile and pat on the back*," annoys me). I won't talk about it (because there's nothing to talk about). I want to feel loved and appreciated (I won't say it, because it seems girly, and I'm a "manly man").

    (4) If I want space, I will find myself an activity and go at it. And I would respond questions with "in a while," or "later" quite often.

    (5) Say stuff like "you know it's ok if," and "because it's only natural" and "I do too" when you want to fish something out of me. (I think)


    And all of this varies with me of course. I just happened to grab this from the top of my head. Didn't polish it. Number four and five are just.. I don't know about them at all.

    If he can relate to what I said above, then sure, you two need to talk more; communicate in the right sort of way.
    this entire post is win.
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  10. #30
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoSunshine View Post
    I'm still not really following your logic
    Because the logic is in fundamentals that either aren't covered by Fe or your experience.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

    INFP, 6w7, IEI

    I accept no responsibility, what so ever, for the fact that I exist; I do, however, accept full responsibility for what I do while I exist.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

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