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  1. #41
    Senor Membrane
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    Shut up! Less bull more geese!

  2. #42
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady X View Post
    i would take it to mean that they want someone who can see past their outward expression or statements that might be interpreted as disinterested or unaffected...maybe they seem aloof because they're shy...maybe they feel too much or care too much so they over compensate by acting the opposite...so...that's a lot of confusing bs to someone who doesn't know how to look.
    This is it....and much of it boils down to appearing inconsistent, IMO.

    I know, for myself, that I do not tend to have inconsistent feelings, in the MBTI capital F sense of feeling. I DO have inconsistent moods, and I will give into them & it will confuse people. I like you but I am not in the mood to talk to anyone, so it appears I am ignoring you....but I'm really being true to myself in one sense, so it's no act of playing hard to get.

    This is my problem though, and it's something I've had to get over in order to have any hope of ever having a long term relationship. I've realized I have to stay true to my larger feeling instead of the mood of the moment to send clear signals to people. I will always need a lot of space though, and that is something you have to come to terms with when it comes to very high introverts. I don't initiate a lot, but if I respond well most of the time to someone else's efforts, then that means I probably like that person or else I'd avoid them.

    If you want to get past the aloofness before they learn to function better, then accept that inconsistent behavior does not equal lack of feeling. Don't be delusional either though.... :P

    A few other points....

    I love Romanticism & consider myself a kind of Romanticist, but very outward expressions of warm emotion can be overwhelming to me and even embarrassing. Even if I do feel strongly, I may try and diffuse my expressions to avoid any possibility of awkwardness (possibly the Ne tangents you've noted - conversation takes a swift change when it gets too mushy - let me tell you, ENFJs pull a similar trick when it gets too "personal"). This may appear "coy" but it's not a calculating move. This is basically waiting for the INFP to warm up to you, which can take a lot of time, possibly much more than the typical person. I'm thinking some of this is my so instinct from enneagram though...
    Too much too soon from the other person can also scare me away. It reeks of insincerity, which I can't stand. On the other hand, I've often found the ENFJ ease of expression liberating of my own, so that I warm up faster. Constant elusiveness from me to answer a question straight regarding how I feel is a sign I'm not interested.... Yes, I realize this seems, well, inconsistent .

    As for this "sugarcube" thing, I will throw out "tests", but not consciously. I may say/do something to see what reaction the person has, and that may tell me if I can be safe to open up to them more. It's a "can you deal with my Fi?" sort of thing. It's a lot more subtle than you might be imagining right now, and the aim is to put someone off, and if they stick around, then they pass. I don't even realize I do it til afterwards sometimes. Maybe it does come out in Ne form - I'm sure it has a random, non-direct quality & maybe that's what you pick up on. Often, Ne with a Ni person is more like "play with me!" than any kind of challenge. I think the issue comes to a head when a Fe person registers such conversation as something awkward, and instinct is to change the subject - this appears dismissive to me as an INFP.

    I'm starting to ramble now, but that's my BS, or rather, the obstacle course.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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    Likes Jor24 liked this post

  3. #43
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    ^ OrangeAppled, that tis not BS. That is excellent... well written and you are precisely right on IMO.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuzzcrossed View Post
    Now that I've heard it from so many different perspectives, I can refine and rephrase my question.

    I've noticed, through personal experiences that INFPs have a tendency of using their Ne to form a trail of "shiny concepts" for an Ni user to follow. INFPs can use this ability very much like an Fe-user uses emo-persuasion, and can lead a person in a certain direction like a horse follows someone with sugarcubes in their hand.

    A. Do you use this ability?
    B. If you use it, how so?
    C. Have you ever used it as a filter with possible romantic interests to see if they're clever enough to see past the "sugarcube" and into your true intentions?

    Feel free to comment "around" the question too. Thanks.
    This seems more like one of those high school math test questions we skipped in school. A little bit because it didn't make any sense. A little bit because it was too hard. And a little bit because we just didn't give a damn.

    Your other question was a whole lot better.

    Don't get me wrong. Didn't want to offend you or anything, if anything I tried to put out a joke or something. I don't know, I haven't slept in a while.

  5. #45
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    Mine:

    I am moody and short tempered.

    Somewhat arrogant. (Or I just say I'm smarter or better looking than someone else...but I usually don't really mean it, deep down.)

    If I have a strong opinion about something, you better be prepared for me going off on a tirade about it, because I am extremely opionated.

    I sometimes get my feelings hurt way too easily.

    They have to be able to tolerate my abnormal obsession with cats and flowers. :P

  6. #46
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by musicnerd93 View Post
    Mine:

    I am moody and short tempered.

    Somewhat arrogant. (Or I just say I'm smarter or better looking than someone else...but I usually don't really mean it, deep down.)

    If I have a strong opinion about something, you better be prepared for me going off on a tirade about it, because I am extremely opinionated.

    I sometimes get my feelings hurt way too easily.
    This is a pretty good shortlist of my flaws also. I'm not arrogant so much as suffering from occasional bouts of elitism. The tirades aren't trotted out for just anyone either; consider yourself privileged to hear one.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuzzcrossed View Post
    I've often heard INFPs describing desiring a partner that gets past their "bullshit". I have an inkling as to what this is, but I'd like to hear it from you. What do you think? What is your "bullshit"? What is it about yourself that you'd like your partner to get around?

    Btw, this isn't a slight against y'all. This is a concept I've heard of from more than one of you though. I'm curious to see if there's anything to it.

    Thanks,
    --Fuzzy
    I've dated a couple of INFPs - granted they were (and are) very very 'green'. I'm surprised to hear that INFPs you know have actually outright said that about their BS. I wonder from their perspective what they are talking about since all I know is what I think the 'BS' refers to. I've definitely dealt with A LOT of unintentional bs from the INFP I've dated as well as the intentional 'bs' they were throwing out.

    Quote Originally Posted by EnflamedHeartofSand View Post
    I like to put my worst foot forward sometimes when I really like someone, which though may seem counterintuitive, is my way of showing the person I care about them, because I want them to like me even when I'm at my worst, hoping that they won't be repelled by it. If they can get through all that b.s, and see that within me is an unrelenting desire to ascend the heights, that is when I'll know I found a true friend.

    I'm not saying this is the right approach, it's actually very selfish.
    I think this hits the nail right on, actually! At least for one possible aspect of 'bs'.

    For the INFPs I dated, I think on some level they consciously believe this ^^ that they need to test people to find 'the ones' and that the people they date have to be willing and capable of extremes to be trustworthy.

    Also, there was just a lot of bs to deal with because of their own conflicted natures/feelings/approaches to dating, behavior was scattershot because of being NP and the Fi just kicked the bs level into overdrive. T

    here is somewhat of an all or nothing "you must accept me for everything I am unconditionally even with all my flaws which I may or may not want to change later and you are not allowed to question certain relationships, actions, habits etc because I am not able to even articulate to myself, let alone someone else, what those are all about". There is always an element of fear, uncertainty, even anxiety at the beginning of any dating situation but with the INFPs I dated, they handled it very poorly and it led to 'bs'.

    Having spoken to some other XNFPs on the forum about this, I discovered some great general rules for dating. I think the OP question is applicable to dating in general. I think in the beginning stages when people are being wishy washy or waiting and seeing or deciding if they want to commit - you have to watch their actions, not listen to their words.

    For INFPs, you basically have to steer the ship, never, ever let them steer the ship if you want to get to the destination with the boat in one piece. That's how I interpret the 'get through my [INFP] bs'.

    In younger/immature INFPs there is definitely a lot of what ends up being head-game playing and 'guess exactly what I'm feeling and prove to me you care' - though they may not consider it game playing. Lots of things unspoken that later come to surface and blindside you and seeming inconsistency.
    “If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.” ― Oscar Wilde

    "I'm outtie 5000" ― Romulux

    Johari/Nohari

  8. #48
    Senior Member paradox fox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuzzcrossed View Post
    I've often heard INFPs describing desiring a partner that gets past their "bullshit". I have an inkling as to what this is, but I'd like to hear it from you. What do you think? What is your "bullshit"? What is it about yourself that you'd like your partner to get around?

    Btw, this isn't a slight against y'all. This is a concept I've heard of from more than one of you though. I'm curious to see if there's anything to it.

    Thanks,
    --Fuzzy
    BS = facade.
    At least in my case.
    I try to keep my nicer qualities on the surface, or at least appear normal enough to stay under the radar. If someone wants to get to know me better, I might be open to it if they make themselves open to inspection as well. And if they still like me once my veneer of sugar and niceness is gone, if they STILL like me despite all the ugly crap so neatly tucked out of view, then yay. Huggles and wubbles and all that NF-ery you'd expect from me.
    Just because I'm an INFP doesn't mean I'm emo!

  9. #49
    I drink your milkshake. Thessaly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuzzcrossed View Post
    I've often heard INFPs describing desiring a partner that gets past their "bullshit". I have an inkling as to what this is, but I'd like to hear it from you. What do you think? What is your "bullshit"? What is it about yourself that you'd like your partner to get around?

    Btw, this isn't a slight against y'all. This is a concept I've heard of from more than one of you though. I'm curious to see if there's anything to it.

    Thanks,
    --Fuzzy
    Examples of my INFP friend's bullshit.

    INFP: I'm not really into this guy that much, I'm just bored and he's fun sometimes so I don't care if he hasn't called me in a couple days.

    Me: No, you care. Maybe you don't want something serious from him, but it bothers you that this guy clearly doesn't care about your feelings and is using you too.

    INFP #2: I don't have much experience doing counseling or research so I'm not sure which to pursue. If I'm not sure which to pursue then it doesn't make sense to go after either at the moment. I'll see how I feel about it after a bit more life experience.

    Me: You're making excuses. You're afraid of making the wrong decision so you don't make any at all. Time is wasting away and instead of seriously contemplating either you sit back and think life will just hand you the answers.

    INFP #3: I'm glad to have some time off work. Instead of looking for work right away I'm going to do some soul searching and figure out what I want in life.

    Me: Okay well make sure you actually do that instead of watching the cooking channel all day long.

    *1 month later*

    Me: So what are the results of your soul searching?

    INFP#3: They were inconclusive.

    Me:

    INFP#4: I'm not going to date that guy right now because I have other things to concentrate on right now.

    Me: Not really. If you really wanted to date him you just would.

    Yeah, that's pretty much what we mean by our bullshit. INTJs are so far the only ones who have called me out on it. I think Ni helps in the bullshit detecting.
    With dreamers, pure and simple, the imagination remains a vaguely sketched inner affair. It is not embodied in any aesthetic or practical invention. Reverie is the equivalent of weak desires. Dreamers are the aboulics of the creative imagination.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by paradox fox View Post
    BS = facade.
    At least in my case.
    I try to keep my nicer qualities on the surface, or at least appear normal enough to stay under the radar. If someone wants to get to know me better, I might be open to it if they make themselves open to inspection as well. And if they still like me once my veneer of sugar and niceness is gone, if they STILL like me despite all the ugly crap so neatly tucked out of view, then yay. Huggles and wubbles and all that NF-ery you'd expect from me.
    This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

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