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  1. #21
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Oh Luna, I wish I could come give you a hug. You are very brave and the fact that you keep trying to move forward and work through everything is so awesome.

    As for anorexia-I have an INTJ friend who was anorexic. It almost destroyed her marriage. Her husband loved her, but he couldnt handle the destruction he saw her going through.

    Anorexia is a weird control issue as I understand it. When a junior in high school I spent an entire year eating only apples and diet coke and doing sit ups all the time. For some reason I thought I was fat-I am really skinny actually. I knew at the time it was really bizarre but in my mind it felt so comforting that I could control a certain aspect of my life. I developed a goal and could stick to that goal. I could check things off of a list.

    At the time many aspects of my life were out of my control or I was not doing well at them. In particular I had wanted to be a horse trainer but I was so absent minded I would leave the water running all night or foget to untie the horses. I was left feeling I was too incompatent to do the only thing I had ever dreamed of doing. The apples, oddly, gave me an aspect of life I could control in a regimented way.

    I have seen your write in other places about things I can identify and I bet other enfps may have seen at times in their lives-the negative inner voice, the self doubt. I also sometimes feel feelings of being horrifically flawed internally-like I am some sort of monster-yet none of it makes any logical sense at all. But it doesnt change how I FEEL. I feel like a horrible failure.

    I started the "how are you feeling " thread as I figured I needed to try and write down what I was feeling so I could learn to analyze and understand it-but as I did that it got easier to actually feel and understand. Once I started doing that-well none of those feelings seem that entirely weird or flawed. I dont understand why I would think/feel they were flawed or not want to shre them.

    I dont know why I feel all of these things but they seem to echo what some other enfps feel, so it makes me want to look for a theme and try and understand it. Maybe it falls under BPD but I hate that term as it is so negative-like NPD. I'd prefer to have a jungian term that explains the structure of why we do the things we do, and then propses solutions based upon those mechanisms.

    Anyways hugs for you as the whole point of all this ^^^ rambling-you arent alone, we feel a lot of the same stuff as you do. hugs.

  2. #22
    Pose! Salt n' pepper's Avatar
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    Recovering from anorexia is a long, ass process. I know. I've been there. One day you're fine, the next, relaps into bad habits, obsessive thoughts, dark patterns and no one can stop you, especially not yourself. It's the weirdest most contradictive nightmare I've ever been through, and I'm glad I got out of it alive.

    It took me about 1,5-2 years for me to actually recover. And by that I mean, getting out, finally free, without relapses and in control of my inner devil. Eventually, that voice droped off, but that took some additional time.

    It's frustrating, hard and near impossible for anybody to really help you out. It's gotta be you. Sure, you need a solid support system. It's paramount. But my will-power is what got me out, in the end. And I'm glad you are too.

    I'm sorry to hear your husband is having a hard time with this. It's to be expected. He's feeling helpless and he doesn't understand what you've been through/is going through. Make sure to communicate with him.

    Your recovery is about you, your well-being. Know that. I know it's scary to whatch a spous whatch you go through this battle. But your focus should really be on you now, and make that clear to him, he will be there for you. Everything is pretty scary right now. You're in control now, so just be brave and trust that whatever you're going through is nessecary. Baby steps.

    Also, there's gonna be a lot of hormonal and other psychical changes, which I'm sure your therapist have told you. It's not unusual to be a bit emotianlly instable. It's part of getting your life back.

    This will make you stronger.

  3. #23
    Senior Member lunalove's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by somers90 View Post
    Luna. I admire your spirit tremendously. Years ago I was suffering from an eating disoder, partially bulimic and anorexic. I had no support as I was a student then and had no money for any sort of treatment. Only a friend knew of my ailment and tried with all of his might to get me to eat more. Several dangerous episodes of constant nose bleeding, fainting spells and most significantly, a book, however, snapped me out of it.

    ((hugs)) I'm sorry you can relate! How did you ever convince yourself to eat and to heal alone? In any case, I'm grateful you're here

    I don't have a lot of helping words to offer as I believe every case and everyone is different. I will say this, from experience that you will get better day by day and the journey will only get easier, as long as you keep at it. I also believe that yes, once you come out of the eating bit (it took me 2 1/2 years to complete recover), you may have emotional swirly-whirly phases, for the lack of a better word. Stay grounded and strong and keep focus.

    It definitely helps to be pre-occupied with stuff that you love doing. For me, it was music, joining bands, playing gigs, meeting new musician friends, studying music again, learning new instruments, etc. I got better almost without any effort and at the same time, managed to remold my life around my passion and other hobbies in between instead of resorting to self-destructive tendencies. Keep happy things and happy people around you.

    Anorexia is such an isolating disease! How did you manage to be so social? I was somewhat social in the community I live in for a time even as I was starving myself. I did it for my husband. I wanted him to be happy! I don't know many people where we live outside of our old community. Unfortunately, I never clicked there and in order to remain friends, I have to follow all the religious rules that helped make me so sick! In the meantime, I am considering perhaps trying out for a play (I used to love acting). I'm nervous about it! I was never very good at blocking--and I never had too many lines to memorize! I am planning to get a book of monologues from the library to try it out as a first step. Your mention of bands and being social is further encouragement for me that I need to get out there and join society

    Good luck and all my warmest wishes to you.
    Thanks so much for sharing your story with me--it's very hopeful! I'm glad you are recovered!!

  4. #24
    Senior Member lunalove's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orobas View Post
    Oh Luna, I wish I could come give you a hug. You are very brave and the fact that you keep trying to move forward and work through everything is so awesome.

    I felt your hug from here

    As for anorexia-I have an INTJ friend who was anorexic. It almost destroyed her marriage. Her husband loved her, but he couldnt handle the destruction he saw her going through.

    It's my love for my husband and his love for me that have brought me this far. I'm SO sick of hurting him. I have had tremendous growth and self honesty in order to stop being a victim for him. I still have a ways to go! But I know that I'm gonna make it...like I have this feeling of light and love inside of me that tells me that the darkness isn't real! Make sense?

    Anorexia is a weird control issue as I understand it. When a junior in high school I spent an entire year eating only apples and diet coke and doing sit ups all the time. For some reason I thought I was fat-I am really skinny actually. I knew at the time it was really bizarre but in my mind it felt so comforting that I could control a certain aspect of my life. I developed a goal and could stick to that goal. I could check things off of a list.

    Yes! Absolutely. It's a distraction from the pain. I don't remember all that happened to me with my many perpetrators. I know enough to know there were many and that I floated up to the ceiling. I also know enough, now, to know it WAS real and it was NOT my fault. When I start wanting to run away (starve, numb out on sugar, or contemplate suicide), I tell myself it's all my brain lying to me to distract me from the pain! When I posted on these boards and journaled for 2 hours, crying the entire time, and I shared my pain publicly, I FELT the darkness. I just cried until I ran dry. And I survived it! I think that was a particularly significant step in my recovery. Now I know I can feel the feelings and survive it! That made me feel strong, independent, free, healthy...and a dozen other positive things!

    At the time many aspects of my life were out of my control or I was not doing well at them. In particular I had wanted to be a horse trainer but I was so absent minded I would leave the water running all night or foget to untie the horses. I was left feeling I was too incompatent to do the only thing I had ever dreamed of doing. The apples, oddly, gave me an aspect of life I could control in a regimented way.

    I can relate I have also felt like I had some impedement that kept me from my dreams. Writing, acting, music, drawing....each has had its own stumbling block. Did you overcome this? How did you overcome your need for control?

    I have seen your write in other places about things I can identify and I bet other enfps may have seen at times in their lives-the negative inner voice, the self doubt. I also sometimes feel feelings of being horrifically flawed internally-like I am some sort of monster-yet none of it makes any logical sense at all. But it doesnt change how I FEEL. I feel like a horrible failure.

    Did you just call me and ENFP? I was still flirting between ENFJ and ENFP...I'm leaning towards ENFP but I'm still not sure on that? Is that negativity and inner voice thing an ENFP trait or can that be any type? Yes, that voice is very convincing...but you will never be a monster!! We spend so much time judging ourselves....listening to that inner critic...we cannot let it win! I like to use Louise Hay's affirmations, they've helped me a lot! It's nice to look myself in the eye, in the mirror, and say :I love you Luna, I really really love you!" (Of course I use my real name) Some days I do love and like myself now. None of us are flawed! My nutritionist told me at our appointment this week that I am worthy of love because I exist. I don't have to earn it! I just cried and creid. She's right of course! And it's true for you as well, Orobas (though I can think of many things that are special about you that I admire and think are beautiful as well!!)

    I started the "how are you feeling " thread as I figured I needed to try and write down what I was feeling so I could learn to analyze and understand it-but as I did that it got easier to actually feel and understand. Once I started doing that-well none of those feelings seem that entirely weird or flawed. I dont understand why I would think/feel they were flawed or not want to shre them.

    Your thread was beautiful and truly helpful and a positive place for everyone! Yes, I feel this is why it is important to share publicly for me! And to write. We ALL feel things that are dark and untrue too often. None of us are truly flawed though!! I'm so grateful you started that post...it was one of several posts that allowed me to post this post!

    I dont know why I feel all of these things but they seem to echo what some other enfps feel, so it makes me want to look for a theme and try and understand it. Maybe it falls under BPD but I hate that term as it is so negative-like NPD. I'd prefer to have a jungian term that explains the structure of why we do the things we do, and then propses solutions based upon those mechanisms.

    What is NPD? I don't like diagnoses and labels very much...but they can give others something to go on about a person (like if I say I have ADD you already know something about that and will understand why I do certain things). I had so many diagnoses and it just continued to allow me to feel like a victim and be negative "see, there is so much wrong with me." I think i do have BPD. So what? I can change it!! (I already am.) "Fear of a name increases the thing itself" Professor Dumbledore. It's just a label. So what? It doesn't make me who I am! I have some issues. Great! Let's make it work! I have more challenges than someone else....and someone else has more challenges than I do. That's ok! We can all help each other!

    Anyways hugs for you as the whole point of all this ^^^ rambling-you arent alone, we feel a lot of the same stuff as you do. hugs.
    It's soo good to know I'm not alone (However, I wish no one knew what that dark place feels like...myself included!) I'm so glad you posted this here...we're all growing together! :-) more

  5. #25
    Senior Member lunalove's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Salt n' pepper;1126879]Recovering from anorexia is a long, ass process. I know. I've been there. One day you're fine, the next, relaps into bad habits, obsessive thoughts, dark patterns and no one can stop you, especially not yourself. It's the weirdest most contradictive nightmare I've ever been through, and I'm glad I got out of it alive.

    So far, so good on the eating. It's been about 10 months or so since I admitted I have a problem (again.) The first time I got help for anorexia was in high school. I worked with a nutritionist only. She told me what weight I needed to be so she wouldn't hospitalize me. I never dealt with the emotions, just put on some weight. This time it's different! I'm almost at a healthy weight now! My nutritionist said I need 5lbs to go. I made myself some carob and agave brownies last night (no sugar, just the agave!) and I'm not going to starve myself or try to exercise it off today! (I can always tell when I feel like starving or overexercising because I start obsessing about it and I already can't wait to have my smoothie for breakfast...my recipe) I actually love eating now that I'm mostly vegan! I enjoy making my own recipes...it's a great creative outlet and I kinda think I'm a good cook I think the part of my recovery that is still vulnerable is the idea of having a woman's body and the idea of letting go of control...and being a victim. My nutritionist said these are the last to go. I am actually beginning to love being a woman! I think it's a beautiful thing! But there are moments where I lapse back into the past and wish my body were bony, etc. I talk to my inner child, remind myself "It's not me it's the OCD", journal, etc. It's definitely getting easier to fight the negativity! Can you relate to any of this?

    It took me about 1,5-2 years for me to actually recover. And by that I mean, getting out, finally free, without relapses and in control of my inner devil. Eventually, that voice droped off, but that took some additional time.

    That's great news!! I have this belief that I am going to make it....like this deep feeling that I'm going to be ok. It's good to hear that the voice DOES drop off...I'm really glad you shared that!

    It's frustrating, hard and near impossible for anybody to really help you out. It's gotta be you. Sure, you need a solid support system. It's paramount. But my will-power is what got me out, in the end. And I'm glad you are too.

    Yes, it's true. I just know that if I don't share these things "out loud" then the neagtive inner voice overtakes me. And that's dangerous! That's why I posted here! I'm glad you got out...I'm on my way

    I'm sorry to hear your husband is having a hard time with this. It's to be expected. He's feeling helpless and he doesn't understand what you've been through/is going through. Make sure to communicate with him.

    We communicate a lot. I think I just take every little criticism of his too deeply and I think it means I'm not worth loving. He's a picky guy! He's kinda rigid in his own ways. I need to just let it roll off my back It's not so easy...but I think I can do it! I just need to keep journaling and growing. And posting here When he says things like "Why is this on the counter?" instead of getting defensive or feeling attacked, I can just answer his question Or if I can't remember why it put it there, I can just say I'm not sure why I put it there. He gets upset and HE feels insecure/worried when I can't remember things I did. But I have to remember that is HIS insecurity and he can handle it. Hard to do! I am working on it...

    Your recovery is about you, your well-being. Know that. I know it's scary to whatch a spous whatch you go through this battle. But your focus should really be on you now, and make that clear to him, he will be there for you. Everything is pretty scary right now. You're in control now, so just be brave and trust that whatever you're going through is nessecary. Baby steps.

    In what ways should my focus be on me? I'm not sure I understand? (I want to understand!) :-)

    Also, there's gonna be a lot of hormonal and other psychical changes, which I'm sure your therapist have told you. It's not unusual to be a bit emotianlly instable. It's part of getting your life back.

    Yes. I have hips now I always wanted to make them go away. I have an hourglass figure! Did you know some men like that? I thought we all had to look like....boys! You know, like in the media, to be attractive. It's not true! My husband likes my body Well, he likes it now at least! He thought I looked scary before? I thought he liked the bony look. My brain deceived me! No one did explain it to me just like that...about hormanl changes. I was on birth control for over 5 years straight. When I got my 1st period 2 months ago, I cried for joy! I felt connected to every woman ever created. It was so beautiful! It was hard because I had many symptoms of menstruation...but this time around, my period is being less symptomatic. I assume that in time it will simply be something to look forward to as part of the natural cycle of being a WOMAN! For the first time in my life, my period and my womanhood are something I treasure instead of hating!

  6. #26
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    something about that last post reminded me of something I read in an interview with Tyra Banks when I was back in high school... she was talking about finally accepting her body after years of feeling like a freak and how she learned to love her curves and womanly build... and icecream

    Just coming to terms with that and APPRECIATING it should be a big step- and to learn to quit using food (or lack thereof) as a weapon against yourself- men STILL drool over Marilyn Monroe

    I KNOW that it's hard to deal with things sometimes, especially if you don't feel that you have any control at all over the situation- that hopeless feeling can cause the question "why even bother, it has more control than I do." DON'T LISTEN TO THAT! I finally got off my ass and took the best control over bipolar that a person can take and it HAS made a difference... that's what's key, not listening to the evil little voice in your head- that and working towards positive change
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  7. #27
    Pose! Salt n' pepper's Avatar
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    So far, so good on the eating. It's been about 10 months or so since I admitted I have a problem (again.) The first time I got help for anorexia was in high school. I worked with a nutritionist only. She told me what weight I needed to be so she wouldn't hospitalize me. I never dealt with the emotions, just put on some weight. This time it's different! I'm almost at a healthy weight now! My nutritionist said I need 5lbs to go. I made myself some carob and agave brownies last night (no sugar, just the agave!) and I'm not going to starve myself or try to exercise it off today! (I can always tell when I feel like starving or overexercising because I start obsessing about it and I already can't wait to have my smoothie for breakfast...my recipe) I actually love eating now that I'm mostly vegan! I enjoy making my own recipes...it's a great creative outlet and I kinda think I'm a good cook I think the part of my recovery that is still vulnerable is the idea of having a woman's body and the idea of letting go of control...and being a victim. My nutritionist said these are the last to go. I am actually beginning to love being a woman! I think it's a beautiful thing! But there are moments where I lapse back into the past and wish my body were bony, etc. I talk to my inner child, remind myself "It's not me it's the OCD", journal, etc. It's definitely getting easier to fight the negativity! Can you relate to any of this?
    I can. Especially the part about control and being OK with "being a woman". It sounds so strange now. Saying that, but it's a brutal process, letting go of being that bony person. You're almost in grief. I was, I think.

    Being in control comes naturally to me, it just manifested itself really, really bad when I was sick. Letting go of being in control of my body, my mind with regards to food and exercise, was the absolute hardest part for me. I had a really hard time with obsessions.

    But when I think about it now, really it wasn't me that was in control of me, it was that other voice, my evil twin, telling me what to do and not to do. Ironic, really. The more "you" fight to stay in control, the more you lose control.

    That's great news!! I have this belief that I am going to make it....like this deep feeling that I'm going to be ok. It's good to hear that the voice DOES drop off...I'm really glad you shared that!
    When there's a will, there's a way. You will be OK.

    I couldn't see an end to this tunnel when I was walking in it. Really couldn't imagine a life, a day, without these thoughts. It had infected my brain. My entire system. I couldn't picture a future of me, being able to focus or think about anything besides food and exercise and related things. But now, I'm having a hard time imagining being in that state of mind again. Nice, huh!

    Yes, it's true. I just know that if I don't share these things "out loud" then the neagtive inner voice overtakes me. And that's dangerous! That's why I posted here! I'm glad you got out...I'm on my way
    I don't know how you deal with things. If letting them out helps you, that's awesome. Keep doing what feels good, cause that's the right thing.

    For me, my feeling processes are turned inwards. I didn't like share my darkest thoughts and especially how I felt. Most of the time, I couldn't even express them with words, just cried - a lot. (that helped). What gave me comfort was being with happy, friendly people. Watching them, living their lives with no obsessions, free from the demons I was battling - was indeed inspiring. That really gave me a push in the right direction.

    We communicate a lot. I think I just take every little criticism of his too deeply and I think it means I'm not worth loving. He's a picky guy! He's kinda rigid in his own ways. I need to just let it roll off my back It's not so easy...but I think I can do it! I just need to keep journaling and growing. And posting here When he says things like "Why is this on the counter?" instead of getting defensive or feeling attacked, I can just answer his question Or if I can't remember why it put it there, I can just say I'm not sure why I put it there. He gets upset and HE feels insecure/worried when I can't remember things I did. But I have to remember that is HIS insecurity and he can handle it. Hard to do! I am working on it...
    I can understand the tension. Only time and long term improvement can heal that. But I relate to what you're saying; I too was incredibly sensitive to what to me, at the time, sounded like an attack. I think the body and the mind, just didn't have the energy and space, to deal. There was no "buffer".

    In what ways should my focus be on me? I'm not sure I understand? (I want to understand!) :-)
    It sounded like you were concerned how you spouse was taking all of this, and that he wasn't able to really. My message was just that you should focus your thoughts on you and getting better. I think that's gonna make him happy, too.

    Yes. I have hips now I always wanted to make them go away. I have an hourglass figure! Did you know some men like that?
    Women do too, you know As long as you're happy with yourself, that's all that matters, really. Keep up the good fight!

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