[NF] My friendships ALWAYS dissapoint me

[sketchymcsketcherson]

It might take a month or a year or three years, but in the end, something in my friendships always seems to fall through.

Scenario 1:

I get to know someone. We become pretty good friends over the course of time, then we just "drift apart" because of various reasons. This doesn't need much explanation because, in all honesty, everyone knows exactly what I'm talking about.

Scenario 2:

I get close to someone and we become good friends. I highly esteem this person at first, but then I detect little flaws in the person and become mentally critical of him or her. I try to ignore this kind of thinking, but the little voice of doubt keeps going and going. Sometimes this voice of intuition is right and something blatantly wrong happens down the road. Other times, the big dealbreaker never comes around, but I still find it hard to invest 100% of myself into such a friendship. I hate myself for it sometimes, but I can't forget flaws in people. There's just an immense sense of disappointment or betrayal and it cuts me so deep the wound never heals. No matter how hard I try to forgive and forget, the scar remains.

Scenario 3:

I get close to someone and we become good friends. However, after a time, I realize this person is of no use to me anymore. He or she fails to stimulate me mentally or in other ways. I've emptied the bottle, and nothing remains. Sometimes this situation manifests itself after a few months of friendship, when I realize I am more intelligent than the person and find him or her to be almost like a leech sucking the life out of me. Now, I realize this might sound really arrogant or heartless, but it's the truth. If I could fix these thoughts I would, but I can't. It's just the way I feel.

Scenario 1 usually happens to me in friendships where I could see myself really enjoying a relationship with said person. Many of the friends in this category have either floated away or return infrequently to communicate with me.

Scenario 2 often happens when I initially feel such a person is "stronger" or "better" than me. I'm drawn to these people because I detect some potential benefit or a possible good friendship. Many of my favorite friendships have gone this way.

Scenario 3 can happen with almost any type of friendship, but it usually starts with mutual, genuine interest from both parties.

How come so many of my friendships end up this way? Am I the only one with this problem? One thing's for sure, it's really taught me how reliable I am versus the rest of the world.

 

[toast]

How come so many of my friendships end up this way? Am I the only one with this problem? One thing's for sure, it's really taught me how reliable I am versus the rest of the world.

I think my friendships would all go this way if I was judging everyone against myself. Not trying to sound douchey & offensive but you can make sure those flaws you notice in you go away... but you can't get rid of them in other people. I get scenario 1. Usually the 'flaws' I see are things I just can't accept based on my 'value system'. I hate saying 'value system' because it seems too analytical. I just flat out think they are 'wrong', something they are doing is just 'wrong', so I move away from them until I'm not focused on the 'flaw' anymore... and they usually just drift away & come back sporadically. The 'flaws' are further usually huge mistakes that the people make with their own life that make me hate empathizing with them for their own consequences again & again. I sort of need time away from them so my empathy can be genuine. It sounds like your referring to flaws that affect you personally, I'm not sure how.

What I don't have is scenario 2 & 3. I think all of my friendships stay in scenario 1 & just sort of expand & contract. We distance, then come back together again & again. Scenario 2 & 3 just sounds like you are looking to love 'people' in general. That'll never happen in my opinion. People in general, suck. A 'person', though, can usually be great. I have friends that are family. I just decided long ago that I was going to love them no matter what & they are the ones who have been there for years. I didn't put them through any trials. I just saw that they were genuinely good & I accepted them. Sure, I have my tiffs with them & have to get away sometimes, but I can be honest with them about what I see as 'flaws' & they can be honest with me. It doesn't phase us if we already know we aren't going anywhere. I think either you haven't met anyone you could just accept like that or you didn't let yourself get close enough to just do it.

I think your experience is sort of normal. I think friendships are very much like romantic relationships in that they start sparky then explode, sputter out or ease into a warm glow that lasts. I think at least one of the reasons the lasting friendship is hard to find is because it takes both people working for it or one person holding things up until the other joins them. Our society kind of directs us to value acquaintances over true bonds to keep autonomy. You might be looking for friends in a sea of people who are looking for acquaintances in the guise of 'friendship.' If that were the case it would make sense why these people aren't making you comfortable with making them aware of your opinion of them. I think if you knew someone who had flaws, but knew you saw them, it wouldn't bother you as much because the connection would still seem real.

 

[Phantonym]

Nope, you're not the only one with this "problem". My friendships used to have 3 year life spans when I actually cared about friendships that much. When I was young, innocent and naive. Now...people just come and go, nobody ever stays and I see that as something natural, things are in constant change.

I've never experienced Scenarios 2 and 3, though. Everybody has flaws and friends are not supposed to be your clowns, solely for your entertainment either.

It's interesting really what you say about yourself being reliable and others being...not reliable.

I think, in my case, I'm the one that ends up being unreliable all the time. This keeps happening over and over again for me and it has taught me that it's all about me, I have too high expectations for people and I expect them to give more than they're willing while I really don't give out much. I used to blame others when I was younger but now I just realize that I'm the one rotten to the core.

Friendships have always been weird to me. The one mistake I always make with people and friendships is that I manage to fool myself into believing that they actually care about things and me the same way I care, but they never do. I think a large part of me cares very much when people drift away and when the feelings and thoughts emerge from time to time, from friendships eons ago, I analyze and blame myself most of the time. But there's a huge part of me that just doesn't care enough to maintain the friendship or it's just a self-fulfilling prophecy because I never let people that close to me in the first place. And when I see the other party not caring either, I just let them drift away.

So, yeah, friendships and people always disappoint me. I think that's the way it is with everything, you either disappoint others yourself or end up being disappointed, that's life. But I tend to blame myself more than others. All of this probably sounds a lot bitter than I actually feel, I don't feel bitter at all, it's just how things are.

 

[Arclight]

I once read that over the course of an average lifetime, we will personally interact with around 20000 people. We will however on average, form a life-lasting bond with around 2-8 people(not including family) over the same course of our existence and that most of those bonds will be formed over the age of 25.

People change, their needs change, their values change and the roads we travel change.

You sound pretty normal to me

 

[Moiety]

I once read that over the course of an average lifetime, we will personally interact with around 20000 people. We will however on average, form a life-lasting bond with around 2-8 people(not including family) over the same course of our existence and that most of those bonds will be formed over the age of 25.

Really?

 

[Snow Turtle]

From my perspective: This is a result of perfectionism. It's a problem of those who expect way too much from other people and aren't comfortable with the idea that people are prone to making mistakes.

Scenario 1: It's upsetting but it's just natural... Most people have engaged in this action with someone in their lives.

Scenario 2 & 3: A result of expecting too much from friendship. The whole "I'm reliable but others..." just comes across not being true. It's more likely to be "I'm reliable to those I wish to be close with".

One thought that comes to mind: Rather than focusing so much on what friends can offer you, sometimes it's easier to just focus on what you can give to others since there's much more control there.

 

[Arclight]

Really?

It's what I read.. which is why I said "I once read" I have no idea if it's accurate .. But it explains that As adults we are more stable and on a more steady course and therefore it's easier to find people with the same values and such.. where as younger people also share a common course but that it changes more radically into adulthood..
For example during school .. everyone is pretty much doing the same thing and living similar lifestyles.. but it's for a much shorter period of time..once adulthood is reached and people have chosen their roads.. it's much more difficult to maintain friendships due to different jobs , different incomes, and different lifestyles.. As for adults..Think about it.. if you work with someone for 30 years then you continue to have much more in common .. we are children and youths for 18-20 years of our lives and adults until we die(average another 50-60 years) So it makes sense.

 

[Moiety]

It's what I read.. which is why I said "I once read" I have no idea if it's accurate .. But it explains that As adults we are more stable and on a more steady course and therefore it's easier to find people with the same values and such.. where as younger people also share a common course but that it changes more radically into adulthood..
For example during school .. everyone is pretty much doing the same thing and living similar lifestyles.. but it's for a much shorter period of time..once adulthood is reached and people have chosen their roads.. it's much more difficult to maintain friendships due to different jobs , different incomes, and different lifestyles.. As for adults..Think about it.. if you work with someone for 30 years then you continue to have much more in common .. we are children and youths for 18-20 years of our lives and adults until we die(average another 50-60 years) So it makes sense.

Lol, that is assuming you aren't a chaotic ENP moving all over the place till you are dead though. I was relieved there for a moment, because quite frankly, it's something I would like to believe in since I'm at a point where I feel I should be forming long lasting relationships with people that are going to be in my life for a long while...and I'm not.

 

[Phantonym]

One thought that comes to mind: Rather than focusing so much on what friends can offer you, sometimes it's easier to just focus on what you can give to others since there's much more control there.

Yes, there is more control in that. But I've also found that I end up giving, giving and giving without getting much in return. And that gets old really fast. I realize that it's again due to perfectionism.

 

[Snow Turtle]

Yes, there is more control in that. But I've also found that I end up giving, giving and giving without getting much in return. And that gets old really fast. I realize that it's again due to perfectionism.

Mmm.

Yeah. It's definitely a fine balance. You don't want to end up feeling like it's just a one-sided friendship as that just develops resentment. Might be a little unfair asking NFs who are meant to be 'idealistic' but I've found the best method is just to have little expectation and do things for others without expecting anything back.

It reminds me of my cousin. "Oh... I'll lend £100 to friends without expecting it back. If I receive it back then it's all good. If not, then I won't hold it against them." Suppose he was a good judge of character though so people usually returned back the money. But my initial look:

 

[JoSunshine]

It sounds like you are objectifying people based on their "usefulness" to you. Friendships ebb and flow and people are sometimes the needed and sometimes the needy (in a balanced relationship). The friendships that are lasting, IMO, are based on emotional connection, commitment and acceptance of each others differences (all differences are not "flaws"). Otherwise you end up treating people (and being treated) like a piece of furniture that can be disposed of when it's usefulness has passed.

 

[Phantonym]

Mmm.

Yeah. It's definitely a fine balance. You don't want to end up feeling like it's just a one-sided friendship as that just develops resentment. Might be a little unfair asking NFs who are meant to be 'idealistic' but I've found the best method is just to have little expectation and do things for others without expecting anything back.

It reminds me of my cousin. "Oh... I'll lend £100 to friends without expecting it back. If I receive it back then it's all good. If not, then I won't hold it against them." Suppose he was a good judge of character though so people usually returned back the money. But my initial look:

Yes, that's actually a good method. And it does work, but it also takes some work to get to that place where you can really feel willing to have little expectations. It's kind of liberating once you get there. I haven't really gotten there myself, yet, but I like to think that I am moving towards it. It's like accepting the best from the situation and discarding everything else that might start holding you back.

 

[disregard]

First of all, it takes two to drift apart.

Secondly, what is so reliable about maintaining friendships so long as the other person is of use to you?

Things that are truly worthwhile require effort. If you do not want to be disappointed you must push your relationships to the standards you set.

 

[Rainne]

It's important to see the good in people, not the flaws.

 

[heart]

Sometimes this situation manifests itself after a few months of friendship, when I realize I am more intelligent than the person and find him or her to be almost like a leech sucking the life out of me. Now, I realize this might sound really arrogant or heartless, but it's the truth. If I could fix these thoughts I would, but I can't. It's just the way I feel.

Is this the sole reason for friendships? Mental stimulation? If mental stimulation were the guiding force in seeking and maintaining friendships, it is not surprising then that they would fall apart eventually. The two people learn all they can about each other, they know each other's M.O., they've heard it all. They move on.

My opinion? You're avoiding emotional intimacy and the cycle won't end until you learn why.

 

[Chloe]

I understand many things from OP.

I think it's subconsciously codependency issue... searching perfection in others etc..wanting all in some relationship... though i cant even begin to understand why is more common in INFs..

 

[Coeur]

I'm going to focus most on Situation 3 because it's exactly what I'm going through now and I'll hopefully be able to help you.

My issue with my friend was this: she was my best friend, thus, I possessed the compulsion to be completly open with her. [I'm extremely all or nothing in relationships; it's hard to fragment myself around someone I'm close to.] The problem was, she /hated/ everything I was passionate about (poetry, literature, plays, music, etc). Whenever I did share these said topics with her, she had no input. At all. A "wow" or a "lol" or an "okay" perhaps, but that was it. If I invited her to one of my plays or tried to get her to read one of my poems, she would oppose it to the death, even if she knew that it was important to me. [Then, even if she did 'tolerate' it, I would recieve no input.] It was absolutely maddening and I felt extreme discontentment in our relationship.

So... I vehemently concur that intellectual stimulation is important.

1. Don't expect one friend to fulfill you completely. It's impossible. You'll always need to express different sides of yourself around different people. Make new friends and it will take a LOT of the pressure off of the other friend. But, again, I concur that it's hard to fragment yourself.
2. Find someone you have a lot in common with from the beginning. It's hard to see the importance of commanalities at the start of a relationship, but your friendship will NOT thrive without a shared passion. Find someone who is as passionate about your ideas as you are.

 

[sammy]

Timely thread. I'm going through friendship issues in a major way with two people at the moment.

I think disregard's comment about something being worth it requiring effort is very true. This is why I've chosen to point out the issues to these two friends that I considered "best/close" friends up until a month ago when their behavior changed drastically.

It's going to take a lot of conscious effort on both ends for the friendship to survive, and I've done enough with one of them. I'm waiting for results from him. With the other person, I'm going to confront her soon with my concerns for our friendship. I think both of them are worth preserving, so I'm willing to stress out about this.

Other friendships are come and go, and I like getting to that level where you can see someone after many years and pick up where you left off, but that kind of intimacy and connection cannot be developed without some effort (natural or otherwise).

I once read that over the course of an average lifetime, we will personally interact with around 20000 people. We will however on average, form a life-lasting bond with around 2-8 people(not including family) over the same course of our existence and that most of those bonds will be formed over the age of 25.

People change, their needs change, their values change and the roads we travel change.

I can see how this would be the case in many situations.

 

[Eckhart]

Hm. I am right now thinking what to answer. Apologise if my post doesn't look very structured.

I know what it means to feel disappointed by friendships, because my friendships disappointed me all too. I can certainly relate to scenario 1, because most of them went like that for me.

I cannot however relate to scenario 2 and 3. It doesn't work like that for me. Yes, I cancelled friends out of my life because they just disappointed me too often in a way that they play wrong with me and don't treat me like friendships should look like. But I did not do that for people who aren't flawless, because no one is, neither am I.

I don't even think I demand too much from a friendship. It is just, none of my so called friends seemed to treat me like any of their other friends, and I see that friendships can be very uncomplicated, yet people won't just leave you alone all the time and favour other people over you every time, if they at least take any worth in you. That they show some bit of loyalty. I cannot say that I ever had such a friendship in my life yet.

 

[yvonne]

wow... i agree with JoSunshine. you expect wayyyyy too much from friendships, if they become a problem, rather than something positive in your life.

step 1. accept your loneliness
step 2. realize that even though you are alone, you're not... everyone's alone and no one is
step 3. see where you can connect, maybe you both like sushi?
step 4. no one is perfect!
step 5. it's not the point
step 6. balance
step 7. honesty, first with yourself and then with others
step 8. concentrate on the positive
step 9. take pleasure in other people's happiness

i've always thought that positivity creates positivity. give people a chance. they're just like you, even though they aren't. lower your standards, because if you don't, you'll be lonely, depressed and paralyzed. ease it up.

listen to yourself, know that enough is enough. take care of yourself, because that's your first priority. if you're lonely, maybe get a dog?