• You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to additional post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), view blogs, respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, so please join our community today! Just click here to register. You should turn your Ad Blocker off for this site or certain features may not work properly. If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us by clicking here.

[ENFP] I wouldn't beat ENFPs with sticks. Only rainbows?

Gamine

in-game
Joined
Nov 2, 2008
Messages
810
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
3w2
That other thread got crazy, so I wanted to send some love directly to the ENFPs, the charming, gushy and delightful creatures you are! :hug:

We've likely all experienced it on either side; not knowing how deep a relationship should be following what we perceived to be a deep connection/not realizing that the other person perceived something as more significant than we did. At the end of the day, we have a difference in both communication and values. The joys of being human and flawed :jew:

To take a previous OP and reword it into a different structure:

Situation:

There are types (or just people) who love connecting with people. These connections can be created through something deeply emotional (skipping smalltalk and jumping straight into something more personal) or devastatingly intellectual (gosh, ideas are sexy, aren't they?).

Questions:

1) With these high intensity - low commitment interactions, what is really happening?

2) Is there anything morally wrong with connecting with people on a deep personal/intellectual level and not following up with a relationship of some sort? Would this be better depicted by shades of grey rather than black and white, and if so, how would it be measured?

3) How is this being perceived by the stakeholders in this situation? (The person who is seeking and creating these interactions, the person being interacted with)

4) How can we build a shared vocabulary and social construct to deal with the confusion the consequences of these missed communications create? How can someone set up boundaries to make it clear to others what they are willing and unwilling to participate in?

5) Is there value in these sudden, seemingly more personally invested, interactions? Should we condition those around us to stop engaging in them for the sake of self-protectionism?
 

Lady_X

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 27, 2008
Messages
18,235
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
784
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp

JocktheMotie

Habitual Fi LineStepper
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
8,491
One that stands out for me is number 2.

And I would seriously hope not. I'd hate to think I was obligated to force a relationship simply because of a previous interaction. I don't think there are universal standards that can apply in this instance. A great interaction could be significant in that it shows how great the potential continued experiences could be...but just as a one night stand doesn't imply an actual relationship, neither does a "one night" mental connection.


If you happen to have these miscommunications about "levels" of relationships, I think the first thing we must do is take a critical look at our own behavior first, to wonder if we're inviting this kind of attention. Maybe you happen to be flirty. Maybe you're too sarcastic and nobody takes you seriously. Look at yourself through eyes that are not your own. Examine whether there is consistency between how you think you are and how you are.

I do think there is value in these interactions. How could there not be? They're fun, exhilarating, moving. Nothing moves you without some kind of weight behind it.
 

Arclight

Permabanned
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
Messages
3,177
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
6w5
Also in relation to Number 2

I would consider that maybe the person in question is lonely or longing for some kind of deep connection.. If they meet someone who seems to get right inside them immediately .. It might seem almost magical or fated..
This of course is the problem(?) of the other person and not the ENFPs in question ..
But we should always try to be aware of the effect we are having on people.

And as Fi dom intuits.. Shouldn't it be almost obvious??
 

Moiety

New member
Joined
Aug 3, 2008
Messages
5,996
MBTI Type
ISFJ
And as Fe dom intuits.. Shouldn't it be almost obvious??

Fe dom intuits are ENFJs my friend.

And this is one confusing thread. I don't understand what the point of it is. The opening post seems to have no beginning and no end. Or maybe it's the martini talking.
 

Arclight

Permabanned
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
Messages
3,177
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
6w5
Fe dom intuits are ENFJs my friend.

And this is one confusing thread. I don't understand what the point of it is. The opening post seems to have no beginning and no end. Or maybe it's the martini talking.

Thanks I will change it to Fi and my point still stands..
I know what I meant:doh:
 

Gamine

in-game
Joined
Nov 2, 2008
Messages
810
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
3w2
For SYTPG, my goals with this thread are the following:
- Take an experience that people share and beyond the point of consequences, and find a structure to examine it with
- Find a shared vocabulary for people to use
- Understand the perspectives of others

If people are being charged with having to be responsible for their actions, why shouldn't there be accountability welcome from all sides to share their own views on short term personal experiences where the parties have differing views of significance?

Or maybe my Ti vomited. Not sure.
 

Moiety

New member
Joined
Aug 3, 2008
Messages
5,996
MBTI Type
ISFJ
Gamine said:
If people are being charged with having to be responsible for their actions, why shouldn't there be accountability welcome from all sides to share their own views on short term personal experiences where the parties have differing views of significance?


Okay that first part I got, but this...is anyone arguing responsibility in the first place? And could you be more concrete? Could you explain what you meant in this quote like I were a 10 year old please?
 

Gamine

in-game
Joined
Nov 2, 2008
Messages
810
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
3w2
Okay that first part I got, but this...is anyone arguing responsibility in the first place? And could you be more concrete? Could you explain what you meant in this quote like I were a 10 year old please?

I'm not that much of an ass, but I'll try my best, let me know if it works! :)

- There are stereotypes of types being attention seeking, friend whoring, manipulating narcissists. These are frequently directed at dom users of NeFi, Fi or Fe.
- People have described in different threads on this forum different sides of what seems to be the same kind of interaction: Person A (who naturally enjoys connecting to others) meets Person B, they connect on a deep level in a short amount of time, Person A leaves to have other adventures, Person B thinks they have been used as their importance to Person A did not match their earlier perceptions.
- Some people in Person A's position claim it is their responsibility to monitor how they socialize with others to make their meanings clear, other people don't see the harm in having those no-strings-attached connections.
- Some people in Person B's position can understand the meaning behind it and shrug it off, some claim it is their responsibility to have good communication with their own Person A to clear up expectations, while others claim Person A to be a manipulative jerk.

My view on this is, the majority of these connections are not being sought with the cruel intentions of hurting others or making them feel unwanted or undesired for further more sustained interaction, as that violates the intensity and often emotional intimacy that is the foundation of these interactions in the first place. (WHOA LONG SENTENCE ATTACK). So, I want to have a better fundemental understanding on how we can communicate our intentions clearer so no one feels like poop.

How's that?
 

ReadingRainbows

Cat Wench
Joined
Jan 28, 2009
Messages
1,885
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Enneagram
6w7
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
That other thread got crazy, so I wanted to send some love directly to the ENFPs, the charming, gushy and delightful creatures you are! :hug:

We've likely all experienced it on either side; not knowing how deep a relationship should be following what we perceived to be a deep connection/not realizing that the other person perceived something as more significant than we did. At the end of the day, we have a difference in both communication and values. The joys of being human and flawed :jew:

To take a previous OP and reword it into a different structure:

Situation:

There are types (or just people) who love connecting with people. These connections can be created through something deeply emotional (skipping smalltalk and jumping straight into something more personal) or devastatingly intellectual (gosh, ideas are sexy, aren't they?).

Questions:

1) With these high intensity - low commitment interactions, what is really happening?

2) Is there anything morally wrong with connecting with people on a deep personal/intellectual level and not following up with a relationship of some sort? Would this be better depicted by shades of grey rather than black and white, and if so, how would it be measured?

3) How is this being perceived by the stakeholders in this situation? (The person who is seeking and creating these interactions, the person being interacted with)

4) How can we build a shared vocabulary and social construct to deal with the confusion the consequences of these missed communications create? How can someone set up boundaries to make it clear to others what they are willing and unwilling to participate in?

5) Is there value in these sudden, seemingly more personally invested, interactions? Should we condition those around us to stop engaging in them for the sake of self-protectionism?

Why me!!!! :O
 

Moiety

New member
Joined
Aug 3, 2008
Messages
5,996
MBTI Type
ISFJ
Perfect thanks :)

Well maybe it's just me (I'm an ENFP in theory btw) but I never really had this problem I think. Maybe because I'm kinda standoffish even in my way of being friendly. Actually I just thought about it and guidy...I think people just really get the idea that I'm a fiercely independent person when they first meet me, for the most part.

I think this is akin with that "flirting problem" some ENFPs seem to have that I just don't. It's the actual interaction style. I'm not giddy about meeting someone for the first time. I can be interested, but I won't be all happy and smiley because I find it forced. I mean...I just don't know this person. For all I know he's a rapist who likes boys.

But my advice to people A who have this problem is to simply change nothing. What exactly constitutes "leaving" anyway...therein lies the answer. Because people get I'm independent they don't even dare assume I owe them anything.


EDIT:

Actually people A shouldn't change anything PROVIDED they are always honest with the other person, and don't fake niceness or closeness or interest in any way. If you find yourself being nice to someone when you are having a nice day out of obligation or something...just stop.
 

Esoteric Wench

Professional Trickster
Joined
Dec 20, 2009
Messages
945
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
7w8
That other thread got crazy, so I wanted to send some love directly to the ENFPs, the charming, gushy and delightful creatures you are! :hug:

We've likely all experienced it on either side; not knowing how deep a relationship should be following what we perceived to be a deep connection/not realizing that the other person perceived something as more significant than we did. At the end of the day, we have a difference in both communication and values. The joys of being human and flawed :jew:

To take a previous OP and reword it into a different structure:

Situation:

There are types (or just people) who love connecting with people. These connections can be created through something deeply emotional (skipping smalltalk and jumping straight into something more personal) or devastatingly intellectual (gosh, ideas are sexy, aren't they?).

Questions:

1) With these high intensity - low commitment interactions, what is really happening?

2) Is there anything morally wrong with connecting with people on a deep personal/intellectual level and not following up with a relationship of some sort? Would this be better depicted by shades of grey rather than black and white, and if so, how would it be measured?

3) How is this being perceived by the stakeholders in this situation? (The person who is seeking and creating these interactions, the person being interacted with)

4) How can we build a shared vocabulary and social construct to deal with the confusion the consequences of these missed communications create? How can someone set up boundaries to make it clear to others what they are willing and unwilling to participate in?

5) Is there value in these sudden, seemingly more personally invested, interactions? Should we condition those around us to stop engaging in them for the sake of self-protectionism?

Damn you ROUX! You said it sooo much better than I did in my OP in the other thread. I was tired and didn't feel like taking the time to work out my thoughts more. After reading your OP in this thread, I've gotta tell you that you hit the nail on the head.

And, I very much appreciate your kind words about ENFPs. Charming, gushy and delightful. Great description. If I can live up to these attributes, I've done very well indeed.

:smile:
 

Gamine

in-game
Joined
Nov 2, 2008
Messages
810
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
3w2
I think this is akin with that "flirting problem" some ENFPs seem to have that I just don't. It's the actual interaction style. I'm not giddy about meeting someone for the first time. I can be interested, but I won't be all happy and smiley because I find it forced. I mean...I just don't know this person. For all I know he's a rapist who likes boys.

Actually people A shouldn't change anything PROVIDED they are always honest with the other person, and don't fake niceness or closeness or interest in any way. If you find yourself being nice to someone when you are having a nice day out of obligation or something...just stop.

I'm liking the thought processes in the bolded parts.

yay! I will get those enfps!!!

How would a Rainbow attack ENFPs?

rainbow_rising.jpg


Damn you ROUX!

:smile:

No worries my friend, that's what this place is for right? Creating bridges of understanding, not being arses to each other. I just hope some people from that thread will come play in here as well, with things being reordered. Glad I understood what you meant!! :hi:
 

nynesneg

New member
Joined
Oct 18, 2009
Messages
357
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Enneagram
3w2
Here's a thought provoking question to add to the mix for all you ENFxs...

As you become more aware of this innate longing you have to connect with people on a deep level... do you ever feel guilty, or second guess your motives?

Example. I naturally can foster a conversation to connect with just about anybody, and they feel understood... I just love hearing different perspectives on life! As well as healing people, feeling close to them, and catching a glimpse of their soul if I'm extremely privileged. However sometimes I wonder if I'm connecting with them because I so thoroughly enjoy the experience - not necessarily the person themselves, even though they are very special as well.

So I try to keep very aware of my motives...
 

Malkavia

New member
Joined
Dec 2, 2009
Messages
289
MBTI Type
ENXP
Enneagram
3w4
I completely enjoy the experience and I admit that to myself. Do I see anything wrong with that? Not really. The person feels understand, can vent, maybe gain self-confidence and I am able to do what i enjoy doing. Its a mutualistic relationship.

What I feel bad about is how hypocritical I am about it. People open up to me all the time, but they rarely see the inside of my heart and soul. I am too afraid that they will find it weird or way too intense and only a couple of people in my life have reached that point. Do I find something wrong with that? Kind of. Am I doing anything about it? No.

This post may come off a bit rough so sorry for not sugar coating it, however, I think it will be easier for us to understand why we do things if we can just put it all out there without worrying about being blown to bits and this thread seems very positive so far. :)
 

uumlau

Happy Dancer
Joined
Feb 9, 2010
Messages
5,517
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
953
Instinctual Variant
sp/so
Also in relation to Number 2

I would consider that maybe the person in question is lonely or longing for some kind of deep connection.. If they meet someone who seems to get right inside them immediately .. It might seem almost magical or fated..
This of course is the problem(?) of the other person and not the ENFPs in question ..
But we should always try to be aware of the effect we are having on people.

And as Fi dom intuits.. Shouldn't it be almost obvious??

^^^ This.

As I've become more social, my whole Fi side has become more robust w/r to the emotional ups and downs of meeting people. It's very easy for someone who has been lonely to latch onto the first person who comes along and makes a difference in one's life.

In the case of the ENFP being really friendly, it isn't the ENFP's fault, it's just a different mode of operation.

Especially in the dancing world, one way it was described to me is that dancers just naturally flirt more than most people. It's just how it is. It isn't wrong, it's just part of the culture. Once it's clear that "just flirting" isn't "really flirting" it all makes sense. It's a way to have fun, and express affection, without having to deal with the problems of a "wink and a smile" being interpreted as its being time to "put a ring on it." Also, once that's clear, it's a way to be friendly with many people, and get the feel of many people, without having to get serious.

And once that's clear, it's really quite fulfilling (in a shallow way) to have the ladies squeal with delight when I ask them to dance. ;)

We express appreciation for each other without devoting ourselves to each other. I think this is a good thing.


[I am an INTJ, and I approve this message.]
 

Moiety

New member
Joined
Aug 3, 2008
Messages
5,996
MBTI Type
ISFJ
^I don't personally. It's not only shallow but fake. Flirting...will never understand it really.
 
Top