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  1. #131
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    You know, what about an INFJ male from a dying native race? That's like, 1% of 5 people. The world is doomed. Guess the INTJs will have to take up the slack.
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    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
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    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

  2. #132
    Senior Member copperfish17's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ExAstrisSpes View Post
    Once you break the trust, it's all over, at least for me. Seriously, you get one shot, and once you screw it up, no more ENFJ for you! Once I feel like I can't trust someone, or if they've crapped on me one-too-many-times, they get moved to a circle of people who I will be polite to but won't let close to me.
    Eep. That's quite scary. One-too-many-times... Is it really possible to find someone who will never hurt you/break your trust? Not even ONCE?

    (I'm just musing here... no hard feelings. )

    Which makes me wonder... What does it take for one to break your trust? I'm assuming the standards must be high(er than average), since you're only giving everyone one single chance.

    One thing I have noticed in my romantic relationships with INTPs is that they don't seem to need/require a lot of contact. So a week goes by (an eternity to an ENFJ), and I'm left wondering how I stand in the relationship. I *know* that everything is OK, but I do feel insecure in not having some sort of "check up", if that makes any sense. This could just be me though. But I think a surprise text/phone call/e-mail would really let your ENFJ know you care.
    My relationship with the ENFJ in my life isn't a romantic one (we're both ladies and we are, more or less, friends). Either way, I recognize that problem in our relationship too... because I admittedly don't talk to the ENFJ in my life that often (I do see her every day though; I guess you could say we work at the same place). She doesn't appear to take it hard, so I've always been assuming that it's alright to leave her to herself every now and then... especially because she's surrounded by people who like her and care about her.

    I do make conscious efforts to remind her that I care about her. Just a couple of days ago I sent her a short email telling her how special she was to me. The only thing that's unnerving about our relationship IMO is that while she tells me that I mean a lot to her, she rarely tries to express (the extent of) her feelings for me. Which is why I always have to question myself whether I really matter to her or not.

    Any thoughts on this matter?
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    The worst mistake people make in political arguments is assuming that the other side is not trying to do the right thing. This simple oversight makes productive conversation nearly impossible.

  3. #133
    Senior Member ExAstrisSpes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by copperfish17 View Post
    Eep. That's quite scary. One-too-many-times... Is it really possible to find someone who will never hurt you/break your trust? Not even ONCE?

    (I'm just musing here... no hard feelings. )

    Which makes me wonder... What does it take for one to break your trust? I'm assuming the standards must be high(er than average), since you're only giving everyone one single chance.
    Hmm. I was trying to be a bit teasing but I guess my tone didn't come off right. Here are some examples.

    One work friendship I've distanced myself from lately is a women who is recently engaged. She's asked me to go wedding dress shopping with her (both times at the last minute), which I've done willingly even though she's said I'm not invited to her wedding (destination wedding with family only). She bugged me for weeks to set up a double date with this INTP I recently met, and then flaked on it at the last minute. She said that we could try for the following week, but didn't make plans. She had a temporary assignment at a different facility 30 miles away, so I figured while she was doing that she would probably be too tired to hang out or do girl's night (which we've done several times over the summer). So I didn't contact her when she was working at this different facility. When she gets back, she doesn't tell me and doesn't talk to me for two weeks and then asks me if there's something wrong? Then when I try to set up plans to go to lunch with her she always has some excuse for why she doesn't want to go.

    One guy I used to date knew I was looking for a new place, and suggested to me that a friend of his in his research lab was looking for a new roommate. This move enabled me to live closer to him, but pretty much doubled my commuting time (even though it was much cheaper). The move didn't go well, the roommate and I didn't mesh well either. He dumped me three weeks later (because of an argument I had with the roommate) and I ended up moving closer to work the next month. I don't talk to him anymore.

    Another guy I used to date used me to move closer to his work (basically I let him move in 'temporarily' and then he didn't tell me when he found a new place), then dumped me. We were involved in a gaming group together, and I got pushed out of the gaming group after the dumping. A woman who I introduced to the group (who I would hang out with regularly - at least twice a month) let the friendship fall apart and eventually moved across the country. She let a year go by without talking to me and then when she decided she could use me for a security reference she e-mailed me to ask. This was after multiple attempts on my part to call, text, e-mail, etc. otherwise ask how she was doing after her move.

    Another guy I had a "friends-with-benefits" relationship with was consistently flaky; would set up dates and cancel them at the last minute multiple times before I finally called the whole thing off.

    One INTP I dated and I parted on what I thought were good terms. I found out shortly after the breakup that he hid a significant portion of his life from me. When I asked him about it he said that not only was he never going to tell me, but that he thought I knew about it anyway. This particular INTP always made a big deal about being "self-aware" and was into learning about human consciousness and taking care of "his half of the relationship".

    I put up with a lot of crap before I write someone off. I know a lot of it is *my* fault because I put up with it, but it's not like they do one minor thing that pisses me off and I say I'm through. If I don't feel someone values me in their life I don't stick around.

    Quote Originally Posted by copperfish17 View Post

    My relationship with the ENFJ in my life isn't a romantic one (we're both ladies and we are, more or less, friends). Either way, I recognize that problem in our relationship too... because I admittedly don't talk to the ENFJ in my life that often (I do see her every day though; I guess you could say we work at the same place). She doesn't appear to take it hard, so I've always been assuming that it's alright to leave her to herself every now and then... especially because she's surrounded by people who like her and care about her.

    I do make conscious efforts to remind her that I care about her. Just a couple of days ago I sent her a short email telling her how special she was to me. The only thing that's unnerving about our relationship IMO is that while she tells me that I mean a lot to her, she rarely tries to express (the extent of) her feelings for me. Which is why I always have to question myself whether I really matter to her or not.

    Any thoughts on this matter?
    Words from an ENFJ aren't just lip service. If she said that you mean a lot to her, your friendship does matter to her. What kind of expression do you want from her? Maybe she feels that her affectionate bubbly self would be off-putting to you?

    It's not that hard to maintain a friendship with an ENFJ. Meeting for coffee or lunch with greater frequency than once a month will suffice, although for me I'd like to meet with my closest friends once a week. If she feels you don't have the time for her she may or may not try to revive the friendship, and if she's felt rejected multiple times she won't try at all.
    Likes xXMariahXx liked this post

  4. #134
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    About Bullet point 20 that had me so much up in arms..

    Some self pondering as well as bouncing the idea off another NFJ has caused me to consider this..

    There might be something to point 20 after all.. This is not to say that NFJ's love is better than anyone else's..

    I look around this site. I think about my own life, and something starts to jump out at me.

    NFJs leave people devastated after a break up.

    All the threads and posts about ENFJs and INFJs and people seeking understanding and even comfort.
    So much confusion and a total feeling that some part of you is lost without this other person's love in your life anymore.

    I have been on both sides of it.. I have seen the devastation I have caused others by retracting my love and I have lived the devastation of having that love retracted from myself.

    Certainly an interesting perspective.. and a little unsettling.

  5. #135
    Senior Member ItsAGuy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by copperfish17 View Post
    Eep. That's quite scary. One-too-many-times... Is it really possible to find someone who will never hurt you/break your trust? Not even ONCE?
    It's not possible to find someone who'll never have a bad day or make a mistake... it is possible to find someone who'll have bad days and make mistakes in regards to minor things like forgetting an appointment or wrecking the car or spilling the milk... but won't ever cheat or do anything intentionally to hurt you. And as long as it's not selfish/intentional, it can be resolved. At that point it's up to both parties to be understanding, conceding, and forgiving.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  6. #136
    Senior Member ItsAGuy's Avatar
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    As an INFJ, I could have been satisfied if #20 simply said 'more than' instead of 'as much.' INFJs do love very deeply, but I don't think I need a monopoly on that. =)
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  7. #137
    Senior Member tortoise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ItsAGuy View Post
    It's not possible to find someone who'll never have a bad day or make a mistake... it is possible to find someone who'll have bad days and make mistakes in regards to minor things like forgetting an appointment or wrecking the car or spilling the milk... but won't ever cheat or do anything intentionally to hurt you. And as long as it's not selfish/intentional, it can be resolved. At that point it's up to both parties to be understanding, conceding, and forgiving.
    My INFJ ex would never ever have cheated on me or lied -- she is very honest. However, she could not handle people making unintentional mistakes and would come down hard on the people close to her for the smallest things.

  8. #138
    Member xXMariahXx's Avatar
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    Dear INTP, ^^

    It all depends on the individual's.. individuality - as no two E/INFJ's are the same. An important thing to take into consideration is the love language of the E/INFJ. I highly recommend reading the book, "The 5 Love Languages" by Gary D. Chapman.

    I can only give you my personal answer to your questions, as an ENFJ. And, I must inform you that I have Borderline Personality Disorder, so it's possible for that to affect some of my responses.

    Quote Originally Posted by copperfish17 View Post
    How can I show an E/INFJ that I care about/love him/her?
    I feel most loved when someone spends time with me one-on-one, caring to know about me and understand me (takes time to ask questions/genuinely listen). I also feel loved if the person shares the depth of themself as well. I want to be known but I also want to know. If someone opens up to me to share something personal, I feel trusted, therefore worthy, therefore loved. My primary love language is "quality time," so I can't be sure that this is a trait of ENFJ's in general.

    Quote Originally Posted by copperfish17 View Post
    How much verbal/non-verbal affection do E/INFJ's want/need?
    I feel loved when someone voices to me words of affirmation or approval. I think verbal affection is very important to an ENFJ, especially a fairly unhealthy one like me. If I'm not verbally affirmed, my mind will tend to gravitate to negative beliefs about how I'm perceived by others. ENFJ's care a lot about people and also care how they're received by people. It's important to them to feel liked. Your verbal affirmation reassures them that they are liked and that all is well interpersonally with you. As far as the amount needed of verbal affirmation/affection, a little can go quite a way for me, every now and then is fine. It's the quality time that I need on a consistent basis. I believe it all comes down to the person's primary love language. Figure that out, and you're golden. And as far as non-verbal affection, again, I think it goes back to finding out which love language(s) a person prefers.

    Quote Originally Posted by copperfish17 View Post
    How can you tell if an E/INFJ likes you?
    As a sexual/social ENFJ, if I like someone as a person, my attention will be focused in on them in total intrigue. I'm likely to try to engage them in some way. I might feel preoccupied with them liking me back, so may not be my true self at first. Likely to be more of what I think they'd want me to be.

    If I like someone in a romantic way, I'm usually shy and nervous, behave more demurely than my true self, might attempt to impress them if given the opportunity, and may find myself engaging in subtle flirting.

    I hope this post helps!

    P.S. I love you INTP's. We're a mystery to each other.
    Enneagram 4dw 1w2 5w4 sx/so {The Researcher}
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    ..to proclaim freedom for the captives
    and release from darkness for the prisoners..
    ..to bestow on them a crown of beauty instead of ashes..
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