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  1. #211
    Allergic to Mornings ergophobe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Happy Puppy View Post
    Yup this all sounds correct-and yes I function like wrt to personal situations as well typically.
    1) some emo pain
    2) shock and withdraw-this actually is numb-no pain, no feeling, no need to interact. This is an Fe shadow function used like the INFJs dorrslam someone. A day here.
    3) several days spent cycling through Fi pain/Te rationalization of the event and an understanding of where the event was Ne-ed into.
    4) Forgiveness or acknowldgement of my error, typically accompanied by distance. Mostly the person never knows there was an issue. Thi scan turn into a doorslam.

    Fe users are more like this-nonconfrontational. they have many layers of withdraw-where an ENFP goes dark-no contact.
    The only difference in my case is that I won't do the INFJ processing just by myself (process-forgive-not forget and eventually blow up). I work hard for that not to happen. When I mean withdrawal, I mean making it clear to the person I don't want contact and why in the kindest way possible (given personal anger/frustration/whatever). I don't mean temporary withdrawal to process and then just forget about what happened. I will let the person know.

    In my case, in important relationships like the one with family, particularly my sibling, I'll withdraw, clearly stating that I can't talk about *whatever* right now but I want to talk about it soon, process but will always come back to talk and take reponsibility for my end and ask the same of the sibling. Yes, messy, emotional conversations are a part of regular programming here. I think the difference here is, Fi always plays a strong role in restricting Te from going into bitchslap mode. Seeing the relationship as important to preserve and the people as important to protect engages Fi and keeps Te in check. Edit: You already covered this in your post on the 'Jesus moments'.

    Do you ever emo spew-the outpouring of Fi that amar and marm both mention? Did you do this when young? on another thread Q cited it in an esfp and I was rather condemnatory-typically I have very little sympathy for emo displays and scorn this behavior in the workplace.
    Less now and yes when much, much younger when detachment was difficult and all of life was a bubbling cauldron of deeply felt emotions (read angst ). Thankfully, maturity and a natural development of control over emotions where they are easier to identify, categorize and somewhat pliable help. Emo displays just seem misplaced in the workplace

    I have the same impatience for Fi emo displays as I do for Fe-inspired passive agressive behavior. Both are equally harmful. I agree, an evironment of physical/emotional stress is a strong trigger. Brown stuff has to be hitting the fan for an emo display to be triggered. Even then, it will only happen in the safe space of home around a select few. Without that, as with most people, it's much easier to dial it down and talk through things rationally.

  2. #212
    Allergic to Mornings ergophobe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    There's no "bitchslap". We just end you at that point.
    That explains the large number of ENTPS populating our prison system

  3. #213
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EnFpFer View Post
    ENTP guy and I were in our very early 20's and had one of those weird "not just friends" non-relationships. He'd told a co-worker of ours, a friend of his, some stuff that I didn't approve of because they were things that I didn't say. So I confronted him about it to set the record straight and he roared at me in turn. I tried to calm him down because he seemed enraged enough to hit me, and I guess both of us knew that the whole thing had come to a head. I planned to never speak to him again, but he initiated contact after he started dating his current wife(ISFJ), so I decided to be somewhat polite to him before I quit my job and went elsewhere. He contacted me again last year, married to the ISFJ and with three kids. Somehow the whole thing came up again, to which he tells me that he was in love with me and apparently my confrontation was read as a rejection, which was unexpected, and resulted in the madness.
    yeah, that's odd-typically the EXTPs withdraw under stress-Fe. But many ENTPs will present an INTJ shadow in youth-with a strong Te component-kinda like ENFPs can tap into an Fe shadow.

    My ENTP says that when that Te cord gets pulled-if pulled hard enough it feels enraged-but that was only when she was young-under 20. But n=1 so I dunno.

  4. #214
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Over the next few weeks I want to post a few more threads that dive in and out of this topic.

    There are some really interesting issues to address here. Look I'll spend hours analyzing them for you. Picking them apart, line by line, details, pieces, patterns. I'll define social theories, build some pretty awesome ideas-many of which likely have some basis in reality.

    Pretty good ideas for the most part and some I think quite legit. The ideas might even have some good social implications wrt to why enfps behave this way and how we can learn to move past some of this innate behavior, as it isnt productive.

    I'll think and analyze so I dont have to feel.

    That is how Happy Puppy rolls. Think, think, think, so I never have to face the feelings. The second the emo rises, I begin to hyper analyze the entire situation. Te blocks Fi. Think so you dont have to feel.

    I'll analyze endlessly so I dont have to face that I was a monster to someone who had been a good friend. They hurt me out of confusion and I lashed at them horrifically in pain. It was a real fucked up and cruel thing to do.

    I can honestly say i have never been that cruel to another person. It wasnt planned or anticipated. It was a massive, horrifying visceral response intended to badly hurt another person. 3.5 minutes of pure horrifying evil rage. Afterwords I just stared in shock then started analyzing. It's all I know how to do. Logic quells feeling.

    Typically I always withdraw. I dont fight, I dont have to. I never let anyone touch Fi. Ever. I can think circles around most ENFPs, because I never stop and feel. I am the quarterback of ENFP defensive mechanisms. You name it, I can do it.

    Mostly I just keep on thinking, moving onto the next new thought, the next rock on the beach to pick up and find beautiful patterns underneath. Just keep running, the Ne mantra. Just keep thinking-the Te mantra.

    Yeah, until that puny little Fi catches up and goes, my god,I hurt another person by losing control of my own emotional response. By lacking willpower, strength and courage to face and handle my own emotions I lashed out nightmarishly at another person.

    That makes me a fucking monster because I dont just get a little bitchy and throw something like the other ENFPs do. If I lash out like this-which I have never done before- I do so in a rage with such focus and intensity that I can inflict horrible damage to another person. NeTe with no Fi is a monster. The cause does not justify the action.

    Today I cant feel it. Other days I will feel it. terribly.

    NeTeFi-in Solitude lies Mercy.

  5. #215
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ergophobe View Post
    That explains the large number of ENTPS populating our prison system
    No joke there. The prison population is most likely wildly disproportionately ExTP.

  6. #216
    Senior Member alexx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little Linguist View Post
    You know what is the worst?

    You're doing a Te-bitch-slap, and some fucker laughs at you because you are just too darned 'cute' or 'nice' to be that 'mean,' so they think you look 'cute' at best and 'ridiculous' at worst.

    GAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


    Been there.

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  7. #217
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    I am rather drunk in breda. Its a nice town. I envy their sidewalk cafes. Enfps are like big eyed fuzzy bunnies. We look so cute and helpless. We are kinda like weird little pokemons that are all fluffy on the inside but if you shake us a little we explode . Or maybe like that monster in Alien that spurts out of the ladies chest to kill you. Yeah, we kinda seem to have that.

    And its all instinct. Its all authentic. we just go nuts. Then we stare around at the carnage.
    We may be the ultimate bezerkers.

    Imagine coming home to find you rottweiler missing and you cute big eyed bunny covered in blood with big bunny eyes just staring. Little ears all flopped down. What just happened?

    Te thinks there is some sort of social balancing thing going on here but yeah I need to do some fi-ing, so um, uh okay. Te does suggest enfps need proper calibration. Improperly calibrated explosive devices equals bad.

    My friend did the emotional equivelant of changing lanes without a blinker. This precipitated a response on part equivelant to dropping a 40 megaton nuclear bomb on him. I appear to be improperly calibrated.

    Strangely-all instinctual-horrific yet authentic, yet precise in it's destructive intent. All subconscious. Pure reactivity that leads to horrifying consequences. Wtf?

  8. #218
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Another thought. In the midst of the bezerker attack we can hurl insults of cutting agony.

    How do we know what to say? How do we know how to hurt others so much? I don't know. I called my friend a stalker. That was so wrong, so cruel, so evil-so incorrect. Yet it was so natural to say. Are we designed to maintain inventories of words just to destroy others with them? I dunno.

    My friend is not a stalker at all. That was nightmarish of me to say. My friend was an intj-all of whom seem to want to take care of space cadet, bunny eyed, poorly calibrated bezerker enfps. He may qualify as having an OCD wrt to trying to keep enfps out of stupidity, but he was never a stalker. It was how he showed he cared.

    Why/how/what makes hurting others so easy in this mode? How can it be built into my brain to do so, easily? I don't know. The idea of hurting another is so wrong to me, yet even under slight pressure I became an entity of destruction.

    I can rationalize, but no. I think the real lesson is to be learned in the mirrored pain of the destructive aftermath sowed.

  9. #219
    Happy Dancer uumlau's Avatar
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    @Happy Puppy:

    You're just a vorpal bunny, is all.

    And INTJs have Holy Hand Grenades.

    And know how to count to three.

  10. #220
    Senior Member alexx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Happy Puppy View Post
    An entp and I were discussing this the other day-intent and how it is involved in forgiveness. We split opinions. From my perspective almost anything is forgivable if there was no ill intent. I apologize, address systematically the issue,then we start with a clean slate with lessons learned.
    Same here.

    89% Extroverted ~ 68% Intuition ~ 84% Feeling ~ 89% Perceiving
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