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  1. #21
    Vaguely Precise Seymour's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    Actually that makes me wonder...I have an ESFJ at work who, whenever I make a mistake or something changes in the routine, will leave me written instructions step by step on what needs to be done that day, including the stuff i've been doing forever. And, she'll call me to check that 'everything went ok'. Drives me mental, coz it makes me feel like a 5-year old, and I sometimes wonder if she's patronizing me on purpose but this thread kinda sheds new light on that...
    That can totally be my reaction, too. I feel like saying "so do you think I'm stupid, or just incompetent?" And then hopefully some type-awareness kicks in and I find some understanding and patience.

    Sometimes, though, it can become a downward spiral in which the sensor gets more detailed and explicit (because clearly they didn't go into enough explicit detail the first time, hence your mistake), and the intuitive gets more exasperated and less likely to take in information (because clearly the sensor thinks you are an idiot). It's not pretty.

  2. #22
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    LL, I don't know your culture, so when you say "school," do you mean adults, or else kids in middle/high school? (i.e., grades 6-12 here in the US)?

    This behavior you describe is not just an S vs. N thing, I see it regularly just with kids in general. Two of my kids are N and they STILL do this all the time. Lots of kids of any type still need things spelled out to them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seymour View Post
    Sometimes, though, it can downward spiral in which the sensor gets more detailed and explicit (because clearly they didn't go into enough explicit detail the first time, hence your mistake), and the intuitive gets more exasperated and less likely to take in information (because clearly the sensor thinks you are an idiot). It's not pretty.


    Been there.
    Done that.
    Still have the scars.
    (and the jail time).

    ...uh, j/k.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  3. #23
    Professional Trickster Esoteric Wench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Yay, another "N hates living in S space" thread!
    I love it!

    I think the communication gap is worse for INFJs / INTJs / ENFPs / ENTPs who have dominant Intuition (be it extraverted or introverted). Likewise, ESFPs, ESTPs, ISFJs, and ISTJs have dominant Sensing. My experience is that these types are bothered most by my N-ness. (I don't think I need to mention that the way ISFJs/ISTJs drive ENFPs/ENTPs nuts is legendary in MBTI forums.)

    While dealing with Ss does sometimes drive me nuts, I've come to appreciate the limits of my N-ness. Sometimes I don't see details that my S friends do. Sometimes I miss this moment because I'm thinking about the future or past. I do jump around in my conversations and am completely comfortable blurting out random thoughts as they occur to me. This one really drives Ss nuts, btw.

    I feel like I'm finally understanding how balance in using our cognitive functions is very important. I begrudgingly admit that I do need to strengthen my S muscles a bit. (Even though I still feel very lucky being an N.)

  4. #24
    Striving for balance Little Linguist's Avatar
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    Oh, so am I. Once you know how to deal with various groups, it's all good. It's just kind of frustrating when you don't know WHY the shit ain't happening. And you think, "God <beepety beep>. What the <bbbbbbbbeeeeeeeeeeeeepppp> is going on here and why the <beeeeep> don't they get it?"

    Once you modify your behavior and everything is cool beans, it's all good.

    Nowadays, I'm experienced enough in teaching that I have something for everyone, and it works brilliantly.

    In fact, I never had trouble with higher-level students or professionals. Part of the problem also occurs when concrete-oriented people are lazy and don't give a rat's fat behind, and then you have to boil it down for them to the point where they can't act like a dumb rat.

    Smart Ss (and yeah, there are a hell of a lot of them) are freaking awesome because you LEARN so MUCH from them. Yet they have this down-to-earth attitude that is so freaking cool.

    Bottom line: I find it more difficult dealing with freaking STUPID, LAZY people than dealing with SP or SJ or NT or NF or whatever.
    If you are interested in language, words, linguistics, or foreign languages, check out my blog and read, post, and/or share.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lauren Ashley View Post
    I don't really pay attention to the rest of the world, so I'm a-okay.
    Hahaha. Yes! Me too.

    I usually get test results around 55/45% N/S, so I mostly feel that I don't really belong to either side but I'm capable of adjusting and understanding both sides fairly well and make myself understood as well without frustration. Besides, you can only get frustrated when you let yourself get frustrated.

  6. #26
    Striving for balance Little Linguist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sky is BLUE! View Post
    Hahaha. Yes! Me too.

    I usually get test results around 55/45% N/S, so I mostly feel that I don't really belong to either side but I'm capable of adjusting and understanding both sides fairly well and make myself understood as well without frustration. Besides, you can only get frustrated when you let yourself get frustrated.
    That's awesome! Seriously.
    If you are interested in language, words, linguistics, or foreign languages, check out my blog and read, post, and/or share.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sky is BLUE! View Post
    Hahaha. Yes! Me too.

    I usually get test results around 55/45% N/S, so I mostly feel that I don't really belong to either side but I'm capable of adjusting and understanding both sides fairly well and make myself understood as well without frustration. Besides, you can only get frustrated when you let yourself get frustrated.
    This is pretty much the same for me. I'm clearly an N, but yet I generally have no problems dealing with Sensors for the most part. And like LL, I generally find stupid people of ANY type more annoying than this or that type per se.

  8. #28
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    This
    Today is part of that long-awaited future. Watch out that you don't miss it.
    Next year comes as a result of what you do today. That's the magical realisation that can be oh so elusive, especially for Ns.

    If one decides to dig ones own grave, one should at least smile about it. Or else it's a bit backwards imo.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Well, I'd rather have the other person adapt to my communication style, rather than the reverse. (I haven't had many miscommunication issues in my life, though).
    I think it's far more difficult for an S to adapt to an N than vice versa.

    Up until 1.5 years ago, I would have said the same thing about how I didn't have many miscommunication issues in my life. I'm an ENFP after all. Hell, I can talk to anybody. I worked in Marketing Communications for 15 years. I'm a freelance writer. I'm an awesome communicator.

    But I think I've learned that oftentimes while I'm having a conversation with an S and feel like there is a successful communication, there isn't. Part of this realization comes from learning how to read Ss better.

    Here's a great example: As an NF I talk a lot about Love with a capital L. This is the kind of love that the angels sing about. That you stand upon a mountaintop and proclaim to the world. That poets write about. This is love in its conceptual form. And being able to articulate ones feelings is really important for this kind of love. And, it's really important for me to connect with whomever I'm dating on this level.

    There was a time in my life that I would have said this kind of love was the only real kind of love there was. That is Real with a capital R. And, I would have been ready to tell any S that there was something wrong with them just because they couldnt express their feelings in the way I do. I might have accused them of being unable to dig deep into their feelings. Sort of like they had some emotional block. I might even have gently encouraged them to go to therapy to help them get in touch with their feelings and get unblocked.

    Ive since come to understand that I was looking at things the wrong way. I was assuming that everyone thought like me. This was such a fundamental assumption for me that it had never even occurred to me that there was another way to think about love.

    My current ISTP boyfriend exudes love, but he's never declared it in a heartfelt statement like an INFJ might. Nonetheless, he shows me he loves me everyday in dozens of little ways. Like when he gave me his jacket to keep me warm last night. Like when he made me omelets for breakfast yesterday. Like when he remembered how I said I didnt like the towels folded in a certain way and he folded them differently because he thought this would please me. These are all acts of love. This is love in its tangible form. And, this is the way Ss express it. There is nothing wrong with this.

    It just amazes me that Ss can go about their lives and not know "the reason" they do things or articulate their thoughts conceptually. I always know the reason for my actions and seek the meaning in everything I do. (Read: evaluate everything from the big picture perspective.) But for Ss actions do not necessarily (or even usually) have Meaning with a capital M. And, these are valid choices for Ss. And, I have grown to respect this... even though I don't fully understand it.

  10. #30
    No Cigar Litvyak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Well, I'd rather have the other person adapt to my communication style, rather than the reverse.
    I think it's more or less a mutual thing. Plus, it's not only about communication: you have to "tune in" to your partners cognitive functioning to maximize efficiency.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lauren Ashley View Post
    I don't really pay attention to the rest of the world
    Not possible. You're just trying to make it easier for yourself with such half-truths.

    [EDIT]

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