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  1. #121
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by visaisahero View Post
    Being an N in a S world is a unique experience and I wouldn't want it to be any other way. I think there are two things you must consider here- our relationships with S-types AND our relationships with N-types.

    Being in an S-type dominated world:
    It can be frustrating when it sometimes seems that the average person doesn't really "get" you. We tend to have different motivations, perspectives and insights. Once we're done moaning and griping at how misunderstood we are, I find that it makes for quite a fulfilling challenge to try and convey our ideas and intentions to S-types. Often, I find that well-developed S-types value and appreciate N-types very much, at least for our contributions if not for our personalities- and mutual respect is the foundation of any decent relationship.

    Even the most counter-intuitive S-type has something about him or her that we as N-types can probably learn from. I have S-type friends whose companionship I absolutely treasure because they keep me grounded, they make me look at things differently and have taught me many lessons which other N-types tend to be somewhat ignorant of.

    Meeting other N-types:
    This is my favourite part about being an N-type, which is finding other individuals whom you can relate with at a deeper level than the average person. They're rare- few and far between, but that's what makes the relationships with them so much more important and fulfilling. I am fairly confident when I say that N-types seem to have more meaningful relationships in general, because we tend to be more aware of the big picture. I have witnessed too often the superficial nature of some S-type relationships and I tire of them fairly easily. Other N-types are familiar with and sympathetic to the challenges of living in an S-type world and can provide companionship that is substantially more invigorating in comparison.

    Ultimately, life is a unique adventure that has great value in its diversity. Perhaps (and I think this is rather likely) in future generations, the concentration of N-types in society would increase. This has complex implications of every kind, and we could begin an entire new discussion on the topic. As for now, I think as long as we try to build meaningful relationships with everybody around us, try to understand people's motivations without belittling those who are different and seek to learn as much as we can from every experience, we should do okay. It's not inherently good or bad to be unique- it is, above all, an opportunity- and I think we ought to seize it to do the best we can for ourselves and those we care about. The moment you begin to develop a defeatist attitude, you're depriving yourself of a chance to truly enjoy all that life has to offer.
    This is just one of those things... how do you really know that these people are intuitives? How can you know that you aren't just labelling everyone you relate to an intuitive via confirmation bias? This happens a lot I've noticed, hell some people still think I'm an INFP.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

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  2. #122
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    Well said.

    I have to say for the 'Fe' part, I think there's a lot to it. For any kind of 'difference' you have that could make you not gel as well in a group, things like Fe helps. What also helps is to be of the same socio/economic status, come from the same religious background, etc. But, those are things you can't really change in the moment. What you can affect are your actions.

    Fe - or moving away from functions to *actions* - really just being hospitable/warm/outgoing etc. is socially valued and approved of (at least in North America?) and it can put others at ease so I think it does help smooth over or equalize other potential differences that could be a source of tension. It basically means you have to make (more) effort to normalize relations.

    I still think "being out of it" and "space cadet" or "out there" are the biggest interpersonal criticisms that can be levelled against an "N" in an "S" world but otherwise I don't quite understand the N/S disconnect people mention on the forum.

    I also think being NP exacerbates any "N/S friction" though. I know I was always considered a freak, the weird kid, strange, probable "lesbian" (LOL that's what strange women are often called regardless of actual sexual orientation) etc. which mellowed out to 'alternachick' all throughout school up to college graduation and I'm sure other NPs can relate. It was not something I necessarily wanted for myself or tried to achieve, that was the way I was labelled. But I don't think purely "N" was the cause of that...
    Thanks.

    And you make excellent points too.

    As for myself growing up, I don't know that I was considered a 'freak' per se, but I do know that I only had one friend and I didn't feel like I had anything in common with anyone else. I was fearful of many people, so I stayed in my shell. Honestly though, a lot of that was sort of self-imposed, and in many ways it had more to do with my own insecurities than the fact that other people would have rejected the 'true me'.

    Proteanmix - as always, you raise some good points, but I'll just highlight a few that really resonate with me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Proteanmix
    I just view being S or N as an insignificant and unremarkable way of categorizing a person and it says very little about you. I personally find out more meaningful information about a person knowing they grew up in Ethiopia and came to America when they were 12 and talking about how their previous life and how they adjusted than them telling me they're an ENFP.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proteanmix
    I know how to find people I click with on a more substantial level and I don't expect to have anything more than a superficial relationship with 99% of the people I come into contact with. For those that I do have more substantial relations with, well that just requires more work and investment period.blank.

    ...........To me it seems more of a matter of being able to extract meaning from those interactions rather than rendering most interactions as meaningless.
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  3. #123
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toonia View Post

    I probably shouldn't put this in a function charged thread because I do not think this is necessarily an S thing, but there is something that wearies me deeply when interacting in the world. It is the work ethic that equates character with coming into work no matter how sick you are, how dangerous the roads, etc. This is a point of complete exasperation to me because it attempts to personalize the manipulation for the benefit of the company.
    If a company doesn't value its people, they deserve chapter 7.

  4. #124
    it's tea time! Walking Tourist's Avatar
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    It's a bird, it's a plane... it's Super N!!! Leaping tall structures in a single bound, eating whole cakes in a single bite, reaching up and taking the moon and the stars from the sky with one hand...
    ... and putting the moon and the stars on a silver platter just for me... your friendly SP.

    Happy Valentines Day!


    Quote Originally Posted by Saint Kat View Post
    I love being an intuitive in a sensing world! I have powers that the others don't have, that makes me feel like I'm some kind of superhero.
    I'm a little teapot, short and stout. Here is my handle and here is my spout. Every time I steam up, I give a shout. Just tip me over and pour me out.

  5. #125
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    I think that confirmation bias plays a big role here. I'm going to agree with what proteanmix put earlier in the thread; finding someone's life experience more interesting than their N'ness. I think the following response by the ENFP OP was because ENFPs lead with Ne, and may be more interested in someone's ideas rather than how they grew up and how they themselves see the world.

    But my mom is an ENFJ majorly interested in matters of spirituality. When I first described S vs N to her, she had a mini revelation and exclaimed that all of the people that didn't understand her and didn't value spirituality were sensors, and that all of her friends who "got" her and liked discussing these things with her were intuitive. Confirmation bias. I then went to meet her spirituality friends, and they included an ESTP, ISFJ, ISFP, and ENFP. They related because they had similar ideas about the world and similar ideas about spirituality. Not because they were intuitive.

    I sound like a broken record here, but you mainly relate to people based on their interests, hobbies, and things that they like to think about. Not S vs N. I have equally good conversations with my S and N friends, because we are both interested in video games, school and careers, and each other's lives. Not because of some preference. The sensors that were with my mom were beyond me, I wasn't interested in them at all because we couldn't relate at all. I have also met intuitives that I saw as caring about things that didn't matter at all (and sensors as well... for example church/religion and useless philosophy).

    This is why you like all of these intuitives you meet on here. They are also interested in type theory. But, due to confirmation bias, you assume it's because they are intuitive. Sure they probably got here because they are intuitive (a lot of sensors just aren't interested in this kind of thing because they don't see how it's useful), but that doesn't mean that all intuitives will be this way.

    A lot of my family members who are intuitive who I've introduced to type theory have insisted that their significant others were intuitive; when they clearly weren't. It seems that a lot of people do this for some reason... For example my INFP great aunt thought that her husband (an ESTP) was an intuitive because he was very interested in Christianity, Jesus, and God (he was a very spiritual man). And also because he knew how to solve problems very quickly that arose in his life (I guess appearing to be Ne? When it's just practicality). She said that that was because he was good at getting ideas; but that just, again, seems like practicality in use. He would always solve problems based on what he already had or what was noticeably needed in a situation.

    My point is, I guess, that N and S are just ways of thinking. But they can accomplish similar things through different means (and often do). Ns and Ss can be interested in similar things and bond with each other because of that. Yeah.

    Well, there's my ramble for the day!
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

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  6. #126
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    Nah, it's okay. Just wish I was better at it sometimes.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
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  7. #127
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Another point that I would like to make is that intuition vs sensing in this theory are PREFERENCES. I prefer sensing, and yet I have been called a very intuitive person by my peers and family. There are also a lot of intuitives who are very practical people, but still prefer intuition as a mental process.

    A lot of sensors label themselves as intuitive because of the stereotypes thrown around. They make the same mistake that I did, I said "well I'm a pretty intuitive person, so I guess I'm an intuitive. Sensing just seems like a normal thing." This is a result of the bias from the NTs that write this stuff, like the INTPs who label every annoying outgoing person in their life as an ESFJ and base their descriptions off of that.

    Just saying. They are PROCESSES. You can be very intuitive as a sensor. It all just varies. You have to get down to the nit and grit of what the funcitons actually mean when they manifest in a person. Being "insightful" and "mentally quick" are just signs of an intelligent person, not an intuitive person. I'm sure that there are a lot of really stupid intuitives who label themselves as sensors here.

    One thing I've noticed, there are a lot of INFJs here who are ISFJ because of the point I made above. And they of course deny it because they are intelligent and consider themselves an intuitive and insightful person. Same with INTJs who are actually ISTJ, but there aren't as many of those here.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

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  8. #128
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    +100 for mentioning confirmation bias, BlackCat!
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  9. #129
    Reptilian Snuggletron's Avatar
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    Intuitives just like to play the type card, because it's easier than trying to justify our lack of job commitment and initiative to raise our own biological children.

  10. #130
    Professional Trickster Esoteric Wench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sleepy View Post
    I disagree. The majority is drawn to university(lecturers are different, I meant the students) because this will provide status and high salary, material style of living. Textbook S territory.
    I was only referring to professors... not students. (Except Ph.D. students who were trying to become professors.) I have not seen any studies, but I would guess that you are correct that the type of college STUDENTS reflects type distribution of the greater population.

    But for academics (i.e., professors and lecturers), these careers are dominated by Intuitives. This is not a matter of my opinion, btw. The Center for the Applications of Psychological Type (CAPT) has been compiling empirical data about the relationship between career and type. The data clearly shows that people often self-select into careers that play to their strengths. Thus, there is some predictability about what types will choose which careers. You can read a summary by type here: Workplace and Careers - CAPT.org. It is a fact that most professors in four-year liberal arts collages are Intuitives.

    Here's some more data. Below is a graph showing the typical personality type demands made in an academic career. The darker areas indicate high demand, lighter ones less demand. So if your personality type is in a darker area, then this career matches your personality. This graph is for a university professor. Note that NO SENSORS are in the darkest areas. So not only are Intuitives attracted to careers as academics, but such careers play to an Intuitive's strengths.


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