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  1. #31
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    "Shove me in the shallow water before I get too deep." -- Edie Brickell
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  2. #32
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    You never stated if you wanted to know how to tell them apart according to a temperament model or a cognitive model. I am positive that the responses you've received deal with both, and thus would only be confusing if you tried to put them together.

    I'm going to go with the cognitive model, because it's the only one between the two that I respect.

    Cognitively, what are INFPs and ISFPs? They are incredibly similiar, I personally argue more similar to each other than to any other types. Their cognitive processes go like this:

    INFP: Fi-Ne
    ISFP: Fi-Se.

    See? The only difference is the auxiliary process. So the distinction in them is essentially the distinction between Se and Ne.

    It's really hard to give situational examples that aren't overly simple stereotypes. I would suggest an analysis of what the cognitive processe mean to help give you a better idea.

    But if you want me to make a massively general characterization, it goes like this:

    On Food:

    The ISFP says "Life is an experience, why not make it an enjoyable experience? Certain foods are delicious!" and promply goes to glut on more of those foods.

    The INFP says "I find, though I struggle, that when I fast, I seem to achieve a higher state of mind that's really more rewarding than indulging in food" and proceeds to give a bunch of unique Ne driven connections to speculate on all the benefits of fasting (of varrying credibility).

    Basically, your perception gives you certain kinds of information, the Fi makes an independently derived value judgement on it, and if it's good, you go to pursue more of that thing. Because your perceptual preference is skewed toward certain information in the first place, it's really an autocatalytic process. You'll mostly detect the good in the information you're getting, and thus search that particular sort of information for more good. In my silly example, the ISFP gets carried away with the practical experiences, while the INFP gets carried away with the theoretical speculations. Both, being Fi-doms, are spurred by a convinction about what feels right.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  3. #33
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    ^

    Oookaaaay.....when NTs try to explain Fi it's often a disaster.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    On Food:

    The ISFP says "Life is an experience, why not make it an enjoyable experience? Certain foods are delicious!" and promply goes to glut on more of those foods.

    The INFP says "I find, though I struggle, that when I fast, I seem to achieve a higher state of mind that's really more rewarding than indulging in food" and proceeds to give a bunch of unique Ne driven connections to speculate on all the benefits of fasting (of varrying credibility)...
    Except when your best friend is an ISFP, then it's "Let's get a cheesecake and eat it while having deep discussion about all sorts of Fi topics."

  5. #35
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    ^

    Oookaaaay.....when NTs try to explain Fi it's often a disaster.
    I said giving situational examples was difficult to do accurately, for anyone I think. My alternative choice was to lay out a model that most people would probably have called incomprehensible. Those are unfortuantely the choices I'm often left with.

    But I'd be interested to hear your description of Fi. Or for that matter, what's incorrect about mine.

    Quote Originally Posted by heart View Post
    Except when your best friend is an ISFP, then it's "Let's get a cheesecake and eat it while having deep discussion about all sorts of Fi topics."
    Well, they're both Fi-dom, so of course. As for "deep discussion", I don't know what that actually means.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  6. #36
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    My problem with it is that it makes the ISFP sound like a human pie hole and the INFP as some sort of supersensual creature living on a higher plane of pure thought.

  7. #37
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heart View Post
    My problem with it is that it makes the ISFP sound like a human pie hole and the INFP as some sort of supersensual creature living on a higher plane of pure thought.
    That was a long way from point A to point B.

    I think the main problem with attempts at examples is the audience generally has no idea which part they're supposed to be paying attention to, and examples are just vehicles for relatively small, crucial parts.

    For me, there is no bias against either type. And obviously, I did not just lay forth archetypes for the the two in those absurd examples.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  8. #38
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    Your example was pure Ne verses pure Se and neither the ISFP nor the INFP is pure perception, they aren't even perception doms.

    Your idea of what feeling is sounds very related to instinct. If it feels good, eat. That's not what I perceive Fi to be. That sounds more like just S.

  9. #39
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heart View Post
    Your example was pure Ne verses pure Se and neither the ISFP nor the INFP is pure perception, they aren't even perception doms.
    ...

    Did you read the whole thing?

    Yes, I said they are both Fi-doms, so they only thing in them that really contrasts is Se vs Ne, hence them being represented only in the difference between those two different processses. Perhaps I had too high a hope, that I need not explain what Fi is to begin with, in this of all places.

    But you're incorrect anyhow, because the examples I gave would not be representative of Se or Ne plus Ti. Too much emphasis on what feels right, and little on anything else.

    And yes they are concentrated personifactions, because there's no better way. Some people are practically at the borders, others lean very far. I cannot try to account for all of those different shades, I can only give the processes in their purity so one knows what to see more or less of.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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    Live and let live will just amount to might makes right

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    ...

    But you're incorrect anyhow, because the examples I gave would not be representative of Se or Ne plus Ti. Too much emphasis on what feels right, and little on anything else.

    Feeling is not "what feels right" in a body sensation way.

    An INFP might skip meals when out of touch with their bodies. But they might just as easily overindulge on certain foods when under stress and using their 3rd childlike function, Si, for self comfort. So I am not personally seeing the tendancy to "glut" on foods as an indicator of the ISFP over the INFP.

    I also don't think your example would be the ISFP's internal judgement process if they were using Fi to temper Se. it wouldn't just be pure, Oh if it feels good eat. The ISFP I know seem very aware of food's power to be a means to health for themselves and those they care about and they seem more intune with self care and eating healthy. Fi as judgement process would say "In order to care for those I love, I must be healthy."


    The following is a real statement from an ISFP I know:
    "Last time I had a sugar binge, I crashed and I was so crabby the rest of the evening. I know how it feels when my Mom is in one of her dragonlady moods, I don't want to do that to my kids. So I am going to really try to watch my sugar intake."

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