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  1. #201
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    Let it also been known that I have been called many, many things.

    And, that I am many, many things.

    But one thing I have NEVER been called is selfish.

    Never.
    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

    Ride si sapis

    Intelligentle sparkles

  2. #202
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EnFpFer View Post
    Could you elaborate on that AO? I keep hearing about how NFPs are generally more "selfish" and "self-absorbed" than Fe users, and I guess I'm having a hard understanding what is meant by that.
    Well I am not sure either. But to me NFP is more likely to withhold parts of it self from others. They can be friendly but there will always be some distance between them and other people. What changes when you are 1 on 1 with NFP. Or in very close and friendly atmosphere.


    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    Fi is not necessarily more self-absorbed in love. Actually, the way Fi sees it sometimes, instead of following social convention or feeling a need to spread graciousness to the entire group, Fi's "selfishness" can mean that the Fi-user channels a very focused love into specific people - like lovers, close friends, family members - in an empathetic, devoted way. Fi love can actually be quite intense.

    I think you mistake what Fi v. Fe even means. It's as those you're defining it as Fi = feelings for self and Fe = feelings for others, and that's not what it is. What you're saying about ENTP/INFJ v. ENFP/INTJ doesn't even sound logical to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by SillySapienne View Post
    Fi can definitely be more self-concerned, and I guess self-absorbed, but it's that we're self-reflective thinking about how things feel, how things are, how things aught to be.

    Is Fi selfish?!?!

    Hell no!!!

    Fi is an intrinsic moral compass, it's the very definition of empathy.

    We are all human beings with incredibly similar basic feelings and behaviors.

    The more you know yourself, the more you understand others.

    Fi is self awareness.

    I know what Fi and Fe mean it is just that Fe is usually just Fe while there can be much larger differences between Fi and another Fi. What makes it harder to balance it out. (if we presume that the entire function order is correct)

    You both got me wrong. I am not saything that it can work very very well. I am only saying that it seem so me that ENTP and INFJ will have a less bumpy ride. (actually someone can even argue that this is a bad thing)

  3. #203
    Was E.laur Laurie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SillySapienne View Post
    Let it also been known that I have been called many, many things.

    And, that I am many, many things.

    But one thing I have NEVER been called is selfish.

    Never.
    I have

  4. #204
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elaur View Post
    I have
    No one's perfect, I guess.

    I've been called Hitler more times than I can count, if that makes you feel any better.

    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

    Ride si sapis

    Intelligentle sparkles

  5. #205
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SillySapienne View Post
    Let it also been known that I have been called many, many things.

    And, that I am many, many things.

    But one thing I have NEVER been called is selfish.

    Never.

    I am afraid you are only proving me right with this comment. Since it looks that I have just hit your Fi in a bad way. What could have a very bad consequences in the case we actually know each other.

  6. #206
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    I am afraid you are only proving me right with this comment. Since it looks that I have just hit your Fi in a bad way. What could have a very bad consequences in the case we actually know eachother.
    Awwww, don't get your ascot all in a twist.

    My Fi is fine, calibrated and dandy, right now.

    Who needs a fuzzy-wubbie-bubbly hug?!?!?!

    I think you do!!!

    (Though, very most likely you'll reject it)

    I'm gonna give it to you anyway!!!

    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

    Ride si sapis

    Intelligentle sparkles

  7. #207
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SillySapienne View Post
    Awwww, don't get your ascot all in a twist.

    My Fi is fine, calibrated and dandy, right now.

    Who needs a fuzzy-wubbie-bubbly hug?!?!?!

    I think you do!!!

    (Though, very most likely you'll reject it)

    I'm gonna give it to you anyway!!!


    I know, what is because you know what common sense is.



    However this is the core of why have a problem with NFs in communication.

    If I reject the hug that means that my Fi got triggered. What is not the case here. So no, I don't mind.

  8. #208
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Fi seems selfish on the surface. It speaks in terms of "I". It displays pain/discomfort on the surface. By externalizing the pain it signals a need for help. This externalization is the only way another Fi user can observe thier pain, "mirror" the pain internally and respond accordingly to aid the one in need.

    However Fi hurts and is energy intensive to use-thus is reserved for the limited ones that the Fi user cares for and allows to see it. By allowing them "inside" it forces us to feel EVERYTHING they feel-ouch. That is an incredible weakness to expose to just anyone. Having too much Ne disables this though as you cant screen out the external pain of others. Sucks, cause then you turn off Fi instead.

    Fe seems much more open, loving, speaks in terms of "we" and the group. It is very externally caring. It forms the basis of a social obligatory network of reciprocal behavior. Fe users form social bonds to insure sharing of resources should times grow rough. I scratch your back, you scratch mine sort of thing. That seems to be the underlying biology, although on the surface the Fe users actually seem to feel profoundly caring-ie if you ask them, they feel profoundly caring.

    so from a biological perspective Fi is self sacrificial whereas Fe is self preserving. A new twist on how you define selfishness.

    Anyways:
    What happens when Ne/Si just cant perceive the Ni/Se vision? It's like stepping off a cliff, being blind,ie requiring absolute trust. How does that develop?

    Si develops trust of Ni based upon a past history of performance.

    How does Se develop trust of Ne?

  9. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by SillySapienne View Post
    No one's perfect, I guess.

    I've been called Hitler more times than I can count, if that makes you feel any better.

    ME TOO!

  10. #210
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Happy Puppy View Post
    Si develops trust of Ni based upon a past history of performance.

    How does Se develop trust of Ne?
    Ne takes away Se anxiety. Ne optimism frees the present from the huge and terrifying past and future. it just puts the Ni dom in the moment, and optimistic about the future. we trust it once we realize that it works, that the judgment function of the other person has a viable/better cost analysis strategy than we do. if they don't, then we're gonna reject it, and a general cautious stance takes a while to get the message when it would work better than what we are doing (but it's not perfect! or airtight! or complete!).

    with my entp friends, i realize that their judgment plus Ne optimism generates a lot of happiness and good feeling and problem-solving in ways that can free me up to be at my best. we Ni types just get weighed down with too many problems, foresee too many negative outcomes, difficulties, the tightrope seems too impossibly thin and twisted to ever successfully walk it. Ne helps us branch out rather than demand a single straight line.

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