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  1. #1121
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poki View Post
    Then why did I offend you?
    Because that sort of attitude is really, really obnoxious.

  2. #1122
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post
    There you go, Fe users. We don't make contingency plans against you because we assume you're not the kind of fuckup that destroys for the sake of it.
    We don't destroy for the sake of it. We destroy to punish you for not seeing the big picture.

    You're too focused.

  3. #1123
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    Because that sort of attitude is really, really obnoxious.
    So you are offended because I attacked your credibility because it is obnoxious, not because it actually has the affect of reducing your credibility. So I am now allowed to attack it because it has no affect. Are you going to be offended if I do because its obnoxious?
    Im out, its been fun

  4. #1124
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    Quote Originally Posted by poki View Post
    So you are offended because I attacked your credibility because it is obnoxious, not because it actually has the affect of reducing your credibility. So I am now allowed to attack it because it has no affect. Are you going to be offended if I do because its obnoxious?
    There's a way to do everything. Certainly, you understand that.

    Flex the Fe a little bit. It makes the process so much easier.

  5. #1125
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    There's a way to do everything. Certainly, you understand that.

    Flex the Fe a little bit. It makes the process so much easier.
    I'm sorry, deja-vu, carry on...
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





    "Harm none, do as ye will”

  6. #1126
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    There's a way to do everything. Certainly, you understand that.

    Flex the Fe a little bit. It makes the process so much easier.
    Thats my inferior function. Teach me some Fe in a non attacking manner Im the weaker one here I will run you in circles because of my weakness, you can fight it and attack it back or you can teach those with a weaker Fe. Lead by example, flex that Fe in a healthier manner then I do and take control of the situation.
    Im out, its been fun

  7. #1127
    Happy Dancer uumlau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Happy Puppy View Post
    This sort of seems like it parallels how I develop ideas-except I externalize them to others over and over again, to refine them-and likely affirm them. I will stumble across an Ne connection, link to several other previously observed connections, then build a functional pattern. Then I bring it here and just keep dropping it in places on various threads hoping for feedback or I will work with my ENTP to identify flaws. I am very often wrong-but I need that external feedback to help me understand how I am wrong. I cant do what you do in your head-the quality assurance.
    We do it both in-head and out-head. In-head is faster, and eliminates lots of "obvious" problems, and is rather accurate if one has real experience and intuition with an issue. Out-head is slower, and used at toward the end of the process, or from the get-go when real results are needed sooner. There's external feedback, but that's the Te, instead of the Se or Ne.

    Internally, I take the pattern and just keep cross checking it against newly observed patterns. So every idea I have really needs a percentage certainty added. In addition the ideas are never, ever complete. The are skeletons that-sort of like those graphs of mandlebrot sets-can be endlessly refined downwards with new patterns in old patterns. The first pattern can be built into larger patterns.
    Yes, this is similar for me. For Ni/Te, it's like using Ti/Ne, except Ni is in the Ti role: the patterns are largely internalized, and the internal patterns are compared with reality via Te. You're just using external patterns with Ne.

    One of my most trusted patterns is the "ENXP Symmetry Model". This means that every thing I see an ENTP can be back predicted onto what an ENFP would do and visa-versa, but the action will be reflected in reverse via the two judging functions. Sounds cute until you find yourself looking at your own flaws-flaws you never knew you had till you found an ENTP's flaws. You learn a lot that way.
    Ha!

    So this model gets a 95% certainty score. An ESXP Symmetry model gets a 85% certainty. An INXJ Symmetry model-A 30%-it should be there but I dont have data and I dont understand introverts and I dont understand how Ni...Thus it sits as a puzzle simmering over in the corner. Yet I will still externalize the possibility.
    I do something similar, but I don't put numbers on it. It's more like UNGH! or ungh or ung. The importance is felt (with Ni) more than quantified, even though Te plays a role. Te will translate UNGH! into "95%".

    I dont like having to externalize ideas, but I suppose that's the i/e diff. I keep going back to the same place-how do you know the "conversation" has covered all possibilities? How do you know there is no neglected dust mite in the corner? Since it doesnt seem you guys can "see" the Fe conversations, how can you be certain they will not interfere with plan-or it sounds like maybe you learn to account for them as you grow, without ever really understanding them?
    It's like science: we might have a model that is incapable of predicting otherwise unforeseen behavior, but it is perfectly fine for dealing with reality as we know it. Newton wasn't wrong. In fact, he was so right that part of General Relativity has the gravitational field traveling at "infinite speed": i.e., unlike light, where you see where something was, the gravitational field reflects where the object is. (Gravitational waves in the curvature of space still travel at light speed, but that's a signal.) Eventually we run into things that don't fit in our model, and cause it to be re-evaluated, and we develop a new model that fits with empirical data. (Really what happens is Te notes that a pattern doesn't fit, and Ni pulls out a half dozen alternative patterns, one of which is usually correct, and sometimes one of which is very correct and crazy predictive.)

    All that Fe stuff we're blind to? In one sense it doesn't matter. In another sense, it does manifest for us, but we treat it as objective rather than subjective. I.e., we won't speculate as to why someone is being a jerk towards us and try to fix that, but rather we'll observe he's being a jerk and process him under the "jerk" classification.

    And as for dust mites? Part of what we've learned to do is prioritize. It's a dust mite. The dust mite does not change whether we should take a left at Albuquerque. In rare cases, the dust mite might be allergenic, in which case we simply have a new problem to solve. We're always solving problems. That there might be a problem left over, that our plans might be incomplete ... well DUH! Of course they're "incomplete." We just know that whatever comes up next can also be handled with alacrity. It's a workflow, not a game of chess. Even if we miss something big, that too is eventually included in our internal models.

    Others get the illusion that we're certain (or simply arrogant) from our attitude. We are not "certain," rather we are "confident", both in our conclusions and our ability to rectify any new issues quickly.

  8. #1128
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post
    A: why would you ask?

    Gawd, people. Srsly.
    Because I dont understand. Thus I ask. I question, I question, I question.
    It's what I do when I dont understand. I dont understand Ni in the context of any Ni user. It confuses me and it doesnt match things I understand already, thus I need more information.

    But please do accept my apologies for dragging the conversation down a notch, given the intellectual superiority of the grand and noble Thinkers.

  9. #1129
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    Because that sort of attitude is really, really obnoxious.
    Deja vu from page 50-75.

    Does possession of Ne-Ti make you unable to read the opening post of the thread an identify that the topic of conversation is ENFP-INTJ relationships?

    If every ENTP on the forum is going to come in here and totally fail to understand the topic; or simply be too lazy to open a thread entitled 'ENTPs with irrelevent ENTP comparisons, opinions and off topic posts in the case of INTJ and ENFP relationships' then perhaps I should complain to the admins for some order.

    I think many of us have been more than indulging and patient.

  10. #1130
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by InvisibleJim View Post
    Deja vu from page 50-75.

    Does possession of Ne-Ti make you unable to read the opening post of the thread an identify that the topic of conversation is ENFP-INTJ relationships?

    If every ENTP on the forum is going to come in here and totally fail to understand the topic; or simply be too lazy to open a thread entitled 'ENTPs with irrelevent ENTP comparisons, opinions and off topic posts in the case of INTJ and ENFP relationships' then perhaps I should complain to the admins for some order.

    I think many of us have been more than indulging and patient.
    It's not my fault you couldn't sustain the topic at hand. It's not my fault, either, (well, I guess it is) that the topics ENTPs have brought up have been far more stimulating of discussion than the original conceit of the thread.

    Quit blaming others for your personal disinterest. If you don't like where this one is going, start another one like Amar did, and try your best to not be boring this time.

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