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  1. #1
    Senior Member bighairything's Avatar
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    Default Is there an ENFP Fi-Si loop?

    Every now and then you'll stumble across the concept of an Xi-Yi loop on this forum, and I was wondering if there was an Fi-Si loop for ENFPs. I saw a thread about the INFP Fi-Si loop, but I couldn't really relate to it. Yet every time I spend too long on my own I start to go loopy. Any thoughts anyone?

  2. #2
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    I think a lot of ENFPs are more prone to the Ne-Te loop.

  3. #3
    Senior Member bighairything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    I think a lot of ENFPs are more prone to the Ne-Te loop.
    Chance would be a fine thing, I'd love a bit more Te in my life

    Seriously though, how do you think the Ne-Te loop expresses itself?

  4. #4
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bighairything View Post
    Chance would be a fine thing, I'd love a bit more Te in my life

    Seriously though, how do you think the Ne-Te loop expresses itself?
    First of all, it can come off as rather abrasive. Even the sweetest ENFP can be seen as a hardened jerk in the workplace. Ne-Te lays the smackdown. It can be forceful and aggressive and intrusive, on the negative side.

    On the positive side, it can be quite efficient and organized. It's cute, actually.

    I see a lot of danger though when there is no Fi processing. I knew this one ENFP guy who would create constructs for all the Ne idea rambles that went on in his head. Like when he believed his wife was cheating, Ne would generate a million and one possibilities and ideas about everything his wife said or did. Te would make it concrete because it fit into the construct of a cheating wife. He never double checked his Fi to see if he really felt his devoted wife would do that to him, you know what I mean? It was a like a beast on the loose with no internal analysis for validation or authenticity.

  5. #5
    Senior Member bighairything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    First of all, it can come off as rather abrasive. Even the sweetest ENFP can be seen as a hardened jerk in the workplace. Ne-Te lays the smackdown. It can be forceful and aggressive and intrusive, on the negative side.
    Hell yeah! I never thought about it in terms of an Ne-Te loop before, but you're absolutely right. I've worked in places where I've been incredibly difficult to get along with for people that I didn't like (and some that I did like).

    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    On the positive side, it can be quite efficient and organized. It's cute, actually.
    I can see this too, including the part about how it can come across as cute. Especially with xNTPs, I do sometimes find myself figuratively (and occasionally literally) tidying up after them.

    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    I see a lot of danger though when there is no Fi processing. I knew this one ENFP guy who would create constructs for all the Ne idea rambles that went on in his head. Like when he believed his wife was cheating, Ne would generate a million and one possibilities and ideas about everything his wife said or did. Te would make it concrete because it fit into the construct of a cheating wife. He never double checked his Fi to see if he really felt his devoted wife would do that to him, you know what I mean? It was a like a beast on the loose with no internal analysis for validation or authenticity.
    It's something I've not really experienced much, but I can see how that can happen. I once made a girl cry on the basis that I thought she had just split up with me. It was only years later that it occurred to me that maybe "we're still friends, right?" didn't quite have the same loaded meaning in Spanish, in Mexico, as it does over here.

  6. #6
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    When Si shows up it is only briefly under massive stress. It makes me get really weird about other people changing structures or details of my projects. I become a really bitchy ISTJ. A good example was two layers of my bosses trying to change shipment orders of my instrument at the end of a quarter when chaos reigns.

    ONLY I CAN CHANGE THE ORDERS AND IT MUST BE DONE THIS WAY. Quite neurotic but it seems to be a panic last ditch effort to maintain stability.

    older enfps seem to have grown into Si and use it to tone down the Ne flights of fancy and do so quite well.


    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    First of all, it can come off as rather abrasive. Even the sweetest ENFP can be seen as a hardened jerk in the workplace. Ne-Te lays the smackdown. It can be forceful and aggressive and intrusive, on the negative side.

    On the positive side, it can be quite efficient and organized. It's cute, actually.
    We took the DISC analysis this week at our sales meeting. I scored exceptionally D and moderate I. In the text it said "When under massive stress Happy Puppy can become VERY aggressive and exhibit rapid shifts in behavior." Shock! I am hanging this on my office door. NeTe at its finest.

    They kept asking me where I kept the bodies....

    (My ESTP friend got told she had a personality disorder and all on the ENTPs are "frustrated" and "uncertain of their identities". Meditating ENTP actually got into an argument with the lady going over the results.)

    The enfps all had two common requests due to Te raising its head:
    1. Direct open communication
    2. Do not assume passion equates with a lack of logic.

    I sort of knew this myself from chats here but it was awesome to see it validated in a large peer group. Check out the NeTe thread of why do enfps want Te...those were both good.

    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    I see a lot of danger though when there is no Fi processing. I knew this one ENFP guy who would create constructs for all the Ne idea rambles that went on in his head. Like when he believed his wife was cheating, Ne would generate a million and one possibilities and ideas about everything his wife said or did. Te would make it concrete because it fit into the construct of a cheating wife. He never double checked his Fi to see if he really felt his devoted wife would do that to him, you know what I mean? It was a like a beast on the loose with no internal analysis for validation or authenticity.
    We cant see the unspoken Fe innuendos so learn early, to assume the worst when in doubt, in an effort to maximize protection of Fi. ISTJs do this too. Combined with Ne in an enfp this can be a disaster. Thus we really will jump to the worst possible interpretation of a negative situation.

    I like the "Fi checking" as it explains why enfps can be so good at occupations like marketing or operations. It has to be big picture and based on shitty data with massive people contamination. Ne vision with Te structuring is required but the Fi is that visceral check to see if it "makes sense" from a people perspective.

    I now have an ENFP COO and my new marketing director is an enfp. Our VP of Rnd is also an ENFP-all using an Fe flavored Te. I feel surrounded by happy, affirming love vibrations and abrasive, direct, blunt communication.

    just like heaven.

  7. #7
    Senior Member bighairything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Happy Puppy View Post
    I feel surrounded by happy, affirming love vibrations and abrasive, direct, blunt communication.

    just like heaven.

  8. #8
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    I was waiting for you to show up, Puppy! I even wanted to tell him to talk to you directly since you know so much stuff about this, but I didn't want to call you out against your will. (I learned my lesson, big time! )

    I have to admit, it's hard for me to accept the ENFP parts of your DISC assessment, even though I know it's true, due to the gross inaccuracy of the ExTP results. Ugh. That scoring is a highly personal value judgment from the person who wrote the test.

  9. #9
    Senior Member bighairything's Avatar
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    Well, at the risk of derailing my own thread even further, I'm actually a bit sceptical when it comes to lower order functions. I haven't so far seen a compelling empirical case that there are four functions that people "have". For instance, in online function tests my third and fourth strongest functions are by some distance Ti and Se, and I possibly even rely more heavily on Fe than I do on Te.

    But then again, being sceptical doesn't mean being closed-minded, and the notion of lower order functions open up interesting possibilities, which is why I raise the topic.

    So with this disclaimer out of the way, returning to my original post: what is it that can cause an extroverted ENFP to get stuck in introverted cycles of behaviour? I like being around other people, am generally happy when I am around other people, and for the most part get my energy off being around them. Yet when I get cut off from them, it can be extremely difficult to reconnect. Even when I know that all I need to do is pick up a phone and arrange to meet a friend, it can be very difficult to do this. When I'm alone I get depressed, and when I'm depressed I don't feel like seeing other people, but it's precisely because I haven't been seeing other people that I'm depressed in the first place.

    Can anyone think of a functional basis for explaining this?

    Maybe it's an NeFi loop where Ne has turned inward on itself (but not turned into Ni). When I'm cut off from the world, the quickest way to get my Ne fix is through the internet. This causes Fi to stir - pleasure at getting some sort of Ne fix, sadness at being cut off face to face contact with other people - causing me to turn to the internet for another Ne hit etc etc.

  10. #10
    Allergic to Mornings ergophobe's Avatar
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    Yes-there is an Fi-Si loop for ENFPS. I think I would describe it as an Ne-Fi-Si loop without adequate help from Te. This is the ENFP paranoia loop too. Ne thinks of possibilities, Fi catches on to the worst of the lot, Si helps remember past events that may nor may not objectively support what Fi feels but Fi interprets them negatively anyway....rinse and repeat. When Te is strong, it helps detach and view all of the paranoia as intriguing but completely laughable. I am better able to discern with the detachment Te provides, what situations deserve the loopiness...

    I'm not sure I understand the Ne-Te as a loop...I can completely see how Ne-Te with weak Fi and or Fe can be abrasive and ordering in a counterproductive manner, particularly in times of stress or with little thought given to checking in with Fi, that most helpful of judging functions. The example Jeno used above sounds more like Ne-Fi-Si rather than Ne-Te.

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