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  1. #61
    Aspiring Troens Ridder KLessard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cascadeco View Post
    Are you feeling the feelings just for the feelings themselves, or are you exploring the feelings with the goal of learning/analyzing/taking action?
    Learning and taking action, of course. If I wallow in my feelings for too long, I start to hate myself for real and feel totally useless (I'm a type One).
    But I do need to take time to "feel" after I've been crushed. I can't just move on to the learning and taking action process right away.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by purplesunset View Post
    Thank you.

    To clarify, though, I wasn't trying to imply that I'm biased against women, I meant that the scenario I illustrated above was over-simplifying the issue to be biased towards the cold, calculating guy.

    One thing I have been doing a lot lately is getting to the heart of an issue. I want to take any issue and honestly examine it. Sometimes, in order to get in to the heart, it takes jumping out and watching it from an alternative viewpoint.

    I hope my post caused a few people here to jump out and view a comfortably accepted position (e.g. the belief that empathy always stems from altruistic foundations) from an alternative viewpoint.
    But I never assumed empathy was always from altruistic foundations. I think your "point" was lost in your prattle about your broken heart.

  3. #63
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    But I never assumed empathy was always from altruistic foundations. I think your "point" was lost in your prattle about your broken heart.
    I didn't think it was. He was rather emphatic and over the top, but then again, isn't that what intense emotion is?
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
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  4. #64
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cascadeco View Post
    But, regarding everything else you posted, yeah, pretty biased there, and your male/female distinction is a little over the top but I think I see what you're getting at... but at least you admit to your being biased!! ha.
    I think purplesunset was admitting to being bitter, rather than biased.

    Quote Originally Posted by purplesunset View Post
    I hope my post caused a few people here to jump out and view a comfortably accepted position (e.g. the belief that empathy always stems from altruistic foundations) from an alternative viewpoint.
    There's also the viewpoint that there is no true selfless altruism, that male or female, we can always attach selfishness to the equation. So you can apply this to anyone.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I didn't think it was. He was rather emphatic and over the top, but then again, isn't that what intense emotion is?
    I thought it was because he was putting so much emphasis on male and female. He had some good points at the end, but the first paragraph was a totally selfish, irrational outpouring of emotion. Maybe that was his point.

  6. #66
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    I thought it was because he was putting so much emphasis on male and female. He had some good points at the end, but the first paragraph was a totally selfish, irrational outpouring of emotion. Maybe that was his point.
    I suppose when people do things like that, I ask them what do they mean or could they clarify what their point is.

    Speaking of which, would somebody please explain:
    • what spurs these intense feelings/what are some situations that bring them on,
    • how they manifest themselves in real life and,
    • how they manifest in interactions with other people?
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I suppose when people do things like that, I ask them what do they mean or could they clarify what their point is.

    Speaking of which, would somebody please explain:
    • what spurs these intense feelings/what are some situations that bring them on,
    • how they manifest themselves in real life and,
    • how they manifest in interactions with other people?
    --- A range of objects, situations, people,ideas etc. can "spur" them. The most evocative sources for me are the ones that come from music, and, of course, that four letter word.

    --- That's probably not the right question to ask. According to what has been written in this thread, a key aspect to these intense feelings is that they are experienced on the inside. Any manifestations are likely tangential or involuntary.

    --- This is how they manifest themselves in online interactions with other people
    The purple sun won't heal my purple bruises :ouch:

  8. #68
    Uniqueorn William K's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    In my perception, I find there is an overvaluing of being emotional in threads like these. The more extreme the emotional reaction, the more eviscerating it is, the more real it is. There's very little advocacy to attempt moderation or regulation. If you're oversensitive, then that's beautiful. And then there's the pile on.

    Emotional processing can go in many directions; they can be stripped of all of their nutrients and wholesomeness or they can be refined to a more usable object like a precious metal. I'm not advocating ignore your emotions, skip over them, stuff them away in a little box and push them to the back of your closet. But what seems overwrought to me is what seems to be people saying the consistently dwell in these emotional crevices. And then on top of that there seems to be a learned helplessness, like you couldn't take control even if you tried.

    I think this makes you a slave to your own emotions. You're at their whim and mercy. That's not emotional processing. Is this empathy or is this empathy without discernment, without context, or without proportion? So yes this a contribution to the question of why NFs supposedly "need to feel upset so easily." I say they don't! It's not a prerequisite to being an NF as people are trying to pass it off as.

    I understand this is not exactly what the OP was talking about, but thread derails are abundant here so...
    What about positive emotions such as joy or passion? Does this just apply to the negative ones? Because "need to feel upset so easily" is just one part of the equation.
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  9. #69
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    In my perception, I find there is an overvaluing of being emotional in threads like these. The more extreme the emotional reaction, the more eviscerating it is, the more real it is. There's very little advocacy to attempt moderation or regulation. If you're oversensitive, then that's beautiful. And then there's the pile on.
    Methinks this is more an Enneagram 4 (and maybe sx variant) issue than an NF issue. Many NFs and especially INFs are 4s, but not all are.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by William K View Post
    What about positive emotions such as joy or passion? Does this just apply to the negative ones? Because "need to feel upset so easily" is just one part of the equation.
    I hate to feel like I'm taking over the thread, but...

    I think it must apply to both. Both the "positive" and the negative emotions. That was something I brought up on page 5. Too intense a passion for someone else could make you give them grievous pain. Too intense a joy just gives you that much more sting as John Keats so aptly put it:


    Ah! would 'twere so with many
    A gentle girl and boy!
    But were there ever any
    Writhed not at passèd joy?

    To know the change and feel it,
    When there is none to heal it
    Nor numbèd sense to steal it—
    Was never said in rhyme.
    The purple sun won't heal my purple bruises :ouch:

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