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Thread: When an INFJ doorslams you / cuts you out of their life / breaks off contact

  1. #371
    wants Mifune clone minion Array Z Buck McFate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    Wait a minute though - perhaps this too is rooted in Fe-Ti being very results oriented, whereas Fi-Te is more expression/action oriented. I can't imagine discussing something if it wasn't to get clarity on what to do, or on how to relieve my own feelings or change my perspective significantly enough that I can proceed. Maybe that is not what Fi-Te sees the point of discussion being though...
    Yeah, this whole convo has that feel. I think it’s a mistake to turn to ‘functions’ too quickly to explain away conflict, because it’s all too possible to make practically anything fit into those boxes with a little bit of effort, but I have noticed there is a tendency for Fi arguments to completely fly under Fe radar and seem irrational- in the exact same way that Ti arguments fly under Te radar and seem irrational. Fe/Te look for external resolution; BalanceFind showed up essentially saying ‘this is my problem, I’m looking for INFJ insight/suggestions about how to handle it’; INFJs and BalanceFind both feel as though the other is misdirecting the conversation away from ‘the whole point’ (because maybe BF is looking for some internal answers and we keep suggesting external ones)?

    I remember once uumlau explained that Fi can seem like “Emo. Emo emo. Emo? Emo.” to a Fe’er- like a bunch of abstract fragments that don’t stack up in a way that make any sense- and I thought it was a perfect way to explain what it’s like for Fe to deal with Fi. And it *seems* like that may be what’s going on here. Like his whole point is flying under our radar, maybe. Because I can't figure out how his responses have anything to do with what any of us are posting- I can see how our posts are directly responding to his, yet I can't understand how his are directly responding to any of ours- and he seems to be frustrated with that same issue (like he feels like he's directly responding to us, yet we aren't directly responding back).
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  2. #372
    RETIRED Array CzeCze's Avatar
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    Wow I just wandered into this thread now! What a doozy

    @BalanceFind I don't think you will get what you are seeking in this thread. I am very sympathetic to your situation but i think you chose the wrong thread and you seem to be looking for people to support you almost like joining your team and slamming the INFJ or agreeing that she is in the wrong and you are in the right. I don't think any INFJs here are going to do that. :P I understand why you might seem defensive because you legitimately know this person screwed you over and are in the ethical wrong and yre interpreting others refusal to give you validation as them implying YOU are the problem. Actually I think some people actually said as much. That would frustrate me too.

    I think part of the problem is that youre talking about an ethical/moral axis and people here are just speaking to behavior typical of an INFJ. When folks tell you this person has door slammed you, they aren't saying ethically it was the correct thing to do or even that it was the mature adult thing to do or that she was in the moral right, but simply things got too overwhelming for that particular INFJ to handle. The INFJs here are not going to jump on a bandwagon and tell you how horrible she was is related to being INFJ or apologize on behalf of INfJs. Its just not going to happen. Some other types might budge a little but I dont think these folks will. :P


    Objectively, you've repeated yourself over and over almost ad verbatim and havent really provded the details people want or responded to them. And you've repeated a lot of narrative not related to explaining the dysfunction of this INfJ or your relationship story, like repeating how you don't want to have to take away something from her and how terrible it's fonna be for her when the jig is up. it seems more like you're venting or getting ready in your head for the inevitable confrontation.

    fWIW it sounds like this person is a classic con woman. Youve been conned. I'm sorry to tell you that, it's hard to hear. I don't think youre being too hard on her and I don't think it really matters her backstory or side of the story to see that. I don't have any sympathy for her and I don't think being a "lousy boyfriend" is her excuse or a valid one at that. She waited until she got all the money and support she could out of you over a span of several years and then she ran. Perhaps there's some INFJ flavored door slam to that or some sort of INFJ justification or panic mode in play that is INfj flavored but bottom line, the woman is a user, a liar, and a coward. Oh yes, and a thief.

    If I were you Id give up hope of the peaceful ending that you want right now and just blow up her spot and aggressively pursue your financial interests. Call her family and friends,email blast all your mutual acquaintances with your lawyers information and that you're pursuing a case, etc. Some would say "but that will just drive her emotionally further away"? But we are waaaaay past that stage now. Who cares about her personal comfort, how much she likes you, social fallout? Like any decent con woman she's probably started telling people you are a wife beater, drug abuser, skip out on alimony, embezzler, anything that will discredit you. The end game has already started and you are way behind. Stop thinking about her as your "troubled girlfriend" and think about her as the con woman who used you.

    Accept that you will NEVER get this woman back and she is basically your enemy now. Give up all hopes and dreams for an apology or explanation from her.

    Advice on dealing with InFJs, healthy or not, isn't going to work anymore.

    BTW I agree that she owes you an explanation which is why I think you may be ENFP. Or just someone totally blindsided. As an ENFP though I really need to know the "whys" behind why someone did something.
    Last edited by CzeCze; 02-08-2012 at 03:14 PM. Reason: Snip snip edit
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  3. #373

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    No, I get it just fine.

    I have complete control over my emotions in this thread.

    Different people have responded in different ways to this thread. You don't speak for everyone.

    I've known her 9 years. She is a dual citizen of two countries. We met originally through work, friendship, brief dating, over a year.

    She was born elsewhere, moved to U.S. As teenager. She's lived in U.S. Entire adult life a few decades.

    We met in person. She's as American as anyone else here. She's also as native of her original country as anybody else there.

    We always kept in touch as friends only over the years. We both dated others. The entire time we lived in the same large U.S. City. Originally I chose not to pursue the relationship and we both moved on.

    We began dating in person every day several years ago in the U.S. She chose to relocate somewhere with better climate, a long time dream of hers. We both agreed to continue the relationship in two countries. This wasn't abnormal to us.


    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    No, @BalanceFind, you're not getting it. All you are doing in this whole thread is talking about your conclusions about her.

    Without her side of the story it is IMPOSSIBLE to assess the accuracy of your claims.

    Therefore all we can hope to do here is:

    1.) Help you understand something you don't understand from the NF POV.

    2.) Provide you with a platform for venting and our sympathies for your pain.

    3.) Offer a few suggestions on the limited info you have shared.

    It is a fact that:

    1.) We don't know the whole story.

    2.) We only know the story from your extrapolations on her "health" vs "non-health".

    3.) We haven't heard a SINGLE thing that talks about you. (Oh you got a little close up there, when you were getting a tad heated. That was at least a little real.)

    How else can I say this? If you already have your conclusions WHY ARE YOU IN THIS THREAD?

    You have already proven you cannot follow simple instruction - I point-blank asked you questions above which you again elected not to answer.

    If anything, you are providing an excellent example of how to drive a bunch of NF's nuts - just wax on and on and on about your problems, with no evidence of SELF-reflection whatsoever in your waxings, and expect to have everyone listen to your issues over and over again. And you mistakenly think all we want to hear are your conclusions and your reasonings behind them - we don't!

    Personally I want the facts, like this:

    I met her on the internet
    We corresponded for two years and I flew her to my country
    We hit it off and planned a life together in her country
    I sent her large sums of money over time to build a house and visited when I could
    Then, just as our house was to be completed, whammo, she cuts off communication
    I think she's had a terrible accident or worse, some terrible harm has befallen her
    I track down mutual friends (who are bilingual to both our languages) and discover she is fine
    But, she won't talk to me now!
    What can I do?
    ETC.

    If you can't lay it all out plain, the INFJ's in here will feel your INFJ has a BIG REASON to cut you out, because they know they wouldn't do it unless you were an agonizing prescence in her life. So, you're not going to change their minds about anything.

    OTHERWISE, she is just an unhealthy person and crazy people do what crazy people do. Maybe she planned to use you all along. Who can say?

    We are all interested and in here because we care, and just because we are wired to help you if we can. We have compassion for you. But the energy for that is not limitless. Unless you can get real and answer my questions, I shall have to bid you a fair "adieu" at this juncture.

  4. #374
    reborn Array PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    I feel like I have been hard on you and decided to re-read your posts with no typology in mind.

    I love her and I want to work things out with her...in some way.


    Does anyone have a suggestion as to how to proceed? I would like to fly there and go find her and talk with her but I'm very concerned about surprising someone, especially if they are in unhealthy state.
    If you have not done so already, it would seem prudent to do it only if you need to do so to initiate some sort of legal proceedings. I suspect she might call the police if you go to the house. What will be difficult is that she has the advantage of 5 months to spread whatever story to her friends that makes your disappearance most probable, and it might not be prudent to enter the conflict that head-on.

    I want to approach our common friends and let them know the story, and what has happened.
    Again, she has the 5 month head-start. Your absence may even confirm stories she has already shared. ("He left me, he cheated on me ...")

    Part of the reason I keep posting in this thread is to help others while also helping myself by seeking feedback.
    Well, you aren't going to help any INFJ's here, except that they get to have a view on your reactions being on the other side of a doorslam. But if this isn't about type, and it is about a woman and a man, it really does have the awful look of you being duped for money. I hear you trying to use type as a rationalization for her behaviour, and your attempt to try to understand this is indeed commendable, but when it reduces to the bottom line, she has really hurt you and done you an injustice.

    I hope any infj reading this understands what harm they do to themselves when door slamming others. It is very rarely a good idea.
    Again, you're not likely to convince anyone, but, I think most mature INFJ's don't do this without considering the deep ramifications of such a decision. I don't even think this is about type, the more I dig into it. It's about an unhealthy individual in general.

    I wanted to find a win/win solution. That isn't looking so hot. I am not insearch of sympathy or empathy. I want to live in my house. I want to restore my friendships and business relationships. I'm capable of forgiveness.
    Can anyone here think of a win / win? I am not seeing one, especially there isn't one if she did just take you for the money. Nothing you do is going to fix that, or fix your relationships or friendships. She may have already "poisoned the well" on those. The only hope is to try to get your money back at least. I trust you have sufficient documentation and the like for when you decide you must proceed?

    BUT - and this is a big BUT - if it is indeed an "unhealthy type" issue, do you have a TRUSTED mutual friend who could mediate as a peacemaker in this situation?

    BECAUSE ...

    But her info was soooo incorrect. Time went by and I would email her very loving positive supportive heartfelt emails....trying to get her to see her info was not correct. She sent me a couple of metaphoric forwards that made sense, that she was secretly falling apart and that I should have noticed it and made it better.
    What info did she base her decision on that was so incorrect? Did she think you were cheating on her? What was it that went so wrong?
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
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    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  5. #375
    reborn Array PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BalanceFind View Post
    No, I get it just fine.

    I have complete control over my emotions in this thread.

    Different people have responded in different ways to this thread. You don't speak for everyone.

    I've known her 9 years. She is a dual citizen of two countries. We met originally through work, friendship, brief dating, over a year.

    She was born elsewhere, moved to U.S. As teenager. She's lived in U.S. Entire adult life a few decades.

    We met in person. She's as American as anyone else here. She's also as native of her original country as anybody else there.

    We always kept in touch as friends only over the years. We both dated others. The entire time we lived in the same large U.S. City. Originally I chose not to pursue the relationship and we both moved on.

    We began dating in person every day several years ago in the U.S. She chose to relocate somewhere with better climate, a long time dream of hers. We both agreed to continue the relationship in two countries. This wasn't abnormal to us.
    Thanks for that. It gives a better perspective. Awaiting your thoughts on what I already posted.

    And naturally, I don't speak for everyone. I just want to understand better, so I can give you better answers, and maybe you can get better answers too from the INFJ perspective.
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  6. #376

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    She got in over her head with money. I refused to help her with any more large lump sums. She knew by looking at me that my words were on that were final. She was more consumed with making things work for her and only her, after, and only after she started to get in over her head with money.

    She bought land on her own, too quickly, without me. Previously our relationship was 50/50 with money. She was quite generous in day to day life, as was I, for many years.

    As I went back and forth between two countries, she stayed in one. Instead of waiting, renting, then carefully buying a place with some input, she bought land. Okay, no problem, a mistake, too impulsive. But fixable. Just tell the land developers of over a few hundred acres, an American couple, that you are selling and let's do everything to get that done right away. She stalled and stalled, embarrassed to tell anyone.

    Instead over time her focus was more on the next land/home/location in same country that would be a better fit. This part we did together, over time. Her money. I told her she needed to sell first property asap. She was getting too much money tied up into things reducing cash flow.

    She asked me to be on title of 2nd home. I was hesitant but I said okay. I knew that she was paying for it, and if she ran into money issues I could help the purchase. My name was on everything, paperwork, wire transfers, witnesses, you name it.

    She later did want, need and ask for money for the 2nd house. I paid a lot of money as did she, to complete purchase of home.

    She then wanted more money, as in large lump sum type money. I said no.

    She now could resolve issue by just handing over title to me of first property to sell. I prefer the 2nd home, but I was and am willing to just get out. But, she has not done this and has said I'll get my money when she can get it. And, that I can't live in that house. Obviously I won't let this happen.


    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    I feel like I have been hard on you and decided to re-read your posts with no typology in mind.







    If you have not done so already, it would seem prudent to do it only if you need to do so to initiate some sort of legal proceedings. I suspect she might call the police if you go to the house. What will be difficult is that she has the advantage of 5 months to spread whatever story to her friends that makes your disappearance most probable, and it might not be prudent to enter the conflict that head-on.



    Again, she has the 5 month head-start. Your absence may even confirm stories she has already shared. ("He left me, he cheated on me ...")



    Well, you aren't going to help any INFJ's here, except that they get to have a view on your reactions being on the other side of a doorslam. But if this isn't about type, and it is about a woman and a man, it really does have the awful look of you being duped for money. I hear you trying to use type as a rationalization for her behaviour, and your attempt to try to understand this is indeed commendable, but when it reduces to the bottom line, she has really hurt you and done you an injustice.



    Again, you're not likely to convince anyone, but, I think most mature INFJ's don't do this without considering the deep ramifications of such a decision. I don't even think this is about type, the more I dig into it. It's about an unhealthy individual in general.



    Can anyone here think of a win / win? I am not seeing one, especially there isn't one if she did just take you for the money. Nothing you do is going to fix that, or fix your relationships or friendships. She may have already "poisoned the well" on those. The only hope is to try to get your money back at least. I trust you have sufficient documentation and the like for when you decide you must proceed?

    BUT - and this is a big BUT - if it is indeed an "unhealthy type" issue, do you have a TRUSTED mutual friend who could mediate as a peacemaker in this situation?

    BECAUSE ...



    What info did she base her decision on that was so incorrect? Did she think you were cheating on her? What was it that went so wrong?

  7. #377

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    We had a very loving relationship. We did not fight. We did not argue. We were mutually supportive, mutually independent.

    However, things changed. Stress in her life, caused her to be too self indulgent, too impulsive with money. Now, small types of these things are normal. I'm talking going from normal to the inability to manage one's finances because one is delusionally self-entitled.

    Her door slam happened immediately after I cut off her money supply. That was the trigger. She was behaving like an addictive person in terms of addicted to her dream or self-indulgence. Not manic, but in a zone of self-indulgence that spun out of control. Then when reality begins, panic, cover up, etc...as opposed to facing mistakes like a mature adult.

    How did she get this stress? Long distance. Delays with new 2nd property completion which meant having to rough it elsewhere a bit. Watching friends be happy with simple pleasures and being envious and secretly competitive with them. This previously did not happen.

  8. #378
    reborn Array PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BalanceFind View Post
    She later did want, need and ask for money for the 2nd house. I paid a lot of money as did she, to complete purchase of home.

    She then wanted more money, as in large lump sum type money. I said no.
    Aside from the obvious, it being a lot of money, WHY did you say no?

    What were you thinking and feeling at that time?
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  9. #379

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    I said no because I didn't have the money to give.

    I was thinking and feeling that she surprised me in a negative way. Here I was the guy who just saved your butt, saved your dream, worked my butt off to do it, and she had the guts to ask me for a lot more. When she did it, it was on a long car ride, just us. I have a very good memory. She was excited, happy excited, but a nervous, jumpy kind. She is an even keeled infj. This is not normal except in situations of fun and silliness for her. She was great in those times. This was not one of those times.

    She asked "when" not if the next large sum of money was coming. The first large lump sum was more than she originally asked for. At last minute near a deadline she dropped bomb shell over email that it would be a little more than she initially thought. I...came...through...because that's who I am and that's what I do. If I give you my word, it's gold. Otherwise I will say no or I will say I'm not sure.

    I said, "What?" When she asked for it...and she repeated "when" not if....quickly replied, shortly replied that was it in terms of large lump sums any time soon. She pouted.

    There may have been a disconnect in terms of her thinking I was just saying no but really had plenty more to give. I was clear. But she was in a state of mind where facts didn't matter. All she heard was me not enhancing her dream. And all she cared about was how quickly she pay for this and that of expensive nice things for this new home.

    I thought she was ungrateful, self-absorbed, overly self-indulgent, the financial rules of life didn't apply to her, impatient, impulsive, selfish.

    What was I feeling? Shock, disappointment, anger, confused.

    But here's the thing. I was over it the second we got out of the car and spoke with our storage people. I don't carry those things. I would have gladly re-visited the topic and go back and forth and say, well, to remind you, I came through. I paid a lot. I don't have any more large lump sums right now to give, but I will in the future. These things have to be spaced out over time. Patience, control impulses. I know that's not what you wanted, but that's reality for now.

    Previously she was smart, "normal" and aware when her self-indulgences were getting a bit much. It's as if she turned a corner and poof deep end.

    That was early on my trip. First few days. My trip was a month. She held it against me the entire trip. Sometimes she let her guard down and behaved fine. Sometimes she would use that to punish me on the trip by witholding affection. In fact she became very angry when I became more and more independent on the trip. Example. She stopped cooking breakfast for me. We both cook. But she likes to cook me breakfast sometimes when we don't go out. My solution? I cooked us breakfast. It infuriated her. My responses every time were to just be nice and do the tasks she stopped doing. I waited for her to talk with me about anything that was bothering her. She never did. I asked her many times, she didn't like that, so I stopped asking. I walked on egg shells. But I didn't let it affect how I treated her or others, the entire time.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    Aside from the obvious, it being a lot of money, WHY did you say no?

    What were you thinking and feeling at that time?

  10. #380
    Diving into Ni-space Array Crescent Fresh's Avatar
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    First of all, I've been checking this thread and felt @BalanceFind seem not be able to move on and straighten out the legal matter as that seems to be on his first priority now.

    I somehow suspect what kind of relationship this really is. It seems to me that you're spoiling her with money even if you're not happy with her extravagant spendings. What confuses me further is that it seems one of the cornerstone of this relationship is all stemmed from financial support. I think you tried hard to explain the whole picture and the problems you've been facing, yet I still felt that some parts of puzzle is missing.

    And I suppose you have a hard time accepting the fact that she had doorslammed you after providing all supports for her. Though I'm suspicious of if this is a healthy relationship to begin with. Are you both attached before forming this relationship? Anyhow, if you want advice from INFJs, I think most of us had offered you, even though you seem not to accept it fully as more new background stories have been piling up.

    It's quite sad to see someone to go through in a denial out of resentment. Though I think if you really wonder why your relationships have failed, I would suggest you to invest some time of self-reflection through introspection on your mistakes from this doomed relationship. Perhaps it'll help you to avoid following the same pattern in ruining your next romance.

    On a side note, I felt you resemble more of an ENTP under stressed mode rather than ENFP. Also, I've learned a lot from reading ENP/INJ's POV that's derived from your dilemma.

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