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  1. #1231
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiltyred View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    question (to all):to what extent the unwavering nature of the doorslam relies on the belief you'd never have to face the person you doorslammed?

    Welll doorslam = make it go away forever, so ... I'd say the correlation between doorslam and believing you'll never have to face the person you doorslammed is about 100%.
    so what happens if that belief is taken away?

    or to rephrase: you have a set deadline after which circumstances change and you no longer have the capacity to keep the door shut.

    how do you react? how does "the doorslam game" change?

  2. #1232
    Senior Member Tiltyred's Avatar
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    I don't understand what you mean, could you elaborate? You're saying the person I doorslammed insinuates himself into my life despite my very firm expressed desire that he stay away from me?

  3. #1233
    Vulnerability Eilonwy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiltyred View Post
    I don't understand what you mean, could you elaborate? You're saying the person I doorslammed insinuates himself into my life despite my very firm expressed desire that he stay away from me?
    What if your co-worker was assigned to your area and you had no choice but to work with him?
    Johari / Nohari

    “That we are capable only of being what we are remains our unforgivable sin.” ― Gene Wolfe

    reminder to self: "That YOU that you are so proud of is a story woven together by your interpreter module to account for as much of your behavior as it can incorporate, and it denies or rationalizes the rest." "Who's in Charge? Free Will and the Science of the Brain" by Michael S. Gazzaniga

  4. #1234
    Vulnerability Eilonwy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    I'm struggling to find the love in here. It's he did this and she did that and I want this and I needy need that. What happened to, "ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country?"



    Okay, now back to our regularly scheduled programming...
    Johari / Nohari

    “That we are capable only of being what we are remains our unforgivable sin.” ― Gene Wolfe

    reminder to self: "That YOU that you are so proud of is a story woven together by your interpreter module to account for as much of your behavior as it can incorporate, and it denies or rationalizes the rest." "Who's in Charge? Free Will and the Science of the Brain" by Michael S. Gazzaniga

  5. #1235
    Senior Member Tiltyred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eilonwy View Post
    What if your co-worker was assigned to your area and you had no choice but to work with him?
    I would go to Personnel, explain the situation, and ask that either he or I be moved. If they did not comply, I would resort to legal action or find another job.

    I guess what troubles me here is the lack of understanding that No Means No. Someone else does not have the right to impose himself upon me. It's a very basic freedom, the freedom to decide who you will have a relationship with and who you will not; who you will let into your life and who you will maintain certain boundaries from. Whether you agree with the other person's reasoning or whether you have sympathy for their feelings or not, to go against a stated wish that you stay away equals violating the other person.

  6. #1236
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiltyred View Post
    I don't understand what you mean, could you elaborate? You're saying the person I doorslammed insinuates himself into my life despite my very firm expressed desire that he stay away from me?
    for whatever reason H&R decided they didn't side with you and:
    ...the girl next to you and him started dating and he now comes around a lot.
    ...or they are doing renovations and your two floors are shoved together.
    ...or they are cutting back his floor and he and he few remainings are moving to yours.
    ...or they decided they need both your expertise and your now on the same team.
    ...or the gnome monks of reconcilia have taken over the company...
    ...or most likely: he just decides to go on with his life regardless of it's overlap with yours.
    either way, your capacity to prevent him from going to your floor or talking to people sitting around you is no longer there.

    what happens? what do you do next?

  7. #1237

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    for whatever reason H&R decided they didn't side with you and:
    ...the girl next to you and him started dating and he now comes around a lot.
    ...or they are doing renovations and your two floors are shoved together.
    ...or they are cutting back his floor and he and he few remainings are moving to yours.
    ...or they decided they need both your expertise and your now on the same team.
    ...or the gnome monks of reconcilia have taken over the company...
    ...or most likely: he just decides to go on with his life regardless of it's overlap with yours.
    either way, your capacity to prevent him from going to your floor or talking to people sitting around you is no longer there.

    what happens? what do you do next?
    What does he do when he's around her?

  8. #1238
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    Quote Originally Posted by yeghor View Post
    What does he do when he's around her?
    dances the macarena? i can't quite say i know him that well.

    why: what is it that you think he should/shouldn't do?

  9. #1239
    Vulnerability Eilonwy's Avatar
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    Thing is, I don't think we're discussing whether no means no. It seems to me that that is a level up from what we're trying to figure out. What happens to get to the point of no means no? Could there be other ways of handling the situation so that we don't even have to get to no means no?

    In other thoughts:
    Looking at how I go about my life, but in particular, my relationships, I do see how I tend to try to control the outcome of things as much as possible, without always realizing it. I have a particular outcome in mind--mostly keeping things running smoothly--and I try to optimize for that. But in doing that, I'm unconsciously/subconsciously/consciously making other people into puppets in my play. I'm not giving them any real say because I'm always working towards the outcome I want--not wanting to deal with the messiness of real life, or real people. Not taking into consideration that others might enjoy dealing with the messiness.

    And before anyone starts with the "yeah, but's", I'm not saying that I shouldn't ever do things my way. Sometimes my way works pretty well.* It's just that when I'm not aware that I'm doing this, I'm not open to even CONSIDERING that there might be another way and that that way has just as much merit and validity as mine does. Also, I need to own the fact that I can be controlling in this way, so that if other people try to tell me that I'm doing something they consider controlling, I can at least see how that can be. Then, if I go ahead with doing it my way, it's my choice and not their fault.

    ETA: *And I find, that my way in CONJUNCTION with other ways, actually ends up working much better than my way alone.
    Johari / Nohari

    “That we are capable only of being what we are remains our unforgivable sin.” ― Gene Wolfe

    reminder to self: "That YOU that you are so proud of is a story woven together by your interpreter module to account for as much of your behavior as it can incorporate, and it denies or rationalizes the rest." "Who's in Charge? Free Will and the Science of the Brain" by Michael S. Gazzaniga

  10. #1240
    Senior Member Tiltyred's Avatar
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    Dances the macarena, hahaha
    I would pull in my power sources to see if they could prevail for me -- there are people here and there who might do me a favor.
    If every effort failed, then I would leave the firm. ETA: Or I might stay just long enough to file a suit against him just to make his life miserable. I'm generally not vengeful -- all I want is to be left alone -- but if I stayed, in those situations, and he continued to be an ass, I just might file a lawsuit to make his life miserable, cost him money and inconvenience, and bring things to his girlfriend's attention. For spite.

    And we are discussing No Means No. For things to get to the point of a doorslam, there have to have been failed negotiations along the way, things that could not be worked out, where one person had a hard limit and the other person either refused to or could not respect the hard limit, and talking broke down. OR the doorslammer was not capable for whatever reason of negotiating. Either way, if someone wants you out of their lives bad enough to doorslam, you don't want them back. For your own good. This is what I think.

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