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  1. #1
    "Everything in its place" fill's Avatar
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    Default ENFJs, why are you so fake?

    I know ENFJs have a want to please people, which in turn rewards them with appreciation, but is this a genuine system? I ask this because I think the other side involves plans or goals. With this in mind, couldn't they please people simply for the sake of their goal?

    So I think there's a variable that decides this all: whether the ultimate outcome of the goal is intended to help others or themselves.

    I feel I've dealt with both sides, but mostly the latter. I have a friend that will "help" you, but in the end it had nothing to do with friendship, but an underlying goal in which I have to "keep my end of the deal" and help out with. I think this also has to do with charisma and trying to uphold it in order to accomplish a goal.

    Am I talking about Hitler yet?
    "Poor bastard. Wait 'till he sees the bats. "
    enneagram - 7/5/3

  2. #2
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    I like your signature.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Ridiculous.

  4. #4
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    how is it more genuine to help other people so that you would get good feeling from it?
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

    Read

  5. #5
    "Everything in its place" fill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    how is it more genuine to help other people so that you would get good feeling from it?
    Did I say that? Like, without knowing it?

    Wait-- are we talking about Bono now?
    "Poor bastard. Wait 'till he sees the bats. "
    enneagram - 7/5/3

  6. #6
    mountain surfing nomadic's Avatar
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    I don't think its necessarily fakeness, just that once they know they have you, they get bored and want a challenge, and are observant of people and how they act when they have you in their "plan". like a kind deity, bemused by the way the ants are acting. somewhat childish when it comes to "they have you", but thats not necessarily fakeness for fakeness sake. just for amusement's sake. and yes, not necessarily for the goal's sake.

    the best way to deal with this is to bargain at each point until you feel equality.

  7. #7
    No moss growing on me Giggly's Avatar
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    lol are you an NT? Look just give it up, pal. Surrender. Wave the white flag. You can't fight the ENFJ charm.

  8. #8
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    I can fight the ENFJ charm.

  9. #9
    No moss growing on me Giggly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    I can fight the ENFJ charm.
    No, you can't. You can't. I must tell you this, it's for your own good. I'm trying to help you, young Jedi.

  10. #10
    Senior Member toast's Avatar
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    Not at all. This is wayyy off to me. ENFJs are manipulative, yes. We focus on & prioritize aspirations, yes. But those aspirations involve other people, they are usually still focused on others. I'm pretty sure most of us are completely aware of how we can push or subjugate & still have such an overbearing value system that we are constantly asking themselves "Is this really for me or for them?"

    To say there is some conscious or even subconscious "play" at work behind everything we do for other people is just focusing so narrowly. If I am aware of how manipulative I can be, and consistently scrutinizing myself for it, then taking steps to help without pushing... How can one say I am doing ALL of that for me? I'm pretty sure anyone who just follows their most base reactions can be seen as having a selfish agenda, but if there is one thing I am certain about with every ENFJ I've known its that we are highly critical of our motives with others. That is likely the reason we are so eaten up by criticism. Case in point.
    ____________________________________________
    "In my soul rages a battle without victor. Between faith without proof and reason without charm." - Sully Prudhomme

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