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  1. #91
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unkindloving View Post
    ENFJs may stereotypically focus away from themselves for 'the greater good' and all of that jazz, but it's doesn't have to hold true or be completely selfless.
    It's not because no one does anything without getting something out of it. Even if it looks selfless and the end result is someone's happiness, that makes them feel good. Does it really matter that they do? It's like if someone tells me they want to pray for me. It won't do anything for me but it makes you feel good and you're doing something productive so...knock yourself out.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  2. #92
    Senior Member Malkavia's Avatar
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    This is one of the best threads Ive read in a long time.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by fill View Post
    I know ENFJs have a want to please people, which in turn rewards them with appreciation, but is this a genuine system? I ask this because I think the other side involves plans or goals. With this in mind, couldn't they please people simply for the sake of their goal?

    So I think there's a variable that decides this all: whether the ultimate outcome of the goal is intended to help others or themselves.

    I feel I've dealt with both sides, but mostly the latter. I have a friend that will "help" you, but in the end it had nothing to do with friendship, but an underlying goal in which I have to "keep my end of the deal" and help out with. I think this also has to do with charisma and trying to uphold it in order to accomplish a goal.

    Am I talking about Hitler yet?
    It sounds like do unto others what you want them to do unto you? Isnt this what we are all taught. I think they may simply get beat down because they try to uphold this to such a high extent and dont get what they do returned.

    Fe is fake in the same sense that Te is fake. Te can be used to logically manipulate just as much as Fe can be used to emotionally manipulate.
    Im out, its been fun

  4. #94
    Senior Member nynesneg's Avatar
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    Talk about a negative thread title to get people riled up... lol...

    I'm not fake. I don't care what you say. I have my own plans just like anybody else, but have intimate real connections with friends that aren't for my benefit in any way shape or form.

    Other ENFJs? Sure maybe the ones you know are. They should grow up.

    3w2


    Those who are content being normal lack the depth and passion to rise above mediocracy.
    To push beyond their natural abilities and create a reality from their dreams.

  5. #95
    Senior Member JHBowden's Avatar
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    I don't think ENFJs are fake, in so much as they don't see the point in argument and confrontation.

    My mother is an ENFJ, and reminds me of Lois Griffin from the Family Guy. I could tell her, "I joined the Klan, and we're going to burn some crosses, bomb some synagogues, and assassinate President Obama." She'd be like, "That's nice. Hey, do you want some cookies?"


  6. #96
    Nips away your dignity Fluffywolf's Avatar
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    ENFJ's aren't fake, they are just honestly confused. So easily dealt with, that it's cute and harmless.
    ~Self-depricating Megalomaniacal Superwolf

  7. #97
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Isn't it time to start bashing Te or Ti for a change?
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





    "Harm none, do as ye will”

  8. #98
    "Everything in its place" fill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    Isn't it time to start bashing Te or Ti for a change?
    Of course! I think we should all start bashing each other's attributes, one by one. I'm totally into that.



    See that? It's me eating popcorn! My words were intended to by sarcastic! Just like the words in the title of this thread!
    "Poor bastard. Wait 'till he sees the bats. "
    enneagram - 7/5/3

  9. #99
    That's my name biotch! JoSunshine's Avatar
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    I do agree with some of the posts that say the payoff for doing something good for others is feeling good about having helped another...I think this is kind of unavoidable and human. For me the questions are: Am I helping this person achieve what s/he wants for him/herself or am I helping him/her achieve what I think they should want. AND Am I doing this for the appreciation/attention or is that simply a by-product of a good deed.

    What I mean by that, is I will help a person achieve their goals if they want my help (writing a resume, talking out a problem, whatever). I DON'T under any circumstances try to manipulate people into to doing what I want them to do under the guise of "helping" them and then expect them to worship me for it...which I think is pretty common among unhealthy Extroverted Feelers (particularly of the Judging type). When I see people asserting their will on others and then complaining about the lack of appreciation they have received, I am always perplexed and disgusted to be honest. It's not really giving if the end result is all about achieving your own goal, now is it? I know an ENFJ and an ESFJ who both do this, but I don't think ALL ENFJs or ESFJs are like this...some of us genuinely care about people.

    I would say that "fake" is something I am definitely not. One of my closest friend is an ISTP and she said that when we first met she thought I was fake...becuase why would someone who hardly knows her be so friendly and nice to her...she said overtime she realized it was becuase I was genuinely a nice, friendly person...imagine that! Now we have one of the best friendships I have ever had the pleasure of being in

    There are some interesting articles out there on egocentric giving (which is basically what this thread is about) versus altruistic giving...I am sure that people of all types can be guilty of either.
    "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. " - Dr. Seuss
    I can't spell...get over it

    Slightly ENFJ, totally JoSunshine
    Extroverted (E) 52.5%........Introverted (I) 47.5%
    Intuitive (N) 65.63%..........Sensing (S) 34.38%
    Feeling (F) 55.56%............Thinking (T) 44.44%
    Judging (J) 51.43%............Perceiving (P) 48.57%

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by nomadic View Post
    I don't think its necessarily fakeness, just that once they know they have you, they get bored and want a challenge, and are observant of people and how they act when they have you in their "plan". like a kind deity, bemused by the way the ants are acting. somewhat childish when it comes to "they have you", but thats not necessarily fakeness for fakeness sake..
    agree. you constantly have to play that hard to get role with enfjs.

    they waste their time and end up confused because they want what they cant have

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