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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by wren View Post
    i'm not sure there is any trap other than our need for fulfillment. there is no fi-si or ti-ni trap or tertiary shadow bullshit. that is pretty much unsubstantial. for me i get hooked on a notion that something is right for me and i spin my wheels trying to determine how to get there, knowing the whole time it's all in my imagination. i have perfect control of where i'm headed in this world of mine and i Choose where i go, not some function that Leads me there. i know full well what is good for me and yet i still persist in ways that are not, that is not a cognitive function in command, it's me.
    your funny. have you ever tried to figure out why you want to get where your going?

    I choose what I do, not where I go. The mysterious and great J/P divide.
    Im out, its been fun

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    infps who go into Fi Si can't get out of the past. they're trapped in the past, the world is invisible and they cannot merge and get new information. they are an alien creature inhabiting a future world that never comes (makes me think of he nick drake documentary "a stranger among us"). their values that help them understand how the world as a whole and how themselves as a whole fit together, get fucked up/corrupted and there's no way to bring them together again (so it seems). with Si the judgments of Fi just get rehearsed and practiced and recited over and over again with no ability to unstick them, unsettle them, create a bit more play or potential movement or room to breathe. the ability to change perspectives goes away bc Si combs out all possibilities, instead deciding to focus on the attributes that reinforce the feeling rather than those that show its limitations and incompletenesses. (think jack kerouac).
    Great post. I agree strongly with your description. I agree that while Fi is busy trying to come up with an answer, Si is busy eliminating potential answers that may allow us to break from the loop. Interesting!

    Also, your ISFP description rings true with my observations.

    Quote Originally Posted by poki View Post
    For Fi-Si would you say this is a loop in regards to someone elses logic that doesnt feel right? You go in circles about how certain parts feel and then just get stuck in that loop?
    I don't think it's logic as much as motives. Questions like, "Why did they do that?" or "How could they do that?" Unable to come up with an answer, my thoughts hit the next most comfortable alternative, which is to relive the situation in my head. Which in turn, makes me ask, "How could they do that?".

    Quote Originally Posted by wren View Post
    i'm not sure there is any trap other than our need for fulfillment. there is no fi-si or ti-ni trap or tertiary shadow bullshit. that is pretty much unsubstantial. for me i get hooked on a notion that something is right for me and i spin my wheels trying to determine how to get there, knowing the whole time it's all in my imagination. i have perfect control of where i'm headed in this world of mine and i Choose where i go, not some function that Leads me there. i know full well what is good for me and yet i still persist in ways that are not, that is not a cognitive function in command, it's me.
    I'm trying to use the functions to solidify something that, in actuality, is far more fluid. I sort of assume that everyone that made it this far understands that functions try to describe thought processes, and that they don't control them.

    Quote Originally Posted by speculative View Post
    Also, the INFP in a Fi/Si loop will really be thrown through a loop while Ne is getting "up to speed." In this role, at first it seems to accelerate the loop, because it searches for possibilities and at this point the INFP is searching for possibilities that reinforce the loop, not break it. I think that some other function has to step in to join with Ne in order to break the loop therefore, but I'm not sure what that function would be. This is just a theory I have, but it seems to be how it works or me as I first attempt to break the Fi/Si loop and my thoughts and feelings expand the loop trying to push beyond it.
    One thing to keep an eye out for is that Ne serves Fi, not Si. Ne that tries to verify Si doesn't help, as everything it generates is full of self-confirming bias to the past. Which leads to ideas that grow stale.

    The true step forward is to ensure Ne looks to the future, and not the past.

  3. #33
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    *casts Resurrection spell*

    I found an interesting way to break the loop: Short circuit it with affirmations.

    Advantages:
    Easy to do.
    Seems to work.

    Disadvantages:
    Cheesy as all-get-out.
    Not as satisfying as Deus-Ex-Ne.
    Requires some brute force.

    The idea is simple enough, though. You just repeat a thought that counters the loop. Generally, elements of the loop ARE affirmations. Sad event X damaged my ability to be at peace with who I am. or I don't understand what is going on!

    This idea uses the fact that the mind can only really focus on 1 thought at a time - especially the subconscious mind. Sometimes simply replacing one of the negative repetitious statements with a more positive (or constructive) one, and forcing yourself to repeat it, will cause the loop to lose momentum.

    I doubt all loops can be fixed this way, but I've had some success with this. I figured I would share just in case someone else may find value in it...

  4. #34
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    I like that. As I've been thinking about things, it's occurred to me that it is not removing something negative (whether a thought, habit, feeling, influence, bad friend etc), but rather crowding it out and replacing it with something better that breaks the power of it.

  5. #35
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    So, I'm appearantly an INFP, but my Ni and Si is highest. Appearantly my cognitive tests shows that I'm an INFJ > ISFJ, not an INFP. I'm always on a loop, the one you've mentioned. But my Fi is rock bottom next to Se; having zero effect.

  6. #36
    Senior Member Rebe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by angell_m View Post
    So, I'm appearantly an INFP, but my Ni and Si is highest. Appearantly my cognitive tests shows that I'm an INFJ > ISFJ, not an INFP. I'm always on a loop, the one you've mentioned. But my Fi is rock bottom next to Se; having zero effect.
    I can see you as INFJ over ISFJ, yup.

    I also have high Ni and I thought I was INFJ at one point. I have very high Fi, Ne and Ni but as result, my Si, Te and Se sucks. Yes, I am actually currently stuck in Fi-Si loop. My plan to get myself out of this mindset is actually to physically remove myself and do something new and daring and practice my Te, Ne, Se and Fi. It's sort of a crazy plan but I feel that I need to yank myself out, otherwise I can't move forward. Does that make sense? I need drastic action.

  7. #37
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    Me, the "INFP".

    introverted Intuiting (Ni) ******************************************* (43.3) excellent use
    introverted Sensing (Si) **************************************** (40.9) excellent use
    introverted Thinking (Ti) ********************************** (34.6) good use
    extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ******************************* (31.4) good use
    extraverted Feeling (Fe) ****************************** (30.2) good use
    introverted Feeling (Fi) ************************** (26.4) average use
    extraverted Thinking (Te) ************************ (24) limited use
    extraverted Sensing (Se) ********* (9.6) unused

  8. #38
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    I have another thought on breaking the loop.

    I don't know about other INFPs, but all of my loops can be summed up with a single word that both sums up the essence of the loop as well as acts as a trigger. Something like tired or misery.

    When the trigger word pops into my mind, if I replace it with a new word that counters the trigger, it creates a sort of cognitive dissoncance that stops the loop in its tracks. Tired...resting or misery.... mission.

    Sometimes it even triggers a healthy Fi-Si loop. Instead of focusing on how tired I am, I begin planning ways to get more rest.

  9. #39
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Thanks so much for posting this stuff as you think of it. It has sparked a lot of thought of my own about getting out of my loops as well as how to best help friends who are stuck in theirs.

  10. #40
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    Nolla talked a bit on how the INFP Fi-Si loop can be a healthy thing.

    When I find that one of my most basic, fundamental assumptions about something are wrong, it's the Fi-Si loop that comes in and begins laying the new, healthier ground work. (Like the stuff I shared in my blog recently.) The brain creates and strengthens neural pathways through repetition of thought and action.

    The Fi-Si loop is the very mechanism that allows me to be my values, if you will. It is because I am able to contemplate a topic through so thoroughly and reptitiously that something like a personal value can affect every aspect of who I am.

    The Fi-Si loop is quite possibly the foundation for one of the INFP's most important strengths. Learning how to wield it is critical, because it's not about stopping the Fi-Si loop, but choosing what loops are worth allowing myself to process.

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