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  1. #41
    "Everything in its place" fill's Avatar
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    I think the problem may be that you want to be as "real" as you can with others, which, in your case possibly, takes place by being first real with yourself. Sounds to me like you may see yourself as so imperfect that the closest thing to combatting it is "realizing" it.

    Honestly. I mean- I used to share these thoughts. But- I found out: I have potential. Everyone has potential. Nothing's useless. I see so many succeed. I got by without doing much. If I put just a little more effort or, hell, a lot more effort into doing things... hey, I could be great.
    "Poor bastard. Wait 'till he sees the bats. "
    enneagram - 7/5/3

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by bronson View Post
    Also, taking 2 examples of the INFJ's i know with this kind of 'goal motivation' encouragement...
    They're both really great writers.
    One knows she is and writing is her release.
    The other is also a great writer but she's always so down on herself about it -like 'this is terrible, not as good as yours' etc...
    And its a load of rubbish. She's great... and I know she enjoys it, its just this inferiority complex thats stopping her.

    In that example, how do you change that mindset?
    Thats just one random example.
    I tell her its great and I that I'm really impressed. I dunno how to make her believe that she's really good, you know?

    Anyway, thats just a random, off track, practical example, not general to all.

    INFJ's what speaks loudest to you?
    Do words of encouragement fall on the floor? It doens't often seem like they're taken to heart. Kind of like 'you're just saying that coz you have to.'
    These issues seem really complex and personal
    Genuine words of encouragement motivate me a little. If I can tell my best friend really likes my work...if i know i'm gonna show him another bit, it sometimes does motivate me to work a little bit harder.

    While this failure to self-actualize brings despair to a lot of ppl, infjs are probably more aware of this which just makes it worse. Especially, as others have said, since infjs often have unrealistic expectations...even with enough motivation, you can't be something that is impossible to achieve

  3. #43
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    Oh yeah, one other thing: i know where i want to be but i just have the final picture - no steps in between of how to get there. Which i think is one of the issues in my motivation...not knowing where to start so not starting at all. Dunno about other infjs though

  4. #44
    Senior Member Kyrielle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bronson View Post
    Every INFJ I know seems to have consistently low opinions of themselves.

    Bad body image (even if they're attractive physically!), a lack of faith in their abilities, and even sometimes just this general melancholic, self-loathing.

    Maybe I've just met a bunch with particularly low self-esteem.


    Is this generally applicable to INFJ's?

    Other than the useless "its not true", how can this be combatted?



    Sometimes I just get so frustrated by it; it just seems so debilitating in terms of reaching their full potential.
    I don't know. I know I've always had a low sense of self-worth and have (and still do) strugged with low self-esteem and self-confidence.

    I don't know why I'm this way, I just am. I've always erred on the side of over-humility, always underestimated what I am worth, and underestimated my own abilities. The result is low self-confidence and self-esteem (though my self-esteem is markedly higher than it once was, but self-confidence is still lagging behind). It's a very long process of learning exactly how confident I really need to be and learning what my worth for other people really is.

    Might also be worth noting that my judgements of many things in life and reality also err on the side of caution. I am not, and probably never will be, reckless or ambitious.

    And yes, I also don't have a very flattering body image. I know this is likely because how attractive I am doesn't really matter to me, so when someone tells me I'm attractive, I enjoy the compliment, but I don't exactly understand how I am attractive. I have a hard time showing my physical self off, when doing so would give me a greater advantage. Though, I am improving very slowly with this.

    As for words of encouragement, sometimes they work, sometimes they don't.

    For example, with writing and artwork,

    If I see someone looking at work I've created, and their faces clearly show that they are enjoying what they see/read, then I feel much better about the work itself. Telling me what you like and don't like about the work also helps. It shows you're at least analyzing what you see and aren't just making up nice things to say.
    "I took the one less traveled by,
    And that has made all the difference."

    Robert Frost

  5. #45
    Member Goodewitch's Avatar
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    An INFJ without a goal or dream is a very sad sight indeed.

    When I am goaless, drifting in ennui, its very easy to become depressed and down on myself. I see myself as a waste of space on the planet,.. and useless to the world or others.. but heres the thing.. I somehow am comfortable in my low self esteem, because its either this listless aimless wandering, which in its own way feels less pressured, or its striving to complete a goal.
    I've decided that its okay to be cynical, I've decided its okay to be 'just here' and doing nothing to earn Brownie points for heaven.
    I will never praise myself, or feel competent, but I have taken the pressure from myself to be the perfectonist that I know I am deep down.
    To the OP, I'd say, every INFJ that seems down on themselves that you've met, is probably , in some way, taking a rather uncomfortable break from being 'perfect'..(or at least, trying to be)
    G. x

  6. #46
    Member bronson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vince View Post
    I don't think it's necessarily inferiority that makes her so hard on herself, but more our perfectionism.
    Rest assure that she heard that you're impressed with her writing. I tend to shrug off compliments as well, but internally they stick. Knowing that INFJs constantly work on themselves, I think many of us don't easily accept credit as that would be a sign of laziness or contentment. Essentially that might just be what makes us exceptionally good at certain things to begin with.
    Man, that is good to know!

    Quote Originally Posted by Edasich View Post
    Genuine words of encouragement motivate me a little. If I can tell my best friend really likes my work...if i know i'm gonna show him another bit, it sometimes does motivate me to work a little bit harder.
    While this failure to self-actualize brings despair to a lot of ppl, infjs are probably more aware of this which just makes it worse. Especially, as others have said, since infjs often have unrealistic expectations...even with enough motivation, you can't be something that is impossible to achieve
    Also good to know... I think I am getting something here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goodewitch View Post
    To the OP, I'd say, every INFJ that seems down on themselves that you've met, is probably , in some way, taking a rather uncomfortable break from being 'perfect'..(or at least, trying to be)
    So the goals are high (perfection), yet they motivate... so its difficult, but worth it... but the overall difficulty can encourage a feeling of self-insufficiency or something?

  7. #47
    Member Goodewitch's Avatar
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    Bronson,..
    The goals are high, perfection, for ourselves and ultimately, the expresson of our ideals is to be useful.
    We can feel overwhelmed by others needs, yet without a 'job' to do, or someone to help out, i think most INFj's suffer a little self doubt and introspction of the 'what am i here for?' kind.

    Some lyrics here from Radioheads 'Creep' sum it up for me personally.
    I dont care if it hurts
    I wanna have control
    I want a perfect body,
    I want a perfect soul.

    Thats the ideal, the control is not control of others, but over oneself.
    Its a tall order, and one that can seem impossible, its easy for some INFJ's to be overwhelmed with their own self expectations.
    Plus, we're just a bit Emo kid ish at times too.
    You seem like you're really trying to help out your INFJ's.. and thats lovely of you..
    Tell you what Bronson.. heres a way to motivate them... tell them you need a bit help with something.. could be any little thing you know they have an aptitude for.
    You'll see them heave themselves up out of their introspection to help.
    Yup, just give em something to do.

    G. x

  8. #48
    Senior Member ubiquitous1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goodewitch View Post
    Yup, just give em something to do.

    G. x
    Good advice!

  9. #49
    Badoom~ Skyward's Avatar
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    Plus, we're just a bit Emo kid ish at times too.
    Not to mention we're self conscious about it. We're self conscious about EVERYTHING. It makes it worse since, for me at least, I don't accurately know what people actually notice, so I assume they notice everything. Especially the bad, since I notice the bad more than the good. (Another thing I beat myself up for, idealism hurts, I wouldn't mind some ESxP realism)
    'Imperfection is beauty, madness is genius and its better to be absolutely ridiculous than absolutely boring.' - Marilyn Monroe

    This is who I am, escapist, paradise-seeker.
    -Nightwish

    Anthropology Major out of Hamline University. St. Paul, Minnesota.

  10. #50
    Member bronson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyward View Post
    Not to mention we're self conscious about it. We're self conscious about EVERYTHING.
    This is the point of my thread, right?

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