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  1. #11
    Head Pigeon Mad Hatter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    I have weird self-imposed restrictions, such as not to overuse the same word. Instead, I overuse the thesaurus . I also try and vary sentence structure. I see writing almost visually, and each component is an element that needs to balance something else. It can't feel too repetitive so that it is redundant, but it also needs some repetition in phrasing to help tie it all together.
    Same here Everything, even formal writing, has to have at least some aesthetic quality

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    For formal papers, outlines do help me organize my thoughts and cut out tangent material (which is a big trap for me). Editing is probably the biggest issue for me - I tend to add for clarity, not cut.
    If you want to make your point, make it short.
    It applies more to writing than to speaking. In writing, you can always re-read a passage, in speaking an elaboration or a repetition can sometimes help to make your point.
    Papers are always an enormous struggle in that respect. I'm always seeing connections which I find interesting to think about, but not really relevant to the subject (same applies for reading - I sometimes get lost in irrelevant literature).
    I'm always amazed when people tell me that they were about to hand in their paper but it was "much too long." I literally struggle with every page and am usually at the lower limit.

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    I don't usually write in sequence. Even if I attempt to, I tend to jump to different parts, so when I am done getting my thoughts out, I have to go back and arrange it into a more linear format. I don't literally cut and paste paper, but I cut and paste on my computer. Once I get it in order, I go through and make sure there are connecting sentences.

    When I was younger and my ISFJ mom would review my work for me, and that was always her complaint: "You jump from one thought to another without clearly connecting them". My mind makes the connection, it fills in blanks, so I naturally assume other people would do the same. I've realized in observing other writing that you have to spell it out for people, and now I can do that well when necessary.
    To me, connections, moreover structure, are paramount when it comes to writing. Structuring usually takes up to 40% of my 'writing' time (as a guess). Though I have almost always received positive feedbacks for my structure, I find that to be the hardest part.

    It takes a lot of effort to arrange my thoughts in a sequential pattern because, frankly, my mind doesn't work that way (as opposed to language) - I think of a lot of stuff rather simultaneously, and that's rather messy. The bad thing is: I'm often afraid that some brilliant thought I have simply vanishes from the screen. More than once I felt the urge to immediately rush to my desk or take a note to put down the inspiration I just had. That can happen anytime, even when I'm doing something completely different at the moment.

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    When I write by hand, I tend to write a "rough draft" first, and then I re-write it in order. Even when I write thank you cards or something like that, I usually do a trial run on plain paper first.
    Writing something by hand is a piece of advice I'd like to give to everyone (though of course it helps some people more than others). It will help you to spot redundancies, unclear passages, sentence fragments etc. much more easily. Also, you can always jot down important thought on a foolscap whenever you have them without losing track of the 'big picture'. A slight drawback is that it's a bit slow (again, my fear of forgetting something important before I've written it down). That's why shorthand comes in handy sometimes.

  2. #12
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    as iNtuitives i think when we explore the connections in our mind the problem we are asking ourselves, especially as nfs, is often highly vague and indeterminate. ambiguity is our middle name. yet, when we stumble upon an area or a relationship/metaphor that helps answer this fuzzy question, we know, feel the epiphany, and rush to write it down. but we forget the question we were addressing far too easily, due to the tangential nature of the anti-linear HOLISM of Fness.

    i like learning how to linear write from nts. entp and intj specifically help me in learning how to write. intps and istps help create a clarity and an evidencing that is excellent but they are far more Ti rigorous than i could/can ever be (causality is NOT my forte). my intelligence is in perception (as an infj Ni dom). intjs help define the objectives, working backwards like in a symbol logic or geometry (proofing) class, creating goals and sub-goals to get to where you need to go. this is ENORMOUSLY helpful for me.

    i find the idea that one just formulates thought internally and then spews it all out suggestive of a lack of attention and probably a lack of clarity. intps would probably be the best at this overall, but not taking notes and organizing information, not expanding yourself beyond your mind and using representations and constructs to create mappings, seems counterproductive (and anti-intp). sketching improves articulation, i find. altho, for, say, enfjs, i could see that their highest cognitive center would be an oratorical kind of spoken rhetoric more so than a linear logical development. in that case, the sort of internal discourse that happens, and embodiment of voices and speakers internally would make sense as a viable method of composition. more of an emulation of a discourse practice for synthesis, but with actual faces.

    fidelia, as far as what you say, i just think we need as much information as possible in front of us. we need to get close up and wander thru our ideas, trying out vague relationships and eventually pulling them thru a specific thread, a tautness emerges. like the ambiguity of emily dickinson, that comes into focus as she adds another layer going in a very different direction. and then kind of an ironic capper that still leaves much open room. but she's all slanty-eyed mystic when she's looking at the world.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Wild horses's Avatar
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    Ok so if for example I am writing an article I write as though I am chatting to my computer about the subject... usually something I feel passionate about (Interesting as I know that ENFPs gain inspiration and learn via verbal communication... maybe a reason why I adopt that particualr style) I have to then revisit it a few times before it makes any readable sense... (Something I should consider doing with my posts here I guess HAHAHA) I find that if I chat about anything long enough I will get inspiration and so I don't find that I suffer writers block by doing it that way... sometimes have used a dictaphone but I hate transcribing as it is soooo boring and so it usually kills my buzz for the project
    ... couldn't drag me away

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  4. #14
    man-made neptunesnet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    infp: i've noticed the infps who have learned how to work their strengths to write, especially when working on something that requires more linearity than they would necessary like, do best at writing it all out, printing it, and then literally taking scissors to cut and paste it into a coherent direction. the seeing the whole spatially and then re-composing is crucial.
    I really wish you'd stop reading my mind.
    ...It's getting creepy.

    infj: as an infj, i have to free-write to explore all of the loose ends and strands of ideas in my head. my skill is in recognizing implications more so than in creating focused arguments. i need to allow my perceptions to wander in order to make the most of my Ni perceptual intelligence, and i need to think of emotional objectives by writing TO someone in order to maximize my voice, i need to rely on those kind of stylistics to create a sense of integrity and consistency throughout the work. which doesn't work in specific forms (formal) writing nearly as well. the free-write process helps me immensely, as does constant outlining and creating maps for thinking in different layers, seeing it all at once perceptually, and attempting to get as much encoded in easy-to-perceive representations so that i can take in as much info when i synthesize as possible.
    I do most of this as an INFP.


    EDIT: Plus everything OrangeAppled said, which is no surprise.

  5. #15

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    In my head I tend to simulate actually doing things without doing them and correct the parts that don't feel right. A lot of the time I'll just let my thoughts flow and correct things on the fly or reread and correct things after I've written them. With art and anything that is a system, my mind just seems to jump around and fill in parts. Like in computer class I wrote 1000 lines of code with it all in modules and linked by just following my nose and tying up loose ends. This method can be dangerous though, because sometimes if I stop and come back a week later I don't find the train of thought again. Also I don't have a set approach for anything, which is probably the most confusing thing about ENFPs. Part of the approach to things is inventing the approach, and it doesn't seem to depend on anything standard, just what feels like the best way to approach it given what it is.
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  6. #16
    Reptilian Snuggletron's Avatar
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    This whole thread is a tl;dr already. I'll explain briefly:

    - ideas shoot around my head all day like a free-for-all firefight involving a ton of soldiers running around with drum mag AA-12s, MGs, and RPGs
    - Get home, eat my din din, then I get on my laptop
    - if I'm writing, I open notepad and write an outline
    - if I'm drawing, I plug in my tablet and open photoshop
    - end result could equal a finished creative work or I could get bored and leave

  7. #17
    Member bronson's Avatar
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    For me it begins with loose, disconnected ideas flying around in my head.

    Then my mind does that thing I love where I begin tying them altogether in various exciting ways - if its for a school paper it tends to be in very organised manner, if for my own leisure or my own purposes it can be a little more wild and exciting, i.e. writing fiction.


    For me, I then head into this kind of feverish state in which I write and write... and I hate to stop or be interrupted, and I can sit for hours at a time refining my ideas through language.

    Its wonderful.

    I hate drafting, because I feel like what I write in that state is the prime stuff and adjusting it seems so dry and boring - but it can be beneficial I know.

  8. #18
    the Dark Prophet of Kualu
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    When I was younger and my ISFJ mom would review my work for me, and that was always her complaint: "You jump from one thought to another without clearly connecting them". My mind makes the connection, it fills in blanks, so I naturally assume other people would do the same. I've realized in observing other writing that you have to spell it out for people, and now I can do that well when necessary.
    I can relate to that. My mother told me to write as if a nine year old would recieve it and understand it. It works fairly well.

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  9. #19
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    When I write it very much starts in my head, I start musing about what I want to write about. I make connections between the topic assigned and things I either already know about or topics that interest me that I can connect somehow to the assignment. This way I learn something new, but in a context that is expanding my present knowledge of a current interest, or branching out in a new direction on a familiar topic.

    This is easy for me because I write constantly in my free time in the form of journaling, blogging, creative writing, or on-line discussions. So there are always ideas I'm exploring one or two of which I generally can tie back to the assignment. I tend to think of my store of knowledge as a thousand small things that I tie together with threads. I may not be an expert at any one topic, but I have all of these ideas that I can explore a way to tie to something new or challenging. This is Ne, I'm sure. Ne also helps me to bullshit my way through parts of papers when I don't like the subject matter or can't think of anything else germain to say.

    I tend to sit down and write and write, and then go back and edit sentences for better word choice, structure, and tone. When I seem to be "finished" in writing a paper I'll go back and tweak little parts of it until I'm happy with not only the content, but the form and presentation.

    I fucking hate doing internal citation, though.

    I've never tried literally cutting essays with scissors and pasting them together. However, I have taken paragraphs and sentences from old journals or papers and transformed them into something new or different.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adoamros View Post
    This whole thread is a tl;dr already. I'll explain briefly:

    - ideas shoot around my head all day like a free-for-all firefight involving a ton of soldiers running around with drum mag AA-12s, MGs, and RPGs
    - Get home, eat my din din, then I get on my laptop
    - if I'm writing, I open notepad and write an outline
    - if I'm drawing, I plug in my tablet and open photoshop
    - end result could equal a finished creative work or I could get bored and leave
    You make a very good point here. I can't always write. I will get up and walk away, or just do something else if nothing is coming to me. There is nothing productive about that. In fact, sometimes something will come to me if I'm walking around, listening to music, or whatever.

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